weekly tss score

[Frosty]

I am just doing IDT at present, so battling to get the TSS up as I generally only do three sessions a week. An interval session gets me a 70 - 85 TSS per session with IF at about 0.84

 

I have taken the approach to use the time to do interval sessions when I use IDT, the easy / steady state rides on the IDT are just too boring and I can only manage an hour!

Sounds like most of your sessions are an hour or less in duration. Do a 2hr session once a week, with sweet spot intervals in it 15mins or so long, will be good for the TSS as well as improve all round fitness/endurance levels

Yes, sessions are about length and focused at threshold and above, I know I am lacking in the endurance / tempo range at present.

On the two hour session, do you suggest at easy pace with a few tempo intervals (for 15min) within the session?

Do an easy 10-15 min warm up increasing %FTP, 5 min recovery then 4 or 5x15 mins in the range 83-90%FTP with 5 mins recoveries between, finish with an endurance %FTP. Should help improve endurance. You can increase or decrease 3-5mins either way on the sweet spot workouts depending on how you feeling (i.e 6x12mins or 4x20mins)

@cadenceblur - over and above shaper’s good plan, have a listen to this podcast (link below).

 

Kevin Poulton is a coach for a few of the Aussie WT riders. Back in 2016, Mat Hayman crashed out of Omloop Het Nieuwsblad and fractured his arm. It looked like his Classics campaign was over but within days he was back training indoors, using Zwift, and less than six weeks later he crossed the line first in the velodrome to clinch victory in Paris-Roubaix. He believes in back-to-back sessions, which sounds hard, but beneficial.

 

https://podcasts.apple.com/za/podcast/the-cycling-podcast/id665713706?i=1000469492484

[cadenceblur]

Thanks will have a listen.

[cadenceblur]

Thanks will have a listen.

[shaper]

Do an easy 10-15 min warm up increasing %FTP, 5 min recovery then 4 or 5x15 mins in the range 83-90%FTP with 5 mins recoveries between, finish with an endurance %FTP.  Should help improve endurance.  You can increase or decrease 3-5mins either way on the sweet spot workouts depending on how you feeling (i.e 6x12mins or 4x20mins)

@cadenceblur, to add to this, maybe why you struggle to get over an hour is that your endurance workouts are perhaps just sitting there pedaling at one set FTP% for the whole hour or more?.... that will become mindbogglingly boring and a struggle.

 

It is why you try to break up the hours into intervals, even if the interval is not hard like sitting at sweet spot, it will work you and having recoveries breaks up the monotony, keeps your muscles and legs interactive with the workout and even your mind (which might be only watching the clock run down on the interval).  The 15min intervals can also be tweaked to be more involved as you can do different %FTP on each one to vary effort on the legs, first might be at 83%FTP, 2nd at 90%FTP, 3rd at 85%FTP, 4th at 88%FTP etc.  You can also change cadence to make it more interactive/interesting.  If your cadence is normally 80-85, then consider doing one of the intervals at 90-95.

 

The longer 2hr or so rides where you are doing a structured workout and it is more about endurance and building aerobic capacity, they become easier if you break them into smaller intervals and add variety.

 

I generally put on a movie for these longer structured workouts as you are working but not bleeding through the eyes. 

 

Also as Frosty said, a back to back workout can have great benefit.  

[cadenceblur]

Thanks. Yes the issue is definitely the time and docile pace with the less strenuous workouts. I have scheduled a longer one for the weekend with the "break ups" suggested so will see how that goes. Appreciated the input.

[RocknRolla]

Legs are real heavy this week. I'm taking it a lot easier. Went to ride outdoors this morning which is generally less strenuous.

I am loving the way hills feel at the moment despite the heavy legs.

[Jehosefat]

I’m not sure if the formula will work for the week:

 

TSS = IF x IF x duration in hours x 100

 

IF would then be the SQRT of TSS / 100 / duration (in hours).

 

Work in simple numbers:

 

TSS = 0.91 x 0.91 x 1 x 100 = 82

 

IF = SQRT of (82 / 100 / 1) = 0.91

 

Rounding errors will give a decimal place difference.

 

 

I tested it on my week of 416 for 7.2 hours.

The answer should be 0.77 for my week, using a calculator.

As I only have the free version of TP, I can’t see what they show for the week’s IF.

WKO4 does show it, 0.77, so I’m happy that the formula is close enough.

 

The expression used in WKO4 is:

sum(TSS,”week”)/sum(duration,”week”)/36))^.5

 

Assuming the "duration" in the WKO4 formula is in seconds then that formula and yours are exactly the same 

[Frosty]

Assuming the "duration" in the WKO4 formula is in seconds then that formula and yours are exactly the same

I’m sure it is, because 3600 would be seconds, and /100 would explain the /36 in the WKO4 formula. I’m not too worried about trying to calculate it, when the software does it.

 

In trying to help RocknRoller, I learnt something too about calculating IF using TSS, duration and the other constants.

[RocknRolla]

Glad To be of assistance

[cadenceblur]

Attempted the longer session today and it went well! Started a bit late so had to cut the session short but in principle I'm happy and sure I'll be able to complete two hours next time.

[cadenceblur]

so managed the two hour session on Saturday - very happy. Thanks for the advise guys!

 

Went for first "outride" yesterday (Level 3)  with interesting results..

