Frosty Posted February 6, 2018 Share 4w/kg over a 105km ride is very different from what the guy referes to in the post. An FTP test is conducted in 20 minutes. I am pretty sure that 4w/kg over a period of 3 hours is only found at the highest levels amongst top pros.thanks - makes sense when I read the post again. Silly me [emoji16] Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bleedToWin Posted February 8, 2018 Share Went through my Argus history now (because honestly it's the only sub3 I really care about) and it made for some interesting reading. Lined up at the start - 15Done on MTB - 2Cancelled - 1Shortened - 1Crashed but finished - 1Windy, not cancelled - 2Just missed sub3 - 4Not fit enough - 2Actual sub3 - 2 So I have been a serious rider and fit enough on the day to do a sub3 Argus on 11 / 15 attempts, but have actually managed to do so only twice!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sitting@89 Posted February 13, 2018 Share From a recent article in the BA in flight magazine, I see Donovan van Gelder says you need an FTP of 4w/kg to do a sub 3 hour Argus. Looking at some of my earlier training files, that seems more or less right. Sent from my iPhone using TapatalkI read your post a couple of days ago and the wheels in my head started turning (now let me just straight of the bat say, in no way am I trying to discredit DVG but...) 4w/kg seemed when I first read it high so I started digging a little deeper and asked one of my mates who is a self confessed numbers/metrics junkie and had done 5 sub 3 CTCT what he thought about that number, his reply, ludicrous it will be according to him more in the vicinity of 3-3.2 his highest ever on an FTP 3.8 This lead to me asking another 3 guys about the idea and the all dismissed it of the bat, one of them even going as far as saying that the reason GVD would say that in an article is shameless self promotion to an uninformed or misunderstanding crowd. So to summarise what I have gathered, somewhere between 3.2-3.5 is plenty enough to finish CTCT sub 3 Some okes will say almost anything to try and lure gullible suckers into paying them to help them go faster (not my words) You will have to train hard (and pretty consistently) eat fairly clean and a sub 3 CTCT should be within your grasp Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jcza Posted February 13, 2018 Share FTP 3.8 - 4.0 w/kgNP 3.3 - 3.5 w/kgAve 2.6 - 2.8 w/kg (misleading I know due to variables) Important is first 20 mins to make sure you're still with the bunch as you hit the M3 so you can recover. Stay upright, watch all the obstacles through town and make sure you're in position for Smitswinkel. Stay with the bunch and there's more recovery and free speed. Get to top of Chappies and you should know if you're going to make it. Over before you know it.......don't forget to look around and appreciate the views. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spinnekop Posted February 13, 2018 Share FTP 3.8 - 4.0 w/kgNP 3.3 - 3.5 w/kgAve 2.6 - 2.8 w/kg (misleading I know due to variables) Important is first 20 mins to make sure you're still with the bunch as you hit the M3 so you can recover. Stay upright, watch all the obstacles through town and make sure you're in position for Smitswinkel. Stay with the bunch and there's more recovery and free speed. Get to top of Chappies and you should know if you're going to make it. Over before you know it.......don't forget to look around and appreciate the views. This. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
devocean Posted February 13, 2018 Share My very unscientific theory - if you can average 31km/h for a 100km ride in fair weather on your own then I think you're fit enough to stick with a bunch at an average of 37km/h needed for a sub 3 argus. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Man with no name Posted February 13, 2018 Share 4w/kg over a 105km ride is very different from what the guy referes to in the post. An FTP test is conducted in 20 minutes. I am pretty sure that 4w/kg over a period of 3 hours is only found at the highest levels amongst top pros.Exactly. FTP is a one hour measure. Having the benefit of many years of data, my agreement with the 4/kg figure comes from looking where I was in years when I went <3 You still need corresponding vo2 and 30 sec power to match the better bunches on Edinburgh drive An ftp of 4/kg is closer to 3.2/kg for the entire race, which again correspond to my np for any of my sub 3 Argus’ Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Man with no name Posted February 13, 2018 Share I read your post a couple of days ago and the wheels