thisismyotherbike Posted October 19, 2017 Share Good morning, I realise there are severe inefficiencies and external factors that make this a difficult question to answer, but I'd like to glean a rough range of FTP/kg ranges that correspond to PPA seeding. This is not meant to be a discussion on the determination of FTP (and curse you if you quote your 20 minute estimate without first removing 5%), I've read Hunter Allen's book. I also don't want to get bogged down in the PPA seeding system, I realise it has its flaws but I think that in most cases it gives a very fair indication of ability. I like the below table and would love to see something similar that slots guys into seeding groups instead of classifying them as "world class" or "novice" source: https://www.trainingpeaks.com/blog/power-profiling/ Yes other things could also affect your seeding. Maybe you suck more wheels or do a lot of work at the front. Maybe you had one exceptional race, never to be repeated, because some strong guys dropped back to your seeding and helped you do a time well out of your range (I think this happened to me at Emperors by accident). Maybe you simply don't race tactically at all so your FTP indicates you should be seeded higher than you are.Despite all this I still think there should be a broad correlation. Humor me, it gives me something to work towards. If I knew 3.7W/kg would give me a decent chance of seeding in C that is somehow motivating. At the moment I have NO idea. My W/kg is 3.08 and my PPA index 26 or F seeding, measurements taken within weeks of one another. In the above table that puts me between Fair and Moderate. Edited October 19, 2017 by thisismyotherbike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spinnekop Posted October 19, 2017 Share PPA seeding 5 Start group VBW/kg on FTP level: 3.97 thisismyotherbike 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jehosefat Posted October 19, 2017 Share PPA seeding 39 / JEmperors Start Group: EL (although I think this was based on a seeding of about 44)FTP: 2.7 w/kg Current seeding is based on Satellite Classic and I didn't spend much time in groups during the race. Edited October 19, 2017 by Jehosefat thisismyotherbike 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mecheng89 Posted October 19, 2017 Share PPA - 15.18, CW/kg - 3.4 thisismyotherbike 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
s14phoenix Posted October 19, 2017 Share PPA seeding 15.03 Start group AL or AW/kg on FTP level: 4.2 I think that scale is not a reflection on everyone... Some may not have such a low/high peak power compared to the ftp on the scale typically. Some may have 16w/kg for 5s but only manage 2.5w/kg FTP. Liezel Panda 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
V12man Posted October 19, 2017 Share Good morning, I realise there are severe inefficiencies and external factors that make this a difficult question to answer, but I'd like to glean a rough range of FTP/kg ranges that correspond to PPA seeding. This is not meant to be a discussion on the determination of FTP (and curse you if you quote your 20 minute estimate without first removing 5%), I've read Hunter Allen's book. I also don't want to get bogged down in the PPA seeding system, I realise it has its flaws but I think that in most cases it gives a very fair indication of ability. I like the below table and would love to see something similar that slots guys into seeding groups instead of classifying them as "world class" or "novice" source: https://www.trainingpeaks.com/blog/power-profiling/ Yes other things could also affect your seeding. Maybe you suck more wheels or do a lot of work at the front. Maybe you had one exceptional race, never to be repeated, because some strong guys dropped back to your seeding and helped you do a time well out of your range (I think this happened to me at Emperors by accident). Maybe you simply don't race tactically at all so your FTP indicates you should be seeded higher than you are. Despite all this I still think there should be a broad correlation. Humor me, it gives me something to work towards. If I knew 3.7W/kg would give me a decent chance of seeding in C that is somehow motivating. At the moment I have NO idea. My W/kg is 3.08 and my PPA seeding is F, measurements taken within weeks of one another. In the above table that puts me between Fair and Moderate.There is another version of a similar table that puts ftp into race categories - search for it, it's been posted here before - this is more enlightening, but doesn't really match to SA based seeding categories. Don't forget to adjust your ftp a bit for altitude if the test was not done at the coast - given that the numbers are all normalised to sea level ftp. Tristand 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JeffK Posted October 19, 2017 Share PPA 1.15, w/kg 4.7, think mine is one of the lower power higher seeding ones thisismyotherbike 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blokman Posted October 19, 2017 Share PPA 25.5 F. 3.0 W/KG . Same as OP. Maybe there is something in it. Got some work to do. thisismyotherbike 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave303e Posted October 19, 2017 Share Off to wattbike right now, need to sort my FTP out big time looking at these values Blokman 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thisismyotherbike Posted October 19, 2017 Share PPA 25.5 F. 3.0 W/KG . Same as OP. Maybe there is something in it. Got some work to do. 91% correlation on our tiny sample of 7 Blokman 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
devocean Posted October 19, 2017 Share Never done a FTP test before, but based on a 343W avg for 21 min strava segment I estimate FTP at around 4.8w/kg (66kg), depending on how much cake I eat, which is a lot. Best seeding index so far was 0.9 but that was purely based on a hill climb and not a race. Racing is completely different story. Usually I'm sitting mid pack in A bunch, or often straight out the back if there's wind! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
khayale Posted October 19, 2017 Share Such an interesting thread. Thanks to OP for starting this. W/kg 3.28PPA 13.45Normally group AL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karman de Lange Posted October 19, 2017 Share Index 24.29 F group , 2.8w/kgwas D group at 2.5w/kg (pro wheelsucker) 1.5 years ago Edited October 19, 2017 by Karman de Lange Velouria 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ozzie NL Posted October 19, 2017 Share Never done a FTP test before, but based on a 343W avg for 21 min strava segment I estimate FTP at around 4.8w/kg (66kg), depending on how much cake I eat, which is a lot. Best seeding index so far was 0.9 but that was purely based on a hill climb and not a race. Racing is completely different story. Usually I'm sitting mid pack in A bunch, or often straight out the back if there's wind!How did you get to 4.8 W/kg FTP? I had understood that FTP is ~80% of max 20 min effort, which assuming 343W is your max effort means you would have FTP of 4.15Not saying you are wrong just interested in the calcs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ozzie NL Posted October 19, 2017 Share Think the data proves my status as wheel sucker FTP is only ~3 W/kg but have PPA seeding of 15.12 and ride mid A pack Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cas_1 Posted October 19, 2017 Share PPA - 12.28, ALW/kg - 3.94 L46 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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