Need some advice on Shimano Ultegra shifting issue.

[Bateleur1]

For some background:

 

I bought my bike now almost three years ago with Shimano Ultegra on it.  In three years the shifting has been faultless. I have never had to fine tune anything on it.  It just worked.  Take note.  I have also never replaced the cables.  The cables are also running inside the frame.  About 3-4 weeks ago I noticed while cleaning and checking on the bike, that the chain does not go onto the very small gear at the back. So I am just riding on 10 of the 11 gears.  I is obvious that that must have been the case for a long time as there is sign of wear on the small gear.  I did not worry about it too much and thought it is propably just the low marker or something that prevents it from going all the way down.  I will fix this on a weekend somewhere.

 

So Friday morning on my way out on my early morning ride, the bike tipped over while it was leaning agains the wall and fell on the floor. During the ride I noticed the derailer getting a tad close to the spokes.  So obviously some form of bending (the hanger) happened when the bike tipped over.  Not a problem, have had this many times before.  I will fix that.

 

So come Saturday afternoon, I bent the hanger back that the derailer is aligned nicely and decided now is a good time to fix up the shifting.  So loosend the shifting cable, made sure the derailer is alignend and sits nicely on the lowest gear.  Tighten the shifting cable with no slack on it.  Now I can shift up into my biggest gear.  Check the hi lo screws, they are not limiting the movement.  The moment you set the derailer to go into the top gear it won't go down into the smallest. Almost as if the shifter is only for 10 gears.

 

My question to the hub.  What can cause this?  Should I replace the shifting cables?  Don't see how that could be the cause.  Should I replace the bit of cable housing that they might be worn?  Please let the ideas roll so that I can fault find this one.

[bertusras]

Personally, I would definitely replace the housing and cables. It's such a small expense in the grand scheme of things.

[TNT1]

Almost as if the shifter is only for 10 gears.

 

 

I assume you noticed 11 "clicks"? Or...?

 

Other than the obvious, clean and lube chain, new cables, lube them before inserting through frame.

You shouldn't need to replace the outer cable housing unless it's visibly damaged.

Edited March 29, 2021 by TNT1

[Martin PJ]

First time I have problems with shifting I replace cables, maybe once a year on road bike, more on MTB. The rear derailleur is sensitive to cable problems.

[Bateleur1]

I assume you noticed 11 "clicks"? Or...?

 

Other than the obvious, clean and lube chain, new cables, lube them before inserting through frame.

You shouldn't need to replace the outer cable housing unless it's visibly damaged.

 

I will have to check the 11 clicks.  Would the shifter only click 11 times if there is no cable tension?  New cables are there so just replacing them would not be a bad idea.  What lube would you use for the cables? Normal chain lube?  Mention the obvious as obviously I am missing something, thanks.

[Bateleur1]

First time I have problems with shifting I replace cables, maybe once a year on road bike, more on MTB. The rear derailleur is sensitive to cable problems.

 

I used to religiously replace cables every year but never took on the job with this bike as I have not dealt with inner frame cables before.  Time to sort that out.

[lechatnoir]

first thing to change is the derailleur hanger. cables might be OK, but your hanger is almost certainly not

 

from what you describe, it got bent. it's flimsy aluminium and repeated bending (first in the ding, then bent back) does not leave it in good shape. 

Edited March 29, 2021 by lechatnoir

[Grease_Monkey]

I will have to check the 11 clicks. Would the shifter only click 11 times if there is no cable tension? New cables are there so just replacing them would not be a bad idea. What lube would you use for the cables? Normal chain lube? Mention the obvious as obviously I am missing something, thanks.

It will click 10 times for an 11 speed shifter, 9 times for a 10 speed shifter. But I doubt that's the problem, the amount the derailleur moves with each shift is different for 10 and 11 speed setups, so you won't be able to use a 10 speed derailleur on a 11 speed cassette without shifting issues.

 

Start with replacing cable and housing, it should be done every year anyway. Then limit screws, then indexing.

 

Oh ja, and as mentioned by others - I would get a new hanger. Bending it is great for a temporary fix, but you hardly ever get it 100% right and that will make your shifting experience terrible. Keep the old one as a spare to get you home in a pinch.

Edited March 29, 2021 by Grease_Monkey

[TNT1]

The rear derailleur is sensitive to cable problems.

Yeah, cause it's so long. A tiny bit of mis-adjustment is exacerbated and magnified over the length.

[bertusras]

first thing to change is the derailleur hanger. cables might be OK, but your hanger is almost certainly not

 

from what you describe, it got bent. it's flimsy aluminium and repeated bending (first in the ding, then bent back) does not leave it in good shape. 

 

My concern was that the lack of bottom gear existed prior to the accidental tip-over.

 

However, proper hangar alignment should also be confirmed.

[Bateleur1]

I have a spare hanger.  Bought it with the bike.  And the shifting at the moment is perfect but only with 10 gears.  Thanks for the advice.  Cable replace is the first step.

[Bicycle Supply Chain]

I will have to check the 11 clicks. Would the shifter only click 11 times if there is no cable tension? New cables are there so just replacing them would not be a bad idea. What lube would you use for the cables? Normal chain lube? Mention the obvious as obviously I am missing something, thanks.

Shifter will click 10 times for 11 speed. And 9 for 10 speed.

 

Don’t lube inner cables with anything. On a road bike they will shift best over a longer period if “dry”

 

 

Did you use a derailluer alignment tool to set the hanger?

 

If you in the jhb area you welcome to pop in and I can take a look.

 

Mike

0827877112

[Bateleur1]

Shifter will click 10 times for 11 speed. And 9 for 10 speed.

 

Don’t lube inner cables with anything. On a road bike they will shift best over a longer period if “dry”

 

 

Did you use a derailluer alignment tool to set the hanger?

 

If you in the jhb area you welcome to pop in and I can take a look.

 

Mike

0827877112

 

Thanks for the offer.  Will have to take a rain check on your offer though.  I am about 11 hours north from you ... by plane

[TNT1]

Don’t lube inner cables with anything. On a road bike they will shift best over a longer period if “dry”

 

 

I always have and will always coat new cables with a PTFE based lubricant. I never have issues and don't even replace inners every year.

 

Or similar.

 

Even better is something like a dry teflon spray:

Which is abundant in Euroland where the OP is.

Edited March 29, 2021 by TNT1

[Andreas_187]

first thing to change is the derailleur hanger. cables might be OK, but your hanger is almost certainly not

 

from what you describe, it got bent. it's flimsy aluminium and repeated bending (first in the ding, then bent back) does not leave it in good shape.

This is important advice. A few years ago my bike fell over and bent the hanger. I bent it back when I got home. Three rides later the hanger snapped and pulled the rear derailleur round the wheel. It destroyed the derailleur and cracked the right hand side chainstay.

Replace the hanger immediately

[WrightJnr]

I have a spare hanger. Bought it with the bike. And the shifting at the moment is perfect but only with 10 gears. Thanks for the advice. Cable replace is the first step.

Worth the 15min to put on the new hanger and see if problem same or goes away. Since you have a new spare one, I’d eliminate the chance it’s the issue.