DH World Cup #4 - Leogang

[Guest 1979]

Now we talking....this is something that Cycling South Africa hould be doing (please stop laughing ya all -why cant it happen?)

 

Set up a base house somewhere in Europe with facilities where roadies, mtbkrs, triathletes etc...without pro team sponsorhips can stay in the summmer and travel to races.

 

Should i ever win 1st prize with the euro lotto or something similar I'd seriously consider buying a big house somewhere with that purpose in mind

 

So... all hold thumbs every friday for me when the euro lotto plays

 

That would be a rad idea. People could qualify to use the digs at certain times of year by accumulating points in their categories at the local provincial and national races. It would be a very nice incentive for riders to take part in as many local events as possible.

[SwissVan]

AT MY AGE I know i could never ride like that, but i would love to look at a course like that and know i could ride to the bottom at my own pace and not break anything else

 

Noddakak

 

Some of those courses are not even walkable never mind rideable...thats why the riders spend so much time in the air not because they like jumping but they to scared to ride there

[SwissVan]

That would be a rad idea. People could qualify to use the digs at certain times of year by accumulating points in their categories at the local provincial and national races. It would be a very nice incentive for riders to take part in as many local events as possible.

 

 

Yip CSA should be looking for sponsors who will subsidise something like that

[beanz]

Big up to Hayley for for participating / competing at the World Cup.

She earned her points, qualified, earned her right to be there fair and square, took life by the horns and did something that most of us wouldn't even dare to dream of doing, let alone actually make happen. Does it matter what her reasons are? Huge respect.

Meanwhile the vast majority of us sit in front of our screens and watch life happening to others.

[patches]

It seems like this DNA vs Dedication topic needs a thread of its own (sorry for the derailment Stretch).

 

It also seems like this has been aimed directly at HayleyEarth, just because she shared her first WC experience.

 

The way I see it (and yes, that means my opinion, so you're welcome to disagree)...

 

I believe there is such a thing as "natural talent".One could even call it "genetics". A predisposition to have quicker reflexes, heightened balance, better eyesight, etc etc. These things will aid a rider, no doubt about it. The same can be said for musicians, painters, those few with 200+ IQs.

 

BUT I believe that natural talent can only get one so far. I believe that dedication and training need to be added to that natural talent in order to become achieve top results (in any sphere). One would probably find that any person at the top of their respective sphere (whether it be sports, the arts, the sciences etc) will have both these attributes.

 

So lets bring it back to who should and who shouldn't be racing in a WC.

 

Will our non-pro SA riders (so excl. Greg and Needles) ever win a WC. Unlikely. But they themselves know this. They do not have delusions of grandeur.

 

So should they be there... ABSOLUTELY!!

Does it mean they should stop trying... ABSOLUTELY NOT!!

 

There are experiences that can only be had on the world circuit. For some the challenge to qualify (not the top step) is their personal goal. For others it's to break into the top 50 (or whatever it may be). To prove something to themselves, not others. To be the best that they can be.

 

All these are worthy goals and I commend these riders for the time and dedication they put in to achieve them. And without the WC, or other high level international circuits, to test themselves on, the progression of these riders woud become stagnant.

 

So big up to Tim Bentley, Sam Bull, Stefan Garlicky, Tiaan Odendaal, Johan Potgieter, and especially HayleyEarth (as it was her first WC) for being there. For getting on their bikes. For riding their hearts out!

 

Keep it up! I hope to see many more South Africans at world stage events (in any discipline).

Edited June 19, 2014 by patches

[Guest Karma]

It seems like this DNA vs Dedication topic needs a thread of its own (sorry for the derailment Stretch).

.......

[mazambaan]

Well done Hayley, very brave. Tall poppy cutters are part of life and the taller you get the more wind you catch. That is just how it is so being criticised can be seen as acknowledgement of standing out.

 

In sports requiring courage and commitment (big wave surfing, big river kayaking, climbing, mx, hard enduro, and downhill mtb etc) I think most people also need to be gradually sensitised to the apparent danger that lurks. I know a few people in these disciplines or have tried them myself and know you cannot lead an exposed rock climb, go out in big surf or nail radical uphill steps on a dirt bike the first time you see them. Unless you are massively brave or stupid. After a few years break even you battle to pick up where you left off (I do).

