scubes Posted July 12, 2017 Share With all the safety concerns at the moment (cyclists being attacked on the Spruit etc) it would seem to me that they want cash cells gps etc to use or sell. So how to defend against this? Maybe there is a thread on this already apologies if so but it is topical now.. If you carry a gun its problematic- not the carry but how to access it. If its on your bike and you get whacked off your bike by a bandit there goes your gun to be stolen and used against you even. If its on you if its on your back in a Camelbak how will you access it? And it may injure your back if you fall and land on it. If its on your front- where? it will be heavy and not comfortable to cycle with. There is also the issue that if bandits know cyclists carry guns then the bandits will too.. not that they don't already but de escalation is the way to go in these situations. I always carry a small knife and a proper pepper spray that works. But that is short distance last resort defence. It won't work that well against multiple armed attackers with say a gun and knife and I won't always be able to access it. My knife is also there for me to use in case I need to cut something on my bike to use as a tool and the pepper spray can also be used against a dog if need be. But for defence against say a bandit with a gun and one with a knife ambushing you on the trail , is not an ASP baton worth looking at? Perhaps a cheap telescoping version like this- http://www.sharpedge.co.za/united-defense-impact-baton-expandable-21-w-pouch If this can be made to fit through one end of your handlebar like the Sahmurai Sword works (Sword one end and baton other end?) then you have a system you can access quickly at all times on your bike for self defence. It gives you power and reach vs a bandit and can be used to disarm one or two attackers if you use it properly. And if you lose your bike then you lose the baton at least you didn't lose a firearm and the bandits probably will never know it is there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sepia Posted July 12, 2017 Share Good points Scubes. Great idea to have it in the bars but will not be possible 'cos of the bends?I use a similar home made jobbie with fishing leads onto s/s trace wich comes out when needed.I used to ride armed but as you say.....time to let even one round off is limited and then you are dead. I need to know the answers to this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jurgens Smit Posted July 12, 2017 Share With all the safety concerns at the moment (cyclists being attacked on the Spruit etc) it would seem to me that they want cash cells gps etc to use or sell. So how to defend against this? Maybe there is a thread on this already apologies if so but it is topical now.. If you carry a gun its problematic- not the carry but how to access it. If its on your bike and you get whacked off your bike by a bandit there goes your gun to be stolen and used against you even. If its on you if its on your back in a Camelbak how will you access it? And it may injure your back if you fall and land on it. If its on your front- where? it will be heavy and not comfortable to cycle with. There is also the issue that if bandits know cyclists carry guns then the bandits will too.. not that they don't already but de escalation is the way to go in these situations. I always carry a small knife and a proper pepper spray that works. But that is short distance last resort defence. It won't work that well against multiple armed attackers with say a gun and knife and I won't always be able to access it. My knife is also there for me to use in case I need to cut something on my bike to use as a tool and the pepper spray can also be used against a dog if need be. But for defence against say a bandit with a gun and one with a knife ambushing you on the trail , is not an ASP baton worth looking at? Perhaps a cheap telescoping version like this- http://www.sharpedge.co.za/united-defense-impact-baton-expandable-21-w-pouch If this can be made to fit through one end of your handlebar like the Sahmurai Sword works (Sword one end and baton other end?) then you have a system you can access quickly at all times on your bike for self defence. It gives you power and reach vs a bandit and can be used to disarm one or two attackers if you use it properly. And if you lose your bike then you lose the baton at least you didn't lose a firearm and the bandits probably will never know it is there. I once asked my dad the same question when I just started doing solo rides.He told me "They will take that baton from you and shove it up your arse". Its not that I think its a bad Idea, its just that self defense takes 100's of hours to bed in.The best defense if you are not a natural fighter would be to just let them take your stuff, nothing is worth yourself being stabbed If you have a firearm you can maybe try one of those holsters sitting on your ribs, in the holster safety on and no round in the chamber you can't get a accidental discharge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scubes Posted July 12, 2017 Share Sepia... Yeah maybe for a straight handlebar it can work and be accessible a lot of the time.. I am happy to go hiking armed but not cycling for practical reasons... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T-Bob Posted July 12, 2017 Share Just a a question. How many riders are attacked on a weekly basis and does anyone have any stats on injuries or fatalities? Not a loaded question at all. I'm just interested in the prevalence of these events and locations. Surely the PPA or similar should keep a national record of known events as a matter of course? