MotoGP

[Steven Knoetze (sk27)]

Saw a post earlier, 46 + 12 = 58. Guess who was watching over them.......

[forkie]

you have to give it to Rossi. to get a 5th after that incident sows just how strong he is mentally. 

[forkie]

Pol must be hating Brad at the moment. Keeps stealing his thunder....

[Steven Knoetze (sk27)]

Think Pol needs to take a chill pill. A lot of his mental woe's, I think, are around his decision to go to Honda.
When Marc is on the bike it gives the illusion of it being a bike that you can succeed on. With him off of it, it's showing what a pig of a bike it actually is.

Brad outrode him in Brno, which led to his crash.

Yesterday, he pushed, made a mistake and put himself in a position that led to the collision. Dude needs to go and do some introspection. The first win is gone, now he needs to knuckle down and beat his rookie teammate which looks unlikely.

[bertusras]

Buyers remorse, I think.

[Patchelicious]

Is the Honda a pig, or has it simply been developed specifically for MM.

[Andymann]

Is the Honda a pig, or has it simply been developed specifically for MM.

 

I guess we will never know for sure, but Alex Marquez is a Moto2 World Champion and was pretty much as fast as Brad, and Brad is finishing top 5 and Alex is struggling so it can't be an easy bike to ride.

[bertusras]

Is the Honda a pig, or has it simply been developed specifically for MM.

 

I'll try and dig up an article from several months back of an interview with a senior HRC engineer. Honda are very lucky to have Marquez, because he was the only one capable of pushing the bike on the front end due to the lack of power (against the Ducati). When HRC finally brought the correct engine for the 2019 season, Marc started crashing less, because he didn't have to push the front as hard to make up time.

 

Yes, to an extent the bike has been developed for MM, but that's also because he is the only one who is and was able to ride around its flaws. It's very much a similar situation to when Casey Stoner went to Ducati in 2007. He was able to push the bike beyond its limits, at the risk of frequently crashing.

 

And let's face it, why would HRC change their entire design, if they keep on winning with Marquez? Yes, the fact that he's gone and binned it in the first race is a possible reason, but up to now, despite the fact that the other bikes are easier to ride, more adaptable to multiple riders, no-one has been able to stick it to Marquez. Why risk changing at the expense of becoming mediocre?

 

It's like having offspring. You can be a fish and have a thousand babies in the hope that 10 will mature, or you can be a lion and have a single one, but you damn well make sure it survives.

 

Edit: Found it

 

https://www.crash.net/motogp/interview/930963/1/honda-marc-s-clever-he-understood-new-bike-immediately-exclusive

 

 

That came after HRC engineers decided a punchier engine with higher top speed was the main priority over the winter months after repeatedly falling short in that department to Ducati in recent seasons.

 

Yokoyama admitted there were concerns how this may affect the character of the ’19 machine. But ultimately they decided, “OK, the problems will come, but ... he's the best rider, so maybe he can manage.”

 

That's the crux of the matter. Marc asked for more power from Honda, because it's free time. You don't expend a lot of energy or take big risks going down the straights, but they knew that other issues would pop up. The big thing is that they were able to reduce their risk on the front end by having "free speed" due to a punchier engine.

 

Edit 2: This interview is also worth a read

 

https://www.cycleworld.com/inside-mind-motogp-engineer-hrc-technical-manager-takeo-yokoyama/

 

And I'll try find one last one, but a lot of it comes down to HRC's engineering philosophy and how they rotate their engineers through the racing department.

 

Edit 3: Here we go

 

https://www.cycleworld.com/story/motorcycle-news/behind-the-locked-doors-of-honda-racing-corporation/

 

 

Like other Japanese engineering companies, Honda practices engineer rotation to bring together contrasting talents. HRC director Tetsuhiro Kuwata introduced himself: “I was working for Formula One until 2008. I was moved to the motorcycle field in race management, not development. Rider negotiation, organizing teams, etc.”

 

Director Shinya Wakabayashi leads the development division. “I supervise all different types of bikes in HRC. I was with HRC from 1990 to 2005. Then in Superbike for two years. Then on to designing the RC211V—I was responsible for that (Honda’s first MotoGP bike, taking two championships 2002 and 2003). Then to mass ­production, and in April 2018, I came back to HRC.”

Edited August 17, 2020 by bertusras

[NotSoBigBen]

From my none expert point of view... Honda are castigated for building a bike to suite a specific rider and Ducati for not adapting their bikes to the rider/riders?

[Patchelicious]

From my none expert point of view... Honda are castigated for building a bike to suite a specific rider and Ducati for not adapting their bikes to the rider/riders?