[Tumbleweed]

You need:

 

1x bakkie

1x willing driver

2x bikes (one for you )

 

 

Reminds me of Steve Smith's mum in Seasons.

[Guest 1979]

It seems like this DNA vs Dedication topic needs a thread of its own (sorry for the derailment Stretch).

 

It also seems like this has been aimed directly at HayleyEarth, just because she shared her first WC experience.

 

The way I see it (and yes, that means my opinion, so you're welcome to disagree)...

 

I believe there is such a thing as "natural talent".One could even call it "genetics". A predisposition to have quicker reflexes, heightened balance, better eyesight, etc etc. These things will aid a rider, no doubt about it. The same can be said for musicians, painters, those few with 200+ IQs.

 

BUT I believe that natural talent can only get one so far. I believe that dedication and training need to be added to that natural talent in order to become achieve top results (in any sphere). One would probably find that any person at the top of their respective sphere (whether it be sports, the arts, the sciences etc) will have both these attributes.

 

So lets bring it back to who should and who shouldn't be racing in a WC.

 

Will our non-pro SA riders (so excl. Greg and Needles) ever win a WC. Unlikely. But they themselves know this. They do not have delusions of grandeur.

 

So should they be there... ABSOLUTELY!!

Does it mean they should stop trying... ABSOLUTELY NOT!!

 

There are experiences that can only be had on the world circuit. For some the challenge to qualify (not the top step) is their personal goal. For others it's to break into the top 50 (or whatever it may be). To prove something to themselves, not others. To be the best that they can be.

 

All these are worthy goals and I commend these riders for the time and dedication they put in to achieve them. And without the WC, or other high level international circuits, to test themselves on, the progression of these riders woud become stagnant.

 

So big up to Tim Bentley, Sam Bull, Stefan Garlicky, Tiaan Odendaal, Johan Potgieter, and especially HayleyEarth (as it was her first WC) for being there. For getting on their bikes. For riding their hearts out!

 

Keep it up! I hope to see many more South Africans at world stage events (in any discipline).

 

Nicely put. It would be a boring event if only the ten people with a chance of winning were allowed to compete.

[nigelhicks]

Do you want to compete or do you just want to say that you did it? Because if you are not intending to compete in a world cup race maybe it is better not to do the world cup race and let someone with future potential go in your place. These races are not for fun riding but for serious competitors only.

No one here has questioned her choice to ride downhill.

 

Only her choice to compete at world cup level has been questioned on this thread.

Sorry for editing the rest out.

I am going to be blunt now, I get the impression that whatever we discussed here today you took personal, please don't think that we are always talking about you.

 

I personally feel to be at the TOP and the very TOP of ANY sport (as our discussion started around Gwin's mad rim run) one has to have an inherited talent and ability, that is why not all of us can be the Minnaars, Bolts ,Phepls ,Suasers and Baumgatners of the world.

I will never be Ansel Adams, but I still admire his work and strive to better myself because of him.

Now this is not to say that we as humans must simply not do or try stuff, but we do owe it to ourselves to be honest to ourselves.

 

That is the way I live my life, I know my limitations and I know very well deep inside of me when no matter how much I practice something, it is just not one of my talents, but I very much admire those who rise to the top.

Not just were they blessed and born with great inherited talent and ability, they also had the tenacity, hunger and sheer guts to get the best out of their given talent.

 

People want to know why we admire the best of the sporting starts, quite simply because we acknowledge and respect the fact that they are the complete package and they played a part on completing that package .

I don't even think it was questioned , the debate was around giving praise or not.

 

Ok I personally think you okes are missing something here

 

1. - Mr X - If you had the opportunity to race at a world cup ...

Remember for you to be eligible to enter you have to have the prior dedication to go to all the Nationals - AND DO WELL! - just to amass the points needed to be eligible --- OR you do the Nationals - just dont make the cut but are selected by your Federation.

