where is good stretch of road for 20min FTP test ?

[Jbr]

it depends how you train most of the time. I used to do all my workouts on the trainer including FTP tests and it was fine.

 

Then I started doing all my workouts on steep hills, today I wouldn't be able to match my old numbers on the flat or on the trainer, I've actually started doing a bit more training on the flat again because I was struggling a bit at high speeds at the crit races. I'm nowhere on zwift at the moment, but I'm sure it's gonna come back quick during winter.

 

I think it's important to mix things up. But you should do your FTP test in the conditions you do your workouts most of the time.

Edited April 14, 2021 by Jbr

[Fat Boab]

 

I'm intrigued and confused...what would make a hill physiologically easier for you (lower %hr) when generating the same %FTP?

 

Are you saying that one would get differing values of FTP on the flat vs a hill for instance? If so, why would that be? Any thoughts? Or have I the wrong end of the stick?

 

 

Absolutely this.

 

So if i do a trainer road workout outside and say its 5X12 min at 95% ftp - say i find a section of flat road and decide to start the interval, to maintain 95% ftp im at 95% hr, i do same interval on a climb and my hr is at 70%. If the workout is V02 related i make sure all intervals are done on a flat road to lift the hr and absolutely put myself in the hurtlocker.

 

If its a more torque type lower cadence workout then i will find a decent gradient climb and probably do repeats.

[Opc_danny]

So on a flat road i would have to increase cadence and be in a much higher aerobic state to generate those amount of watts (Watts are watts yes) however you can generate 300watts at 65 cadence or 105 cadence pretty similar to a car, you can cruise at 120 in 6th gear lower rpm or sit in 4th gear at a much higher rpm.

 

Now what would make the hill harder is doing that interval at say 130% of ftp then yes hr will increase but once again get over that hill onto a flat and see how your body reacts trying to hold 130% of your ftp.

 

 

I'm intrigued and confused...what would make a hill physiologically easier for you (lower %hr) when generating the same %FTP?

Are you saying that one would get differing values of FTP on the flat vs a hill for instance? If so, why would that be? Any thoughts? Or have I the wrong end of the stick?

 

[bleedToWin]

I'm intrigued and confused...what would make a hill physiologically easier for you (lower %hr) when generating the same %FTP?

 

Are you saying that one would get differing values of FTP on the flat vs a hill for instance? If so, why would that be? Any thoughts? Or have I the wrong end of the stick?

 

 

I think body position also plays into it, along with the torque and rpm considerations mentioned above.

It's well known that TT power is lower due to position, but look at HR and you can see these okes are going full gas. I suspect you are able to generate a considerable amount of force through pulling on your handlebars when going up sufficient gradients and sitting upright.

Edited April 14, 2021 by bleedToWin

[josleroux]

A bit far away, but Franschhoek pass is long enough and has a steady incline. 

[bleedToWin]

A bit far away, but Franschhoek pass is long enough and has a steady incline. 

 

Long enough, unless you are part of the 1% of folks that can do W/kg in the low to mid 5s, then you will run out of hill... 

Edited April 14, 2021 by bleedToWin

[EddieV]

There seems to be two schools of thought here:

1-doing a 20 min up a hill

2-doing a 20min on rolling/flat roads

 

For 2, the section from Misty cliffs to cape point is prime

For 1, the last set of traffic lights in camps bay to suikerbossie top would just about work

 

I’d be careful of basing zones or more so a training peaks program off the data off the 1st results

 

+1

 

Start at Cape Point gate, turn around at/before Red Hill, and then back to the gate again.

[DieselnDust]

it depends how you train most of the time. I used to do all my workouts on the trainer including FTP tests and it was fine.

 

Then I started doing all my workouts on steep hills, today I wouldn't be able to match my old numbers on the flat or on the trainer, I've actually started doing a bit more training on the flat again because I was struggling a bit at high speeds at the crit races. I'm nowhere on zwift at the moment, but I'm sure it's gonna come back quick during winter.

 

I think it's important to mix things up. But you should do your FTP test in the conditions you do your workouts most of the time.

 

How a workout is conducted is important. Many people think that a threshold workout at 90rpm and at 60rpm are the same but they're not. Each trains the body into a differnt "ability" profile i.e. All orunder vs TT specialist vs climber. dedicated sprinters almost alsways focus on 15-20sec power out to 2min power and lack 15min, 20min, 30min power that TT specialists, or climbers or all rounders have. 