Nobody castigated them?

 

It is part of their strategy. The did it for Doohan with the screamer, Pedrosa with the little RCV and Marc. Nothing wrong with that.

 

HRC is about winning championships, not about having their riders all happy and singing kumbaya around the motor home park play ground.

 

But I often think we say they “rode around the flaws”, when it’s possibly a bit more of a case that what some see as flaws simply suits other riders a bit more.

Edited August 17, 2020 by Patchelicious

[travisza]

Makes my eyes misty watching this

 

 

Excited to follow this young guy in MotoGP for a while to come

[Steven Knoetze (sk27)]

I'll try and dig up an article from several months back of an interview with a senior HRC engineer. Honda are very lucky to have Marquez, because he was the only one capable of pushing the bike on the front end due to the lack of power (against the Ducati). When HRC finally brought the correct engine for the 2019 season, Marc started crashing less, because he didn't have to push the front as hard to make up time.

 

Yes, to an extent the bike has been developed for MM, but that's also because he is the only one who is and was able to ride around its flaws. It's very much a similar situation to when Casey Stoner went to Ducati in 2007. He was able to push the bike beyond its limits, at the risk of frequently crashing.

 

And let's face it, why would HRC change their entire design, if they keep on winning with Marquez? Yes, the fact that he's gone and binned it in the first race is a possible reason, but up to now, despite the fact that the other bikes are easier to ride, more adaptable to multiple riders, no-one has been able to stick it to Marquez. Why risk changing at the expense of becoming mediocre?

 

It's like having offspring. You can be a fish and have a thousand babies in the hope that 10 will mature, or you can be a lion and have a single one, but you damn well make sure it survives.

 

Edit: Found it

 

https://www.crash.net/motogp/interview/930963/1/honda-marc-s-clever-he-understood-new-bike-immediately-exclusive

 

 

That's the crux of the matter. Marc asked for more power from Honda, because it's free time. You don't expend a lot of energy or take big risks going down the straights, but they knew that other issues would pop up. The big thing is that they were able to reduce their risk on the front end by having "free speed" due to a punchier engine.

 

Edit 2: This interview is also worth a read

 

https://www.cycleworld.com/inside-mind-motogp-engineer-hrc-technical-manager-takeo-yokoyama/

 

And I'll try find one last one, but a lot of it comes down to HRC's engineering philosophy and how they rotate their engineers through the racing department.

 

Edit 3: Here we go

 

https://www.cycleworld.com/story/motorcycle-news/behind-the-locked-doors-of-honda-racing-corporation/

 

 

Very interesting podcast I listened to today coincidentally:

 

https://open.spotify.com/episode/3AphYCflF6QSzHt0gPcrCd?si=DhWtoiG0TqSL5h7gB8MLXg

 

It will explain a bit on why Honda is in this position perhaps. They build a bike to be ridden at 100%, always have really.

 

Off topic but the way Nakamoto worked to create the RCV is incredible. Casey and Livio made his dream a reality and I think Casey is why Marc does well on the Honda, also why the Honda is a bike for an extraordinarily talented rider, ala Marc.

Oh, and Neil Spalding is a bloody legend. Could listen to him all day. Wish his book wasn't so damn expensive. Really want it!!!!

[NotSoBigBen]

Nobody castigated them?

 

It is part of their strategy. The did it for Doohan with the screamer, Pedrosa with the little RCV and Marc. Nothing wrong with that.

 

HRC is about winning championships, not about having their riders all happy and singing kumbaya around the motor home park play ground.

 

But I often think we say they “rode around the flaws”, when it’s possibly a bit more of a case that what some see as flaws simply suits other riders a bit more.

Castigated was probably the wrong word sorry, I was really wondering why Ducati seem to have the opposite strategy or do I understand it wrong?

[Patchelicious]

https://twitter.com/canalplusmotogp/status/1295355989689094144?s=21

[Steven Knoetze (sk27)]

https://twitter.com/canalplusmotogp/status/1295355989689094144?s=21

 

Gloves are off, seeing as Pol is leaving.

Just like Vettel is being snubbed by Ferrari in his fianl year, if Pol continues he may be dropped to the Tech3 squad and Miguel will be moved up early. Would not want to see that but Pol needs to get his ish together now.

[Captain Fastbastard Mayhem]

Pol must be hating Brad at the moment. Keeps stealing his thunder....

He wasn't exactly being conservative and patient on his ride though, was he?

 

He had the pace, but was also extremely aggressive. Brad had a stonker of a race, though. 

 

As for Vale.... sjoe.