The Spruit Upgrades - Thanks to the Fairies

[100Tours]

I suspect the actual fairies take this feedback much better than the average hub poster.. 

 

If you have ever run a project like this then you have probably realised that it is useful to hear people's feedback and experience of what you have built.

 

Anyway the issue is a King_Cripy writes above - if you put up the sign you're assuming some liability, partly by encouraging people to use the trail. You have 2 choices: develop for safety or don't develop at all.

 

The other side of the argument is that getting people hurt is a good way to get MTB activity curtailed along the spruit over time (because JHB Parks liability as well). Make it safer, we might prevent the next injury and make someone else's riding more enjoyable.

 

I made the " jump without looking" mistake only once and landed on my face. 

 

And I'm glad you walked away from that one

Edited July 15, 2019 by 100Tours

[patches]

Look at something like the Victoria Park, Bowenvale, Crater Rim or Flying-nun trails in Christchurch's Port Hills. They're free publicly accessible trails, part maintained by the city council, part by volunteers. Basically Christchurch's equivalents of The Spruit.

 

The majority of signage is to indicate the start of a trail (so one knows which segment they're on). Like this one:

 

 

 

Beyond that it's up to the rider to read the trail as they ride it, and rely on trail experience/knowledge once they have it.

These trails have far bigger challenges thank a 1ft deep ditch with a 1ft high lip. Think road gaps, 7m drop offs, and insanely rocky descents.

 

So why haven't the riders grabbed their torches and pitch forks in Christchurch... because they know the trails are provided as a free service and they have a choice to ride there or not. They know that MTBing carries an element of risk (which is also part of the reward). At the end of the day they know the onus is upon them.

 

Here's a vid from Victoria Park MTB trails. You'll see this family exercise caution AROUND a drop-off/gap that would be the "natural line". That drop-off-gap is on a public trail. No signage.

 

https://vimeo.com/126031607

 

 

 

Common sense, looking up and scanning the trail, and riding within one's limits 

Don't get me wrong, I'm all for safe riding experiences. I just feel we are cultivating a society where everyone else is to blame but ourselves.

BUT hey, there is another option...

In the words of Donald Trump, lets "Make the Spruit Safe Again!"

Lets install padding around all tree trunks. Why not some reflective strips down the centre of the "main line". What about catseyes, and a rumble-strip on the sides of the trails to alert riders when they depart from the centre line. Definitely more signage! Think Las Vegas strip levels of signage... with braille!
 

[dave303e]

Remove all warning labels from everything in this world and let nature take it's course. As Jy dom is, moet jy k****....

The fact people need to be warned not to eat tide pods is the alarming state of society.

 

If you hit the face of a jump without checking it before hand you really deserve the bail. It is different if you following someone who knows the trail and you use them for a speed check and just klap it, but even that is risky.

[LongDonkey]

I suspect the actual fairies take this feedback much better than the average hub poster.. 

 

If you have ever run a project like this then you have probably realised that it is useful to hear people's feedback and experience of what you have built.

 

Anyway the issue is a King_Cripy writes above - if you put up the sign you're assuming some liability, partly by encouraging people to use the trail. You have 2 choices: develop for safety or don't develop at all.

 

The other side of the argument is that getting people hurt is a good way to get MTB activity curtailed along the spruit over time (because JHB Parks liability as well). Make it safer, we might prevent the next injury and make someone else's riding more enjoyable.

 

 

And I'm glad you walked away from that one

Was riding on Sat morning past "the jump" and saw a woman getting upset about that particular gap jump. Another man was with her at the jump and  few other had passed already.  Not sure if that was you guys or not.

 

My opinion.

It is mountain biking, not riding an a little bubble safe from all outside influences.

Ride within your ability (or risk taking confidence), if there is a descent, drop off, gap, turn etc, you should only go as fast as the distance you can stop.

There are a lot of Enduro gap jumps and table tops there, the guys ride them and enjoy them. I am practicing them and hope to make that gap jump someday soon.

 

"Developing for safety" means they will have to flatten every lump, bump, root, turn, dangerous bridges under roads etc etc. This is heading towards an extreme that take the exhilaration out of the sport to my mind.

 

I acknowledge that you would like the area to be safe, but trying to make one rule for everyone on a shared park area is not really practical to my mind.

 

Surprised you have not mentioned the path that rides straight into the river where there used to be a ramp to go under Victory and Linden road. That barrier tape has long since gone and the path goes straight at the 3 m drop off into the sloot. That is a lot more dangerous to my mind.