 

This is why a 20min@95% power test isn't as effective as say a full1 hr TT or a ramp test or even intervals.icu, XERT or other similar apps. 

 

I haven't bothered with the mindless drill of a 20min test for almost 2 years. ramp Tests give you a much better idea of what your power profile looks like or just use one of the apps mentioned and go ride your bike hard for an hour and a some change

 

 

 

There seems to be two schools of thought here:

1-doing a 20 min up a hill

2-doing a 20min on rolling/flat roads

 

For 2, the section from Misty cliffs to cape point is prime

For 1, the last set of traffic lights in camps bay to suikerbossie top would just about work

 

I’d be careful of basing zones or more so a training peaks program off the data off the 1st results

 

 

There's a few more schools of thought

Edited April 14, 2021 by DieselnDust

[Fat Boab]

 

Ta muchly. More to this power mularky than meets the eye! One day, when I'm big perhaps...

 

 

So on a flat road i would have to increase cadence and be in a much higher aerobic state to generate those amount of watts (Watts are watts yes) however you can generate 300watts at 65 cadence or 105 cadence pretty similar to a car, you can cruise at 120 in 6th gear lower rpm or sit in 4th gear at a much higher rpm.

 

Now what would make the hill harder is doing that interval at say 130% of ftp then yes hr will increase but once again get over that hill onto a flat and see how your body reacts trying to hold 130% of your ftp.

[FootballingCyclist]

+1

 

Start at Cape Point gate, 

too much of a downhill to put out constant power before turning.. But as stated above, Starting somewhere near misty cliffs and heading towards the gate is a good option.

 

I also believe if you want to get a true indicator of your Ftp, Your build up to the day needs to be correct and your warm up on the day. I don't believe you'll get a true indication of your Ftp if your legs are perhaps too fresh or too fatigued, Also not if you going to cycle say an hour or so to the point where you're going to conduct your Ftp..

Edited April 14, 2021 by FootballingCyclist

[FootballingCyclist]

To throw a spanner in the works here, Perhaps log into Sufferfest or google the Sufferfest 4dp test. I'm sure you can mimic it out on the road, But I know of coaches who look at the 4dp values more closely than Ftp values. Again though, for the 4dp test your build up needs to be spot on in order to gain maximum benefit.

[Maniax]

botlary road is my choice for ftp tests.

[bleedToWin]

botlary road is my choice for ftp tests.

 

Flattish 10kms. Are you doing a 20min test? 

[Chris_]

....

I haven't bothered with the mindless drill of a 20min test for almost 2 years. ramp Tests give you a much better idea of what your power profile looks like or just use one of the apps mentioned and go ride your bike hard for an hour and a some change

 

...

 

How so?

[gtr1]

How a workout is conducted is important. Many people think that a threshold workout at 90rpm and at 60rpm are the same but they're not. Each trains the body into a differnt "ability" profile i.e. All orunder vs TT specialist vs climber. dedicated sprinters almost alsways focus on 15-20sec power out to 2min power and lack 15min, 20min, 30min power that TT specialists, or climbers or all rounders have. 

 

This is why a 20min@95% power test isn't as effective as say a full1 hr TT or a ramp test or even intervals.icu, XERT or other similar apps. 

 

I haven't bothered with the mindless drill of a 20min test for almost 2 years. ramp Tests give you a much better idea of what your power profile looks like or just use one of the apps mentioned and go ride your bike hard for an hour and a some change

 

 

 

 

 

There's a few more schools of thought

 

Totally agree on the schools of thought. As AT may be more important than ftp (although there is a correlation) but VLAmax is even more important to understand. 

 

FTP on its own is almost meaningless.

 

Haven't done an ftp test for a few years.

[gtr1]

How so?

 

There are a lot of other factors that come into play other than ftp. Especially when racing and profiling the type of rider and type of race.

 

Think of ftp, Cavendish doesnt have a high (relative) ftp, but will win races with a high max power effort. A triathlete can ride steady all day but not sprint.

 

FTP doesnt tell you any of this.

 

Lactate testing and understanding VLAmax, AT, Carb combustion, VO2max, all just as important. And there are compromises. You may increase 1 and another decreases.

 

Works for some of the top pro world tour teams.