If this was you - would you say "No I wont give it a go as I know full well I will out of my depth and will get smoked - so I'd rather not do it"

 

Your comment about letting someone with future potential go in your place - would only be associated with World Champs as this is the only real time that riders with potential are selected by their national body. BUT in this instance - ONLY the TOP riders are selected based upon their UCI and National points classifications. So if you dont have the points you cant be selected (also if you dont have the points it shows you are not at the level to be selected)

 

If you are selected to race a World Cup by your federation - this means you are an up and coming rider that the federation thinks will benefit from the exposure of being humiliated on track by the pros. Again you do not take away from anyone else who may have more potential as Federation spots are ONLY set aside for riders who are again at the top of the rankings but dont have the accrued UCI points to enter the event.

 

Then as a privateer you need to have accrued the points (20) to be eligible to race in the event - remember that ANYONE with 20 UCI points to their name in the Junior or Elite Categories can race - you enter - you try and qualify and if you do - COOL ... So again - if you go and enter (once you have your points that is) you are NOT taking away from anyone else with more talent who may do better in the long run.

 

So at this moment in time - Miss Earth is more than eligible to enter the events as she is the ONLY SA lady doing so and has done the prior events to allow her to race. Fine we may have Rika in CT and some other ladies - but they are not racing in Elites - so are not eligible ... thats their issue.

 

----

 

Ok - to Wyatt's comments

 

Dude ... my replies are to the comments in bold.

 

1. Read my post to Mr X - I think people forget about the fact that there are only about 5 riders in each discipline who are always on top ... If you look at the riders further down the sheets - Has anyone heard of Lars Peyer??? I would think not - Who is he? ... well he is a World Cup racer ... he races fro Suspension Centre Intense (Because his dad owns Suspension Centre) ... and he places around 60 to 100th at most events - so often doesnt even qualify ... So does this mean he should not be on a team? Or his reasoning for racing be questioned? IMO .... NO ... he wants to race and has the points so thats fine.

 

2. Miss Earth was giving examples of how she thinks you can improve at any age given exposure to something - not having a whine that we are chooning her.

I agree whit her - I got my Father-in-law into DH to up his hideous XC skills and he is now riding really well where he can now clear doubles ride rocks and drops etc .. so he has gained skill at the age of 50! so it is possible.

 

3. Yes I agree - we should not just sit around and say we "Cant" ... read Richards Bransons book "Screw it lets do it" - very good - As for being Honest with yourself - I agree again - but we only live once so who cares what others think - if you want to do something and try and get good at it - go for it!

 

4. Its is very unlikely that 90% of people will rise to the top of their respective fields in relation to the rest of the world - so knowing your limitations is key - but also knowing yourself i s even more important ... If you compete in something or work etc - and you push yourself to be the best you can be - you can only be happy. I always tell the guys and girls i coach that they need only race themselves and the clock ... NEVER their competitiors. If you gave 100% and you ended up 5th or 50th ... as long as you know in your heart and your head that you could not have gone any faster or harder. ... you have done brilliantly ....

This is not to say that I applaud mediocrity - infact I dont - I think its a copout - but if you have pushed your limits and know you have within your ability - you are not mediocre!

 

5. The bit about praise dissappeared about 2 days ago - I think we can leave it in its grave

 

Hope this is a good read.

 

Cheers

Nige

[Wyatt Earp]

 

 

2. Miss Earth was giving examples of how she thinks you can improve at any age given exposure to something - not having a whine that we are chooning her.

 

 

I fully disagree with you and the subsequent posts would also indicate that some felt the comments were directed at her.

[Wayne Potgieter]

@Nigel. For the record (as you quoted my post) I personally do not question Miss Earths decision to ride.

 

Without sounding callous, i actually dont really have an opinion.

 

She is a grown ass lady and can do what she wants with her time and money.

 

I too indulge in stupid expensive hobbies that i truly suck at. Does that make me stop? No. I just have a laugh and have fun.

 

Would i go to a WC event...no. But thats purely because i lack the circumference around my testicles to do so.

 

Would i enter a long stage race just to see if i can finish...yes.

 

Each to there own.

