Short distances catching long distance riders in mtb races!!!

[jamiepenfold3]

I am a junior and I regularly compete in mtb races thoughout South Africa. Being a junior, by law I may only enter races under 55km in distance. This means that most times I end up racing in the 'half marathon' distance. The Half marathon usually starts  5 minutes after the last batch in the long distance, thus us 'racing snakes' catch the back markers of the long distance 60km race. We are racing and thus need to get past as quick as possible this isnt always easy when there is alot of single track. We always try to get past in the most respectful way possible, despite this we often get shouted and and/or swore at . So I am suggesting that the order in which mtb races should start should be as follows:

 

Elite men (long route)

Elite women (long route)

Junior men (short route)

junior women (short route)

batch B (long route)

batch C (long route)

Batch D (long route)

Batch B (Short route)

Batch C (short route)

Batch D (short route)

 

what do you think?

[Hellgate]

Wholeheartedly agree Jamie ????

[Mamil]

Yes it's a good idea.

 

I am pretty sure I've been overtaken by you Jamie and you were polite to a fault!!

[dev null]

Good idea Jamie.

 

My son currently races in the Junior category (U/17), and this is also his main complaint, and since he is very shy and an extreme introvert, he would only ask for track after sitting behind slow people and seeing that they have no intention of moving over, and in the process lose lots of time.

 

It has now gone to a point where he don't bother to race some of the bigger races hard.

[wazriley]

Jamie the fedhealth today was a prime example . If they had followed your suggested starting order things would have been a whole lot smoother. Super frustrating out there waiting for back markers to walk up switchbacks etc etc

[Oufy MTB (Roadie)]

Agree Jamie, you guys are racing. I would hate to hold you up

[stringbean]

It's also an ego thing.There are far too many people in general doing the long rides that shouldn't be there.

I believe similar to marathon running you should reach a certain standard before you are allowed to enter the long routes.

You should at least be able to complete the shorter distance in a certain time or average speed BEFORE you are allowed to move up to the longer distances.

This will eliminate people entering long redes that are already walking at the 5 km mark.

[LeoKnight]

Also sure they have passed me in the past. I always try to get out of the way as soon as possible, and never heard a bad comment from them.

[Shebeen]

Agreed, assuming the long/short have the same opening 5/10km which is usually the case as a split so early is too confusing.

 

I'd be happy for the okes that fast to be in the front group too

[dev null]

It's also an ego thing.There are far too many people in general doing the long rides that shouldn't be there.

I believe similar to marathon running you should reach a certain standard before you are allowed to enter the long routes.

You should at least be able to complete the shorter distance in a certain time or average speed BEFORE you are allowed to move up to the longer distances.

This will eliminate people entering long redes that are already walking at the 5 km mark.

 

Will also make things a lot easier for the sweeps. Maybe they won't have such long days out on the trails.

[Skubarra]

I think I was also caught by Jamie today   (And I wasn't even a backmarker!)

 

Man you were flying...

 

But to answer your question, yes it is the perpetual problem..

 

The one issue is that organisers have to start the long route riders as early as possible because these okes are out there for the longest part of the day & the other is seeding which is rarely close to perfect. I started in B today, caught a whole lot of A riders and were even caught by a few C & D riders.

 

The only real solution would be to have seperate routes for most of the course, like they did at Tiletoria Elgin, but that is also not always practical.

 

At least it is an issue that would solve itself once you migrate to the longer routes    (except then the short distance riders will hold you up again near the end)

[ians H2Sport]

You are going to come across 'those' people your whole life; whether in business, on your bike, on holiday, driving in traffic etc etc. Just keep being the better person.

Race organizers do have a big challenge in trying to avoid this type of congestion, it is not always possible to keep the different races away from each other.

[Face Plant]

Jamiepenfold3 you have risen a very important topic that has been a problem for as long as there has been races with more than one distance. Your suggestion is a good one however the solution is a little bit more complex. Unfortunately the race routes ultimately determine what the solution is meaning that the race organizer needs to apply his mind as to what the best solution would be to avoid this problem from occurring. examples that we have used in the past is even starting the short distance before the longer distances or starting the shorter race a half hour after the longer race.

 

The route is critical to the solution as you have to consider how soon into the race there is single track, you have to consider where the possible passing points are etc. This problem is not only unique to shorter distances but applies to batched riders being caught up behind slower riders from batches in front of them on single tracks which personally is one of the most frustrating things that can happen in a race.

 

The other problem that happens a lot is that the front riders of the longer distances catch the back markers of the shorter distance just before the end of the race which potentially could have a bigger impact on the race than the shorter distance catching back markers at the start of a race.

 

Ultimately the solution lies with the event organizer. If they don't do their homework this problem will always be there. I also just need to mention that no matter how much homework you do, sometimes these things just don't work out that's where common sense should come into play.

 

I have heard of a lot of complaints from riders being sworn at by young race snakes trying to pass so again it is the race organizers responsibility to highlight at race briefing that there is a possibility of riders being pasted so be courteous to each other, keep left, pass right and let people know you are passing or want to pass and then obviously the slower riders need to understand that the youngsters are racing for position and need to track as soon as it is safe to do so. these are things that SHOULD be mentioned at race briefing - no excuse not to!

 

Moridin ~ maybe a solution for your son is getting him a bell, you get awesome little bells that are small and weigh just about nothing, from my experience they are very effective for letting people know you are approaching from behind instead of shouting TRACK which sometimes startle riders.

[Allrounder]

My suggestion would be not to sell 10 000 000 entries. I know there is someone who wants to make money. but less bikes on a single track would be more fun, and safer if you will. 

[Oufy MTB (Roadie)]

I ride a bell and I find it works well to alert riders when coming up. In some races where the long routes join the shorter routes I have encountered a lot of slowbees, but luckily often it is on jeep track so overtaking is by far simpler. Unless there are different routes, there are always going to be issues, especially if there are loads of single track. I do my best to allow faster riders pass on single track, but sometimes it is just impossible. Even in a sophisticated sport like F1, the top drivers are held up by back markers

[Neverfit]

I am a junior and I regularly compete in mtb races thoughout South Africa. Being a junior, by law I may only enter races under 55km in distance. This means that most times I end up racing in the 'half marathon' distance. The Half marathon usually starts  5 minutes after the last batch in the long distance, thus us 'racing snakes' catch the back markers of the long distance 60km race. We are racing and thus need to get past as quick as possible this isnt always easy when there is alot of single track. We always try to get past in the most respectful way possible, despite this we often get shouted and and/or swore at . So I am suggesting that the order in which mtb races should start should be as follows:

 

Elite men (long route)

Elite women (long route)

Junior men (short route)

junior women (short route)

batch B (long route)

batch C (long route)

Batch D (long route)

Batch B (Short route)

Batch C (short route)

Batch D (short route)

 

what do you think?

I don't know you, and sure as hell won't ever be able to race with you...but I must start by giving you kudos for the attitude with which you address this concern. That in itself says a lot.

As Face Plant said,  organizers have their hands full with trying to find the best solution. But I would like to use your proposal for 1 event.

Starting the racing snakes 5 min before the long men's event, is also an option - if you are in A batch, odds are the A batch men wont catch you..

All of these options will pose new and different challenges, but changing nothing, nothing will change.

I would like to hear the actual event organizers opinions and input.