[Meezo]

Here you go, who needs warnings, and to walk it first

 

https://www.instagram.com/p/Bz9-yGlHyoD/

[nigelhicks]

Although I have only ridden the Spruit twice in the last couple of years - the trail layouts and signage put together by the council and fairies is impeccable, and is at IMBA (International MTB Authority) standard. 

 

The key thing that South African cyclists need to remember is that you need to LOOK at the trail before (and whilst) you ride something.

Dont just go happily onto a feature that you can see outright is a feature - even if it, as @100Tours says follows the flow of the trail .... 

 

I would just like to make a counter argument to @100Tours in this point though ....  as shown in the annotated image ....

the image  shows a thin singletrack - no more than a foot wide moving OFF the main trail line (which is 2 feet wide), the view of the rider from the position of the image shows an unrestricted view of the trail before and after the obstacle ... it is perfectly clear that the trail pitches right and then left over the bridge ... this is the way trails are generally built to provide sustainability for the trail - a straight trail leads to erosion.

 

So in this instance the riding line is VERY clear - any rider who "mistakenly" rides up the feature, and is not aware that they are off line are unfortunately not paying attention to the trail and signage. 

 

If one was to HAVE to mitigate this however - one could either

- move the sign to the red dot in the image and show danger left - easy right

- or do something like is shown in the other non-annotated image attached here - this is on a trail in Alp Du Heuz - and as you can see it allows for a jump - but with a safety zone on the bridge behind the lip ... 

 

--------

The main take home from this is UNFORTUNATELY that most riders do not pay attention to the trail that they are on, and expect that (because they are great in their own minds) that they should be able to ride everything in the trail park. This is a fallacy .... 

Edited July 16, 2019 by nigelhicks

[100Tours]

Not me - accidents I witnessed were around 5pm on Thursday and 3.30pm on Sunday. So Saturday makes at least 3 falls there over the weekend (and 1 previous death, as mentioned in the thread above).

 

The other examples mentioned above are generally more obvious hazards (i.e. you get some sufficient warning on the way in to be able to stop), or they are located on trails that are marked as more challenging. This one is easily misread as being something a new rider might ride (and I mean the way it gets interpreted by the actual people riding the trail), and it is on an otherwise easy trail used by beginners.

 

The argument of 'don't complain or they will take it away' seems a little short-sighted. Also 'Beginner MTBers should know better' has an obvious logical flaw. The trail exists because of hard work and careful negotiation - more people getting injured is not a good way to build good community relations or develop new MTBers.

 

And to be clear I'm not arguing for levelling the trail. I ride my fair share of challenging routes and I'm happy to take those risks. But that doesn't mean you should put MTB'ers thorugh ditches so they can learn the hard way.  

 

Was riding on Sat morning past "the jump" and saw a woman getting upset about that particular gap jump. Another man was with her at the jump and  few other had passed already.  Not sure if that was you guys or not.

 

My opinion.

It is mountain biking, not riding an a little bubble safe from all outside influences.

Ride within your ability (or risk taking confidence), if there is a descent, drop off, gap, turn etc, you should only go as fast as the distance you can stop.

There are a lot of Enduro gap jumps and table tops there, the guys ride them and enjoy them. I am practicing them and hope to make that gap jump someday soon.

 

"Developing for safety" means they will have to flatten every lump, bump, root, turn, dangerous bridges under roads etc etc. This is heading towards an extreme that take the exhilaration out of the sport to my mind.

 

I acknowledge that you would like the area to be safe, but trying to make one rule for everyone on a shared park area is not really practical to my mind.

 

Surprised you have not mentioned the path that rides straight into the river where there used to be a ramp to go under Victory and Linden road. That barrier tape has long since gone and the path goes straight at the 3 m drop off into the sloot. That is a lot more dangerous to my mind.

[dave303e]

Or the even bigger steeper gap jump between Fratelli's and Delta park.

[cat-i]

...  (and 1 previous death, as mentioned in the thread above)...

 

 

As far as I remember the person who passed away didnt attempt the jump.

 

There's also a mention about it in this thread:

https://community.bikehub.co.za/topic/179718-spruit-ride-new-piece-of-single-track/

 

Quoting from there:

From Jozi Trail FB page.

 

 

“Jozi Trails has received the incredibly sad news that a cyclist has passed away after a fall near Victory Park. 

 

We've been in contact with the family and the details, currently available, are as follows: 

 

A father & son were riding along the Braamfontein Spruit and while crossing the stormwater drain through the dip in the trail (parallel to Dale Brook Crescent) it's believed that at the low point of the crossing his wheel washed out and he suffered a serious fall. At this stage it is assumed that he suffered serious injuries from the fall and passed away as a result. It was confirmed that the rider had not attempted the gap jump.