in my head started turning (now let me just straight of the bat say, in no way am I trying to discredit DVG but...) 4w/kg seemed when I first read it high so I started digging a little deeper and asked one of my mates who is a self confessed numbers/metrics junkie and had done 5 sub 3 CTCT what he thought about that number, his reply, ludicrous it will be according to him more in the vicinity of 3-3.2 his highest ever on an FTP 3.8 This lead to me asking another 3 guys about the idea and the all dismissed it of the bat, one of them even going as far as saying that the reason GVD would say that in an article is shameless self promotion to an uninformed or misunderstanding crowd. So to summarise what I have gathered, somewhere between 3.2-3.5 is plenty enough to finish CTCT sub 3 Some okes will say almost anything to try and lure gullible suckers into paying them to help them go faster (not my words) You will have to train hard (and pretty consistently) eat fairly clean and a sub 3 CTCT should be within your graspPersonally I have not made the <3hr cut at 3.2 to 3.5, but please remember this differs from person to person Here is some TP excerpts for reference Weight 79 kgs, ftp 317 watts (if memory serves). I must admit I did not have the muscular endurance required and struggle up Suikerbossie. Again, another factor to consider Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frosty Posted February 13, 2018 Share Exactly. FTP is a one hour measure. Having the benefit of many years of data, my agreement with the 4/kg figure comes from looking where I was in years when I went <3 You still need corresponding vo2 and 30 sec power to match the better bunches on Edinburgh drive An ftp of 4/kg is closer to 3.2/kg for the entire race, which again correspond to my np for any of my sub 3 Argus’ Sent from my iPhone using TapatalkThat's how I mis-read your initial post... thinking 4W/Kg for the entire race rather than about 3.5W/Kg. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Breezer Posted February 13, 2018 Share My very unscientific theory - if you can average 31km/h for a 100km ride in fair weather on your own then I think you're fit enough to stick with a bunch at an average of 37km/h needed for a sub 3 argus.Exactly my theory. If i train on my own, this is my goal. If i get a 32 average on my usual training route i know a Argus sub 3 is on the table. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jcza Posted February 14, 2018 Share Personally I have not made the <3hr cut at 3.2 to 3.5, but please remember this differs from person to person Here is some TP excerpts for reference Weight 79 kgs, ftp 317 watts (if memory serves). I must admit I did not have the muscular endurance required and struggle up Suikerbossie. Again, another factor to consider Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk But your numbers show the following: FTP - 4 w/kgNP - 3.3 w/kg Time 2:57 Or am I missing something? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Man with no name Posted February 14, 2018 Share But your numbers show the following: FTP - 4 w/kgNP - 3.3 w/kg Time 2:57 Or am I missing something?To clarify, by 3.2 to 3.5 I mean FTP not NP. NP will be <3 Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jcza Posted February 14, 2018 Share To clarify, by 3.2 to 3.5 I mean FTP not NP. NP will be <3 Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk AHA thanks for clarifying. Can't see anyone go sub 3 at 3.2 - 3.5 FTP unless they're on a e-bike. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Man with no name Posted February 14, 2018 Share AHA thanks for clarifying. Can't see anyone go sub 3 at 3.2 - 3.5 FTP unless they're on a e-bike.Agree! Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skubarra Posted February 14, 2018 Share Don't know about this power stuff, can't imagine I have impressive numbers. For me Sub-3 is all about chilling in the bunch on the flat sections, getting in the right position before Smits/Chappies & Suikerbos and then climb as if your life depends on it and then finally after those climbs switch off your brain & keep up with the bunch on the descents at crazy speeds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arendoog Posted February 14, 2018 Share My very unscientific theory - if you can average 31km/h for a 100km ride in fair weather on your own then I think you're fit enough to stick with a bunch at an average of 37km/h needed for a sub 3 argus.Bunch riding helps a lot ,but even in a bunch averaging 37km/h is really hard work Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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