So how much does the bike matter?

[Stockman]

Try starting a MTB race on your TT Bike and you'll quickly realise the bike does matter!!

[SwissVan]

Try starting a MTB race on your TT Bike and you'll quickly realise the bike does matter!!

 

Exactly

Now compare a TT bike with a road bike

TT wins easy on flat, fast and easy courses

Road bike wins on steep hilly and difficult courses

[Headshot]

Don't DH and Enduro riders change bike size and fork travel for different courses?

 

those are pretty significant changes to warrant an argument for the bike making a difference.

 

I think at the XCO Elite level it doesn't matter so much. Maybe for the other disciplines there are more subtleties that need to be considered to achieve optimal performance?

But then they all change their bikes to what suits them or the course. I think we're talking about whether brand X is better than brand Y and this makes enough difference to make that rider win, rather than his or her skill and fitness. But maybe we're talking about something else. 

 

As I said initially, I doubt Nino could win an XCO on my enduro bike which is heavy and plush. There is however a point on the continuum where the lower end bike eg an alloy Spark is good enough and Nino will still win on it. 

 

The same cannot be said to the same extent of other sports where the machine being driven or ridden has  an engine and all the tech that goes with that. Formula one, rally and any other motorized racing spring to mind. If your F1 car is sh#t, (eg down on power, handling like a dog) you're not going to win no matter your skill. Or could you? I don't follow motor sports closely enough and I'm not sure there is enough data on say engine performance to say that Hamilton won despite being 50 bhp down and on the wrong tyres ...

[Hairy]

and Red bikes are faster ... F.A.C.T

[The Ouzo]

But then they all change their bikes to what suits them or the course. I think we're talking about whether brand X is better than brand Y and this makes enough difference to make that rider win, rather than his or her skill and fitness. But maybe we're talking about something else. 

 

As I said initially, I doubt Nino could win an XCO on my enduro bike which is heavy and plush. There is however a point on the continuum where the lower end bike eg an alloy Spark is good enough and Nino will still win on it. 

 

The same cannot be said to the same extent of other sports where the machine being driven or ridden has  an engine and all the tech that goes with that. Formula one, rally and any other motorized racing spring to mind. If your F1 car is sh#t, (eg down on power, handling like a dog) you're not going to win no matter your skill. Or could you? I don't follow motor sports closely enough and I'm not sure there is enough data on say engine performance to say that Hamilton won despite being 50 bhp down and on the wrong tyres ...

there are a number of cases in motorsport history where the driver in teh lesser car has won the race.

[Me rida my bicycle]

are we still talking bicycles?

I think that one was the only one about bicycles , thanks guys for the laugh

['Dale]

For the amateur, how the bike looks, really matter.

How it performs is important especially it must not be noisy and must be dependable.

 

If you stare at your bicycle leaning against the coffee shop wall with loving eyes and pride, then you have something good going whether it's a CAAD 8 or a Spez Avenger.

[Jewbacca]

For the amateur, how the bike looks, really matter.

How it performs is important especially it must not be noisy and must be dependable.

 

If you stare at your bicycle leaning against the coffee shop wall with loving eyes and pride, then you have something good going whether it's a CAAD 8 or a Spez Avenger.

Is a Spez Avenger a Marvel to behold?.....

[NickGM]

If you took the top 20DH riders and made each of them switch bike brands, got them the right size bike, gave them a week to set it up correctly and get used to it etc, then asked them to compete at the next round of the world cup.... I bet they would still all be the top 20 riders, give or take a few positions here and there.

 

That's because at a fixed point in time, most brands offer the same thing. The weight, geometry, and amount of travel etc, differ by a few percent from one bike to the next. 

 

But if you instead said to all the riders, keep the same bike brand and class that they ride (eg: DH specific bike) but you have to ride the version from 10 years ago, then you would see a huge difference. That's because every now and then there is a big quantum shift in technology that is a game changer.

 

eg: I think the last person to win a DH world cup on a 26er was Bryceland in 2014 (please correct me if I'm wrong). And to say "OH people don't win on 26ers anymore because Bike companies stopped making them." That is BS. Bike companies stopped making on them because people stopped winning on them. Average speeds have improved down tracks that have not changed. 

