To wield or not to wield

[IH8MUD]

All is good and well  with cooperating IF/WHEN when they do only take the phone, cash, bike, car, flatscreen or whatever. 

 

So on the bicycle , if it is only myself, I cooperate.

 

Perhaps, of topic, but if my family is threatened, and harm to them is imminent, there will be no surrender, even if I go with.

 

It can go so many ways . . .    

Edited August 4, 2015 by IH8MUD

[V12man]

I carry one of these. They fit perfectly into your bicycle pump mount or I just velco it to my top tube for easy access. extendable-training-baton.jpg

As one of those few who have had a knife in the chest from a bike hijacking - this is F...all use when it is on your bike... you will be lucky if you get to use it at all:

 

1 - you will almost certainly be surprised by the attack (why would they let you know they are planning it? and there are many bushes and trees to hide behind.

2 - you will almost certainly be separated from your bike in the crash they create, or you will be grabbed by more than 1 person and restrained (and in my case stabbed immediately)

 

NOW - explain to me how you plan to get that device off your bike with a thug or two hanging on and a knife in his hand?

 

If it's not ON your person and securely attatched to you so it does not go awol in a crash, then its almost certainly not useful at all - better to just vacate the area asap if possible (toss valuables behind you so they don't feel the need to chase) and be able to use it to defend yourself in the event of a secondary attack later.

[canadonis]

Something to keep in mind when trying to stop a deadly attack with a can of pepper spray/batton/tazer. Dont get me wrong, all of them are better that asking nicely to stop raping you, but I prefer something a bit more convincing. I am also not advocating to fight back and shoot every time, there are also countless times where surrendering kept people alive, but there are also countless times it got them killed, and I would like the option. As for people that thing all guys who carry firearms are "cowboys" or trying to be rambo, please keep your uneducated opinion to yourself, when the **** hits the fan you will be the first one looking at me for help because you will be at the mercy of your attackers.

So in short, yes I do carry a firearm with me when out cycling or running but I would prefer not too. It is secured in a proper holster with a proper gun belt, out of sight.

 

hi

 

i hear your argument and agree with your sentiments..the reality is the legal system does not allow for us to take any action unless we are in immediate danger...yes there have been circumstances in which ppl have the time to react but most times the instinctive response has been one of flight. i too am a proudly South African gun owner and have been on many survival training courses so optomise my skills with my Glock 19..most of the hijackings occur when the cyclists was surprized and attacked unlike running where your hands are free cycling requires both hands firmly on the bars and unless u are given the opportunity to bring the bike to a complete stop then lift the cycling top to access your firearm by that time u would have injured...unlike us cyclists these F@ck heads are armed, in groups and use the element of surprize against us by hiding in bushes and jumping out at the very last second.

 

Lets put this in the context of the law..i had a home invasion, i heard a noise and when i investigated these cowards saw me they ran away, despite having a firarm and them being in my home i could not do a thing..the items stolen was about 20k, insurance paid out 20k no loss to me really..had i adopted the rambo approach..the police confirmed that had i shot any of them while fleeing id be held for attempted murder..legal fees would have been eye watering amounts..so in this scenario not using a weapon was best for me..

 

Before i jump to any conclusions, please let me understand your modus operandi if you were to be surprized by a group of knife/panga wielding individuals on a deserted trail..what would you reaction time be.. 

[droenn]

So not only do I have watch out for dudes trying to mug me, but also a bunch of cowboys on bikes..

Edited August 4, 2015 by droenn

[CdT85]

As one of those few who have had a knife in the chest from a bike hijacking - this is F...all use when it is on your bike... you will be lucky if you get to use it at all:

 

1 - you will almost certainly be surprised by the attack (why would they let you know they are planning it? and there are many bushes and trees to hide behind.

2 - you will almost certainly be separated from your bike in the crash they create, or you will be grabbed by more than 1 person and restrained (and in my case stabbed immediately)

 

NOW - explain to me how you plan to get that device off your bike with a thug or two hanging on and a knife in his hand?

 

If it's not ON your person and securely attatched to you so it does not go awol in a crash, then its almost certainly not useful at all - better to just vacate the area asap if possible (toss valuables behind you so they don't feel the need to chase) and be able to use it to defend yourself in the event of a secondary attack later.

 

On the two occasion I had to use it, I was glad that I had it. I try to be on the lookout for dodgy people wherever I ride, and I always go up a single track from the bottom to the top to asses the track for booby traps rather than just bombing down the hill. (Only had to hit a a tree trunk strategically placed over a single track once to adopt this mentality)

More of a deterent againt the phony brave.

 

What it comes down to is assesing the threat. If you can get to it in time, chances are you will be able to defend yourself against a single knife weilding attacker, a hard blow to the forearm or kneecap usually stop the person from being able to walk or weild a knife.

 

I cycle alone 99% of the time and I used this twice, with great success against two miscrients trying to steal my el cheapo 26'er in "The Laan" and in Eden in Stellenbosch.

 

But in the end, it is only material posessions covered by overpriced insurance premiums. If I dont think I have a chance, I will hand over my posesions and just claim from my insurance and live to tell the story over a beer with mates.

[Eddy Gordo]

I carry one of these. They fit perfectly into your bicycle pump mount or I just velco it to my top tube for easy access. extendable-training-baton.jpg

I had one of these. Solid piece of steel, but the joints are weak. I used it once and it came apart

[dirtypot]

So to summarize:

 

Get mugged and surrender and we'll all be seen as easy targets and crime will increase.