 

Stupid me didn't do the normal pre- ride calibration on the PM - only realised halfway into the workout.

Did just over an hour ride and upon completing the ride got notification that I have a new threshold..

Now here's the question: do I ignore it? It's 20% more than current!

For context, ride was measured with a stages PM (MTB), whilst I train on trainer with Powertap pedals..

My head tells me that I should discard the ride and do another FTP test on the trainer?

My previous test was after not doing structured training for a while so perhaps the bar was a bit on the low side as well.

 

Could the above be a factor in resulting in the improved metrics?

 

Got 155 TSS for the 1h08 ride with IF obviously huge as well?

 

Your thoughts guys?

[shaper]

so managed the two hour session on Saturday - very happy. Thanks for the advise guys!

 

Went for first "outride" yesterday (Level 3)  with interesting results..

 

Stupid me didn't do the normal pre- ride calibration on the PM - only realised halfway into the workout.

Did just over an hour ride and upon completing the ride got notification that I have a new threshold..

Now here's the question: do I ignore it? It's 20% more than current!

For context, ride was measured with a stages PM (MTB), whilst I train on trainer with Powertap pedals..

My head tells me that I should discard the ride and do another FTP test on the trainer?

My previous test was after not doing structured training for a while so perhaps the bar was a bit on the low side as well.

 

Could the above be a factor in resulting in the improved metrics?

 

Got 155 TSS for the 1h08 ride with IF obviously huge as well?

 

Your thoughts guys?

155 TSS for 1:08hr ride tells me your current FTP is set too low.  

 

What type of workout did you do? was it a lot of VO2max or aerobic sweet spot?  

 

If you don't want to do a full FTP test, do a ramp test. which is quick and less painful.  It will also give you a good indication of which FTP to consider.  I suspect it will be closer to your new threshold notification rather than your current FTP.

[cadenceblur]

It was a MTB ride, so quite erratic, more VO2 Max.

I reckon I have gotten stronger and that the previous FTP was on the low side - will look at the ramp test.

 

Was also worried that the lack of calibration and different equipment was a factor

[Frosty]

Off topic.... how you finding using WKO4, I know you have used it for a few years  I have had a look at WKO5, (had the 2 week trial).  The expressions and formula's seems like you have to do a lot of learning.  The basic charts I can pretty much get with Golden Cheetah.  Only thing I briefly saw of interest was that of iLevels..... wondering if worth the cost?

 

 

iLevels? Not sure I know what that is. Will have to read up on it.

 

I struggled with Golden Cheetah, and found the WKO4 interface easier. The cost was once off, which I prefer to a monthly subscription.

 

That was in 2016, I think, when I was a little more serious, and had time to train and race. I probably use a fraction of the potential of WKO4, even less now that I’m just riding for fun. I use the word “fun” lightly, as I will always try ride in the front 20 places in a race. It’s nice to see some additional information on specific pets of my ride/race.

So I found out today that WKO4 has an issue with the SSL certificate that affects Mac users only. They pulled a Strava, and no longer allow syncing between TP and WKO4, effective from 31 May. They're also stopping all support from 1 July.

 

Guess I need to learn how to use Golden Cheetah, while now have to manually upload all my workouts to WKO4.

[shaper]

So I found out today that WKO4 has an issue with the SSL certificate that affects Mac users only. They pulled a Strava, and no longer allow syncing between TP and WKO4, effective from 31 May. They're also stopping all support from 1 July.

 

Guess I need to learn how to use Golden Cheetah, while now have to manually upload all my workouts to WKO4.

Just been reading furious comments on facebook from users with regard to no longer being supported and the 50% offer to upgrade. Rather disgusted is the sentiment

 

I gather you can still use WKO4 as a stand alone but will have to upload your workouts from your device rather than sync from an online source.

 

I had a look at WKO5 with the free 2 week period and was not overly impressed in the way they promote it. Am on the facebook users group and there seems to be many issues with it. Only interesting parts are the online webinars which you can adapt to your training as well as analysis..... so i have decided to stay with Golden Cheetah for now as think that at even 50% discount, WKO5 is not worth the money

 

Edit: I also use Xert in conjuntion with Golden Cheetah

Edited June 3, 2020 by shaper

[Frosty]

Just been reading furious comments on facebook from users with regard to no longer being supported and the 50% offer to upgrade. Rather disgusted is the sentiment

 

I gather you can still use WKO4 as a stand alone but will have to upload your workouts from your device rather than sync from an online source.

 

I had a look at WKO5 with the free 2 week period and was not overly impressed in the way they promote it. Am on the facebook users group and there seems to be many issues with it. Only interesting parts are the online webinars which you can adapt to your training as well as analysis..... so i have decided to stay with Golden Cheetah for now as think that at even 50% discount, WKO5 is not worth the money

 

Edit: I also use Xert in conjuntion with Golden Cheetah

Thankfully I can still use the software, but as you rightly said, I have to manually upload. Not a major train smash - I'll probably do it weekly, and then analyze. It still has some good features, but I'm not going to be conned into upgrading, when some users also state that one needs to be on MacOS 10.15. That puts my wife's business apps/software at risk, as she's on 10.13 and we have no intention of upgrading the 2011 iMac.

 

I'll start with GC and see how it goes. At least I have some local resources to speak to, if I need help.