 

The family has asked that we respect their privacy at this time and we will not be releasing the riders name. Our most sincere condolences go out to the family and friends of the rider and we will keep the community updated with any new information.” 

Edited July 16, 2019 by cat-i

[MudLark]

Yeah. Sounds like a normal MTB fall. Volenti non fit iniuria and that good stuff.

[LongDonkey]

Not me - accidents I witnessed were around 5pm on Thursday and 3.30pm on Sunday. So Saturday makes at least 3 falls there over the weekend (and 1 previous death, as mentioned in the thread above).

 

The other examples mentioned above are generally more obvious hazards (i.e. you get some sufficient warning on the way in to be able to stop), or they are located on trails that are marked as more challenging. This one is easily misread as being something a new rider might ride (and I mean the way it gets interpreted by the actual people riding the trail), and it is on an otherwise easy trail used by beginners.

 

The argument of 'don't complain or they will take it away' seems a little short-sighted. Also 'Beginner MTBers should know better' has an obvious logical flaw. The trail exists because of hard work and careful negotiation - more people getting injured is not a good way to build good community relations or develop new MTBers.

 

And to be clear I'm not arguing for levelling the trail. I ride my fair share of challenging routes and I'm happy to take those risks. But that doesn't mean you should put MTB'ers thorugh ditches so they can learn the hard way.  

Was not an accident, she was just on the jump ramp trying to push her bike back to go on the concrete lintel path.

Beginners really must go slowly and check things. Making a trail that is beginner fault proof will be a problem for me.

I do not advocate taking the jump away.

The only change on this i would advocate is a sign (as previously suggested) with a chicken facing right and a devil on the left (or equivalent). A small sign.  

[Uni]

If i'm riding a trail I'm not familiar with and i see a sign, any sign, i'll slow down / stop to see what it is. But that's just me. 

[westcoaster]

We can debate signage, trail layout, what people SHOULD do and such forever.  The real issue is that most everyone

a) are damn oblivious to what's going on around them (check this out a bit next time on the Spruit - both riders and walkers);

b) thinks they're superbly good at almost everything (especially those who DON'T have experience) and

c) will resort to blaming (and suing) everyone else if things go wrong.  Compounding this is that our legal system seems to entertain this absurd situation.  And Darwin can't beat the legal system unfortunately.

 

Perhaps we need riders' licences - PROVE you can ride a bike and pay attention to s.h.i.t. around you, before you're allowed on it.

Not that this has worked for car drivers... 

But maybe this can at least help the skills coaches make a living too.

Edited July 16, 2019 by westcoaster

[Rich990]

Is that a strava segment?

[Samurai Pizza Cat]

I suspect the actual fairies take this feedback much better than the average hub poster.. 

 

If you have ever run a project like this then you have probably realised that it is useful to hear people's feedback and experience of what you have built.

 

Anyway the issue is a King_Cripy writes above - if you put up the sign you're assuming some liability, partly by encouraging people to use the trail. You have 2 choices: develop for safety or don't develop at all.

 

The other side of the argument is that getting people hurt is a good way to get MTB activity curtailed along the spruit over time (because JHB Parks liability as well). Make it safer, we might prevent the next injury and make someone else's riding more enjoyable.

 

 

And I'm glad you walked away from that one

Buddy, most of the so-called "Spruit fairies" you are referring to are either living in New Zealand or moved down to KZN / Cape Town. The trails are now being maintained by Jozi trails. The original Spruit fairy is still involved, but only in a limited way.

 

If the original Spruit Fairies and their friends did not cut down the tree that fell over that section of the trail a couple of years ago, you would not be having this conversation, as you would be riding in the street. ( the piece of tarmac on the left of your picture.)

 

Start a new thread complaining about Hollard / Joburg parks and Jozi trails. Leave the "Spruit fairies" out of this; they might have built the jump, but they had nothing to do with the signage.

 

Alternatively do the opposite of what the trail builders did when they got bored with flat single track...spend your own time and money and demolish the jump.

Edited July 16, 2019 by Samurai Pizza Cat

[Thor Buttox]

If i'm riding a trail I'm not familiar with and i see a sign, any sign, i'll slow down / stop to see what it is. But that's just me.

It seems that this is just too much hard work on your braking finger. Rather just allow gravity to impact your life in the way God intended.

 

(Sorry, common sense has no bearing in this thread...)