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Capricorn Posted July 12, 2017 Share Its not that I think its a bad Idea, its just that self defense takes 100's of hours to bed in.The best defense if you are not a natural fighter would be to just let them take your stuff, nothing is worth yourself being stabbed This. Cannot be emphasized enough, with the point being that no matter how you choose to defend yourself, you damn well better practice a bit. Remember; them perps are practicing too: watching, learning, making mistakes and learning from them. So if you going up against all that prep, you best be prepared as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Capricorn Posted July 12, 2017 Share Just a a question. How many riders are attacked on a weekly basis and does anyone have any stats on injuries or fatalities? Not a loaded question at all. I'm just interested in the prevalence of these events and locations. Surely the PPA or similar should keep a national record of known events as a matter of course? i think the PPA has an incident/accident map. can't remember which of the recent newsletters published a link to it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bikebloke Posted July 12, 2017 Share so who here thinks its a good idea to take on an attacker armed with a gun or a knife .... with a short metal stick ..................... (cause that's what a ASP is ) anyone ....? what Jurgen said guys seriously its not worth dying for a bike and a phone (call your broker and update your cover or just join a rider group) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geronimo Posted July 12, 2017 Share I once asked my dad the same question when I just started doing solo rides.He told me "They will take that baton from you and shove it up your arse". Its not that I think its a bad Idea, its just that self defense takes 100's of hours to bed in.The best defense if you are not a natural fighter would be to just let them take your stuff, nothing is worth yourself being stabbed If you have a firearm you can maybe try one of those holsters sitting on your ribs, in the holster safety on and no round in the chamber you can't get a accidental discharge. This. Cannot be emphasized enough, with the point being that no matter how you choose to defend yourself, you damn well better practice a bit. Remember; them perps are practicing too: watching, learning, making mistakes and learning from them. So if you going up against all that prep, you best be prepared as well.You guys are 100% correct. If you are NOT well trained in self defence, DON'T carry weapons because it WILL be used against you. Very crappy that we have to even discuss this but it's unfortunately the reality of the times we live in. Give the perps your stuff and keep your life to ride another day Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grey Hubs Posted July 12, 2017 Share I'm waiting for the Kung fu Panda's to offering training again... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J∆kk∆ls Posted July 12, 2017 Share If you are serious about self defense then go for training. Take a few Krav Maga or Judo/Jujutsu classes. Get a bag at home practice hitting that thing hard until you are moeg!! You might think you are fit but you will gas out very quickly in a skirmish. Go to the shooting range a few times to get comfortable with a firearm. You don't need to own one to know how to use one. Lastly don't fight if your life doesn't depend on it! Things can be replaced. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Letum911 Posted July 12, 2017 Share There was a thread some time ago that went into some depth regarding carrying a FA whilst riding. Personally I do ride with a FA when doing solo rides, I have a holster that sits on my ribs, left front. It's not as easy to access as my normal carry holster but with some training it's not to hard to reach under an untucked shirt. My idea is to let them take the bike, if need be hand over the cell and camelback, but if they are threatening my life then I might as well go full out and do the best I can to defend myself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gummibear Posted July 12, 2017 Share so who here thinks its a good idea to take on an attacker armed withMe but I know nothing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrJacques Posted July 12, 2017 Share The baton could be attached to the top tube with velcro so you could easily grab it if needed. If they knock you off your bike then obviously you won't be able to reach it. Having your self defense weapon on you is the better option. You have to asses this kind of situation carefully (number of attackers, what they are armed with, your self defense skill level) - is it worth the risk of fighting back? It does suck that we can't just go ride our bikes without the risk of being attacked. The Baakens valley in PE was pretty safe for a long time and I did a lot of solo rides there, but recently there have been a few muggings, so now I'll only ride with friends. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martin PJ Posted July 12, 2017 Share A spring telescopic baton is much lighter than a normal telescopic baton. I bought two on line a few years back for R40 each. I don't know anyone who sells them now, but should still be able to source somewhere. There is also a small item called a stinger which they sell on Aliexpress. This is about R10 each. basically a plastic knuckleduster. The nice thing about this weapon is that it is very light and doesn't even look like a weapon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ed-Zulu Posted July 12, 2017 Share A few posters here touched on the subject and I won't elaborate extensively... But, let me advise you to practice the scenarios over and over as follows:- in your riding kit; shoes, lycra, disco shoes the whole toot- sweating and tired (stress environment) because that is where they will take you mostly- from standing to kneeling to lyingoh man everything you can imagine You will need to expand on many topics like;- situational awareness before the attack- situation awareness during the attack- pre-emptive avoidance if and when you spot a possible attack the list goes on an on, for one, get professional tuition in the subject before attempting Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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