Get mugged and fight back, and they'll start using more force when taking our things.

 

Sounds like a lose lose situation to me.

 

PS - Bloukraans sounds like a gangster... 

[popcorn_skollie]

So to summarize:

 

Get mugged and surrender and we'll all be seen as easy targets and crime will increase.

Get mugged and fight back, and they'll start using more force when taking our things.

 

Sounds like a lose lose situation to me.

 

PS - Bloukraans sounds like a gangster... 

He's also not the only one that can sabella

[dirtypot]

This place is full of gangsters 

[GlockG4]

hi

 

i hear your argument and agree with your sentiments..the reality is the legal system does not allow for us to take any action unless we are in immediate danger...yes there have been circumstances in which ppl have the time to react but most times the instinctive response has been one of flight. i too am a proudly South African gun owner and have been on many survival training courses so optomise my skills with my Glock 19..most of the hijackings occur when the cyclists was surprized and attacked unlike running where your hands are free cycling requires both hands firmly on the bars and unless u are given the opportunity to bring the bike to a complete stop then lift the cycling top to access your firearm by that time u would have injured...unlike us cyclists these F@ck heads are armed, in groups and use the element of surprize against us by hiding in bushes and jumping out at the very last second.

 

Lets put this in the context of the law..i had a home invasion, i heard a noise and when i investigated these cowards saw me they ran away, despite having a firarm and them being in my home i could not do a thing..the items stolen was about 20k, insurance paid out 20k no loss to me really..had i adopted the rambo approach..the police confirmed that had i shot any of them while fleeing id be held for attempted murder..legal fees would have been eye watering amounts..so in this scenario not using a weapon was best for me..

 

Before i jump to any conclusions, please let me understand your modus operandi if you were to be surprized by a group of knife/panga wielding individuals on a deserted trail..what would you reaction time be..

You mention that the legal system does not allow you to take lethal action unless you are in immediate danger. This is only partly true. You have to RESONABLY think that your own or anyone near you could be killed if you do not react with deadly force, be it a firearm, knife, pipe or your fists.

 

You mention that the attacks will be a surprise. I agree totally that it will most likely be a surprise, but vigilance is key to minimise that risk. When you are caught by surprise, and take a tumble, sure they might jump you immediately and you might be injured, but being injured does not take you out of the fight. The human body and mind is a lot tougher that you think. Remember there is a difference between getting surprised and handing over your belongings and being in a fight for your life when they pushed you off the bike and started stabing or what ever.

 

With regards to your home invation, firstly glad to hear that you and your family are ok. When you are confronted by a burglar in your own home, the law does not expect you to flee your home or give up. It is reasonable to think that they are there to hurt you and your family. You mentioned that they ran as soon as they saw you, this will most definitely now always be the case, and who is to say they were not running towards your child's room to use her has a hostage?

Remember you only have to RESONABLY think their/your life is in danger. You will most probably have to defend your reasoning, so do not defend your plasma tv with deadly force, you will most probably go to jail, and I do not believe personally that the burglar deserves to die because he stole something from me. Also remember that a policeman is not the law, and he most probably knows less about it that you.

 

When I am confronted while on my bike, I would HOPEFULLY realise that there is an unlawful attack on my person and would draw my firearm and defend myself. When someone jumps infront of me like in the infamous gopro video, I would look to escape or I will use my firearm. When I am surprised and pushed off my bike on a downhill I would not get up and engage them, I would let them take my bike and leave, however when I am lying in the floor and he stabs me or hacks me with his panga he will be shot. Like I said, being stabed or shot or what ever does not necessarily mean you are out of the fight.

 

My approach to this is the following: I have a firearm, I am well trained in using it, I made sure I know the law regarding my firearm and when I am allowed to use it. I truly hope that I do not have to use it, but I am more that prepared to do so if need be. That need is defined by the protection of my or my loved ones' life, NOT the protection of my property. Now I am not willing to bet on the nice attacker's humanity to just take my bike and leave me unharmed.

[GlockG4]

This place is full of gangsters

So you better watch out!!!

[Milosh]

No firearm and won't ride with one

 

But am considering a TIPX paintball handgun with pepper balls

 

This will get you killed !!

 

Pull a paintball and it looks like a real firearm , shoot someone with it and they are hurt but not enough to stop them shooting you with a real firearm and live rounds hurt more than paint balls

[Bloukrans]

This place is full of gangsters 

Eish, gangsters on 29'ers!

[popcorn_skollie]

yous are all a klom niners

[Smurfy]

I haven't really felt the need to be armed in anyway, riding alone or in a group. But with the way things are going a firearm may not be a bad thing... And I am in the process of getting mine, test done, Glock purchased so now just to find a way to carry it on the bike with easy access.

Should fit into your back pocket easily. Glocks are quite compact. Remember to always carry id licence with you. When riding in groups try and ride at the back. it is easier to react to trouble ahead. Gone are the days of enjoying the view. Now we ride to spot the BASTARDS. Safe cycling. A little tip, practise shooting with both hands incase you hurt your trigger finger.

[jimmycool]

Just need to figure out how to mount one of these to my bike. I don't think the extra weight will be too much of a disadvantage.

 

http://www.theblaze.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/11/RockRanchPumpkinCannon.jpg