For the aviation fans

[Bonus]

Boeing found debris from manufacturing in stored 737 Max jets, a problem that has plagued the company on a different plane

 

https://www.businessinsider.in/business/news/boeing-found-debris-from-manufacturing-in-stored-737-max-jets-a-problem-that-has-plagued-the-company-on-a-different-plane/articleshow/74200296.cms

 

 

After watching the video that someone posted on here explaining the history of Boeing, it seems that while they were pretty much the only big player in town, they did things properly, but as soon as they had to "compete" they started to cut corners left, right and center. 

 

Like with any process,once you start down that path you are always going to have it revisit you.

[MrJacques]

After watching the video that someone posted on here explaining the history of Boeing, it seems that while they were pretty much the only big player in town, they did things properly, but as soon as they had to "compete" they started to cut corners left, right and center. 

 

Like with any process,once you start down that path you are always going to have it revisit you.

 

Cutting corners happens with software development as well. A project deadline approaches and hacks are made to get it out on time. More often than not those hacks are never redone properly because there is always something else that needs to be done.

 

Boeing is going to need to revise their whole process.

[eddy]

After watching the video that someone posted on here explaining the history of Boeing, it seems that while they were pretty much the only big player in town, they did things properly, but as soon as they had to "compete" they started to cut corners left, right and center.

 

 

Ironically, it was the other way round.

 

When Boeing had competition in the form of McDonnal-Douglas they built great planes. Boeing then bought M-D as the latter had big defence contracts and in a twist of corporate fate, the M-D executives started running the enlarged business - no longer as the Boeing engineers did, but as the Wall street MBA equipped accountants they were.

 

Shareholder returns became the driving force rather than engineering excellence..

 

 

 

.

Edited February 19, 2020 by eddy

[Robbie Stewart]

Cutting corners happens with software development as well. A project deadline approaches and hacks are made to get it out on time. More often than not those hacks are never redone properly because there is always something else that needs to be done.

 

Boeing is going to need to revise their whole process.

 

THIS ^^^     aaaarrrrrgghhhhh

[MrJacques]

https://www.heraldlive.co.za/news/2020-02-19-mayday-at-31000ft-revealed-in-investigators-flysafair-report/

[Lotus]

https://www.heraldlive.co.za/news/2020-02-19-mayday-at-31000ft-revealed-in-investigators-flysafair-report/

Damn!

 

"The failure of the pressure seal was most likely attributed to manhandling of the door during cargo/baggage handling,"

 

Highly trained crews and aircraft technicians, and then a baggage handler is (potentially) the weakest link.

[Long Wheel Base]

The airline also gave new instructions to its baggage-handling company about how the cargo doors should be closed and about ensuring cargo nets in the hold were correctly fitted and secured.

 

Part of the technicians final walk around includes checking all doors are closed properly. 

Edited February 19, 2020 by Long Wheel Base

[Long Wheel Base]

As a result of the incident, FlySafair inspected cargo door pressure seals on all its aircraft, implemented a system of daily and weekly inspections, and decided to replace the seals regularly.

 

So they were not already doing this??? We do a general visual inspection after every flight and a detailed visual inspection at every weekly check on these door seals.

[PhilipV]

Rescue in Du Toits kloof on the weekend apparently, SAAF and AMS both involved.

https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=2580559688829817&id=1427847750767689

 

 

https://youtu.be/0vNfz7cS5CQ

[SwissVan]

Boeing found debris from manufacturing in stored 737 Max jets, a problem that has plagued the company on a different plane

 

https://www.businessinsider.in/business/news/boeing-found-debris-from-manufacturing-in-stored-737-max-jets-a-problem-that-has-plagued-the-company-on-a-different-plane/articleshow/74200296.cms

FOD inside fuel tanks...Not uncommon

 

I would love to know what they found, if it was some significant or relatively minor.

[Bonus]

FOD inside fuel tanks...Not uncommon

 

I would love to know what they found, if it was some significant or relatively minor.

 

 

Foreign Object Debris can generally include rags, tools and spare parts apparently! 

[Long Wheel Base]

Foreign Object Debris can generally include rags, tools and spare parts apparently! 

Yeah anything Foreign. But like Swiss said, fuel tanks can accumulate dirt etc from the bowser/tanks it gets kept in prior to being pumped into the aircraft. There are filters that sort that out BUT a rag is a serious problem, or swarf from drilling. Even silicone that covers the grommets or electrical plugs is not too serious but they serious part about that is what is exposed or what was the silicone protecting. We do a regulatory course on Fuel Tank Safety, it covers all this sort of thing.

[SwissVan]

Yeah anything Foreign. But like Swiss said, fuel tanks can accumulate dirt etc from the bowser/tanks it gets kept in prior to being pumped into the aircraft. There are filters that sort that out BUT a rag is a serious problem, or swarf from drilling. Even silicone that covers the grommets or electrical plugs is not too serious but they serious part about that is what is exposed or what was the silicone protecting. We do a regulatory course on Fuel Tank Safety, it covers all this sort of thing.

On the 737 how big are the tanks, are they big enough for someone to get in?

 

I have on occasion found things like screw drivers in fuel tanks but that’s on small pisscats that I worked on where you can only put your arm inside.... so it’s easy to forget something and not notice it (took check jaaaa... i know), so i can imagine in those big tanks the potential to leave something more interesting ( large ) inside

Edited February 20, 2020 by SwissVan

[Long Wheel Base]

On the 737 how big are the tanks, are they big enough for someone to get in?

 

I have on occasion found things like screw drivers in fuel tanks but that’s on small pisscats that I worked on where you can only put your arm inside.... so it’s easy to forget something and not notice it (took check jaaaa... i know), so i can imagine in those big tanks the potential to leave something more interesting ( large ) inside

No not really big enough to get in. On B737 I have only worked on wing tanks and not the centre tank. I have worked on a B747 centre tank and that is massive, you can get in, walk around, stand up. The B737 wing tank you can basically climb in and lie down but your feet hang out. I have worked in a A340 wing tank and that is similar, climb in, lie down and you can get your feet in but luckily the work I had to do meant I went in waist height.

In my working on the line days, I fueled hundreds of B737-800. Will never forget the limits. Wing tanks take 3900 kg each and the centre tank takes 13 000 kg so a total of 20800kg. Only once did I get asked to fill it up to max and I got 20850kg in it. Flip I was so scared some fuel would spill out. Even as it taxiied off I was watching those fuel vents. Not that I could do much about it after push back.

[Bonus]

I was looking for a picture of the Boeing 747 centre tank to show the size but couldn't find a decent one. Then you posted this.

 

Compared to the 737, the 747 has a swimming pool inside it.

[Bateleur1]

I was looking for a picture of the Boeing 747 centre tank to show the size but couldn't find a decent one. Then you posted this.

 

Compared to the 737, the 747 has a swimming pool inside it.

 

Our house in SA had a small poos (roughly 3 x 7 meters) which held about 30 000 litres of water.  A 747 can take up to about 180 000 litres so that would be 6 times my pool so you might want to correct your statement that the 747 has a pretty large swimming pool in it.