[nigelhicks]

@Nigel. For the record (as you quoted my post) I personally do not question Miss Earths decision to ride.

 

Without sounding callous, i actually dont really have an opinion.

 

She is a grown ass lady and can do what she wants with her time and money.

 

I too indulge in stupid expensive hobbies that i truly suck at. Does that make me stop? No. I just have a laugh and have fun.

 

Would i go to a WC event...no. But thats purely because i lack the circumference around my testicles to do so.

 

Would i enter a long stage race just to see if i can finish...yes.

 

Each to there own.

 

Hahaha ... I suppose thats what you get from multi-quoting. hahaha

 

But yeah - you comment about each to their won its exactly it ... If you had the chance to race a marathon worlds event because you were selected - Im sure you would do it just because you could even though you know you would get thumped and would just be going for a finish. The feeling of reward is what I think pushes us in our own ways.

[nigelhicks]

I fully disagree with you and the subsequent posts would also indicate that some felt the comments were directed at her.

 

Ok well thats fine - I didnt see the spat you okes all had - and therefore I possibly read this differently ...

 

Anyway ...

[Wyatt Earp]

It seems like this DNA vs Dedication topic needs a thread of its own (sorry for the derailment Stretch).

 

It also seems like this has been aimed directly at HayleyEarth, just because she shared her first WC experience.

 

The way I see it (and yes, that means my opinion, so you're welcome to disagree)...

 

I believe there is such a thing as "natural talent".One could even call it "genetics". A predisposition to have quicker reflexes, heightened balance, better eyesight, etc etc. These things will aid a rider, no doubt about it. The same can be said for musicians, painters, those few with 200+ IQs.

 

BUT I believe that natural talent can only get one so far. I believe that dedication and training need to be added to that natural talent in order to become achieve top results (in any sphere). One would probably find that any person at the top of their respective sphere (whether it be sports, the arts, the sciences etc) will have both these attributes.

 

So lets bring it back to who should and who shouldn't be racing in a WC.

 

Will our non-pro SA riders (so excl. Greg and Needles) ever win a WC. Unlikely. But they themselves know this. They do not have delusions of grandeur.

 

So should they be there... ABSOLUTELY!!

Does it mean they should stop trying... ABSOLUTELY NOT!!

 

There are experiences that can only be had on the world circuit. For some the challenge to qualify (not the top step) is their personal goal. For others it's to break into the top 50 (or whatever it may be). To prove something to themselves, not others. To be the best that they can be.

 

All these are worthy goals and I commend these riders for the time and dedication they put in to achieve them. And without the WC, or other high level international circuits, to test themselves on, the progression of these riders woud become stagnant.

 

So big up to Tim Bentley, Sam Bull, Stefan Garlicky, Tiaan Odendaal, Johan Potgieter, and especially HayleyEarth (as it was her first WC) for being there. For getting on their bikes. For riding their hearts out!

 

Keep it up! I hope to see many more South Africans at world stage events (in any discipline).

 

Why, oh why do we have to keep going there, and then Nigel wants to tell me that I was imagining things.

 

Yesterdays discussion began around the nutcase run by Gwin, nothing more and nothing less.

 

The bits highlighted in red almost echoes what I said last night, you jut interpreted it differently, I agree with what you say here.

 

Lastly, people can do as they please, that was never in question or up for debate ,unless I missed that part.

And I will say it again, also that Nigel will know and understand the reason for me mentioning it is that it is all relative to some of the skewed perceptions on here at the moment.

 

The issue of praise is the one that was debated.

Going on holiday and entering a World Cup race is a dream many of us would love to be able to do, what people do with their money and time and their worthiness of being there has actually nothing to do with any of this.

Just merely the issue of praise.

 

As said much earlier in this thread, I praise and acknowledge the passion .

[Wyatt Earp]

Ok well thats fine - I didnt see the spat you okes all had - and therefore I possibly read this differently ...

 

Anyway ...

 

No worries.

I sometimes read one or two posts and also fire away.

I must just add that yesterday we were all very merrily discussing the World Cup without any spats, till miss Earth made her comment.