 

1. Keep the point in time fixed, but change the bike brand (within same class) - you wont get much of a difference.
2. Keep the bike brand and class fixed, but change the time frame - and you probably will see a difference.

And to say that your mate on a 26er or a heavier bike or a hardtail is still faster than you on your fancy bike is a completely pointless argument. The rider should be the control in this hypothetical experiment. In this experiment/argument, you are only racing against you. Is "You" on bike x faster than "You" on bike y? That's what the buyer wants to know.

[LBKloppers]

In the pelloton Quick Step is one of the teams getting the more consistent results riding Specialized. Ineos on the other hand has the grand tours with Pinarello. Who will go out on a limb and claim which of those two are the fastest?

The rules dictate and enforce the minimum weight so much so that sometimes bikes are loaded with heavier components to comply. It is not possible to predict which team is going to win at a particular race or dominate during a season despite the variations in brands used. Riders, route, tactics and many other issues impact the outcome, but I am willing to bet not one of them is the brand of bike or the kit.

I ride a mountain bike. I also progressed from 26 to 29, but I never attempted to win a race or category. I ride because I enjoy riding, period. BUT! there is absolutely nothing that irks me more than a ill functioning gear-train. 3 x 10, 2 x 11, 1 x 12, it doesn't matter. If I actuate that lever, I expect a change. That makes me faster than last time and its enough.

Oh, and reliability! Oh boy! I once rode a rather tough little marathon race in the mountains around Montague. I was much younger then and a little bit closer to the action in front than I would be today when I passed a pro who had a flat. He caught me soon after and he passed me like a jack rabbit, but just a few Ks down the track.....you guessed it, he flatted again. This time he did not catch me again. I was heavy and puncture proof. He was light, unreliable and slow. We see this often in the Epic too. 

For the record. I am riding 27.5 Plus these days. Lots of traction and less severe on the joints. Fast? Not really.

[Hairy]

If you took the top 20DH riders and made each of them switch bike brands, got them the right size bike, gave them a week to set it up correctly and get used to it etc, then asked them to compete at the next round of the world cup.... I bet they would still all be the top 20 riders, give or take a few positions here and there.

 

That's because at a fixed point in time, most brands offer the same thing. The weight, geometry, and amount of travel etc, differ by a few percent from one bike to the next. 

 

But if you instead said to all the riders, keep the same bike brand and class that they ride (eg: DH specific bike) but you have to ride the version from 10 years ago, then you would see a huge difference. That's because every now and then there is a big quantum shift in technology that is a game changer.

 

eg: I think the last person to win a DH world cup on a 26er was Bryceland in 2014 (please correct me if I'm wrong). And to say "OH people don't win on 26ers anymore because Bike companies stopped making them." That is BS. Bike companies stopped making on them because people stopped winning on them. Average speeds have improved down tracks that have not changed. 

 

1. Keep the point in time fixed, but change the bike brand (within same class) - you wont get much of a difference.
2. Keep the bike brand and class fixed, but change the time frame - and you probably will see a difference.

And to say that your mate on a 26er or a heavier bike or a hardtail is still faster than you on your fancy bike is a completely pointless argument. The rider should be the control in this hypothetical experiment. In this experiment/argument, you are only racing against you. Is "You" on bike x faster than "You" on bike y? That's what the buyer wants to know.

I would like to think the same RE the brands, but if you look at how the Commencal riders dramatically starting improving when they got their new DH rigs two seasons ago really tells me that at the cutting edge of racing, a small to medium improvement makes massive improvements when competing against others were a second or two equals being on the podium or just scraping into the top 20.

['Dale]

Is a Spez Avenger a Marvel to behold?.....

 

I see what you did there when you saw what I did there... 

['Dale]

and Red bikes are faster ... F.A.C.T

 

No black bikes are.

You just can't see how fast they are as they are stealthy.

[Hairy]

No black bikes are.

You just can't see how fast they are as they are stealthy.

If you are on a red bike you will never see what a black bike looks like, unless you are in the habit of looking over your shoulder at those riders following behind you and encouraging them along!

[Headshot]

there are a number of cases in motorsport history where the driver in teh lesser car has won the race.

I'm sure there are, but I wonder how "lesser' was determined. Maybe it was just the underdog who won because they had actually built a very good car? 

[Furbz]

a better bikes helps at the very least 37