SRAM GX or Shimano XT?

[DieselnDust]

22 hours ago, MORNE said:

The noise, smells, feel….Its part of the visceral experience/act of driving and operating a machine with so much power for many, and I honestly think it will stay like that for as long as electric cars have to take to make driving less like eating blind or without smell 😅

I've not driven a full electric yet but I'd imagine that without the noise, smell and tactile sensations that are delivered via a high power petrol engine delivering torque through a manual gearbox, driving a full electric would be very similar to having sex with a blow up doll.

Yeah it gets your there but its not about the arrival, its about how you get there.

Hence until I actually need one, an e-bike is something I'll avoid for as long as possible.

[droo]

On 9/14/2022 at 6:59 PM, MORNE said:

Again…not the case with AXS MTB shifter in my experience. It has the tactile feedback af a semi firm buttoned tv remote or a computer mouse…just a normal silicone bob on a pcboard under there for sure. And i borderline hate it. Yes it shifts as soon as you press the button, but im missing that mechanical feedback.

it’s like swopping a perfectly synchronised, meshed manual gearbox on a performance car for flappy paddle BS. There is no mechanical feedback. 

Yeah, but fly-by-wire is a different animal. And I'd still rather have AXS than DI2, co DI2 is a massive faff to install and charge.

In the meantime I'll stick with my analogue Eagle cos it's what I have. If it didn't come with the second hand bike I bought 3 years ago (original cassette still going strong...) I'd run 11sp, cos it' way less fiddly. But these are first world problems.

[Gerrie Smiff]

Go Gx. Not worth it to go XT and have to wait 1 year just for them to get stock of the cassette you are running. I'm in the industry and I can tell you now that Shimano have big stock issue and it's not going to end soon. Everyone is switching to Sram.

[ChrisF]

48 minutes ago, Gerrie Smiff said:

Go Gx. Not worth it to go XT and have to wait 1 year just for them to get stock of the cassette you are running. I'm in the industry and I can tell you now that Shimano have big stock issue and it's not going to end soon. Everyone is switching to Sram.

 

Uhm .... seems a LOT more Shimano stock being delivered the last few weeks.

[Steady Spin]

Same same. I haven't had issues in the past year to get stock of Shimano parts. 

[Headshot]

My experience of SRAM GX has been good in 11 s form. Cassette wear is almost non-existent. Rear derailleur is tough and I like how the clutch works. That said, the shifter ergonomics suck. That cable release lever is in a horrid place and pushes upwards instead of in the same plane as the thumb shifter. Compared to my Saint 10s shifter it is a dog. And then there is the lack of rapid high gear shifts that Shimano has had for years. 

[DieselnDust]

33 minutes ago, Steady Spin said:

Same same. I haven't had issues in the past year to get stock of Shimano parts. 

there is still stock shortages. Some stock availability challenges have been met by redirecting cancelled orders and also to another extent, shrinkage of the SA market. but overall, the stock issues for Shimano will only start correcting in 2023

Edited September 16, 2022 by DieselnDust

[DieselnDust]

18 minutes ago, Headshot said:

My experience of SRAM GX has been good in 11 s form. Cassette wear is almost non-existent. Rear derailleur is tough and I like how the clutch works. That said, the shifter ergonomics suck. That cable release lever is in a horrid place and pushes upwards instead of in the same plane as the thumb shifter. Compared to my Saint 10s shifter it is a dog. And then there is the lack of rapid high gear shifts that Shimano has had for years. 

Shimano have a patent on the multi release mechanism, hence SRAM gets around it via Gripshift or AXS,

My only faulting of the SRAM triggers is the release lever positioning. I once tried Flat bar double tap shifters to get around this issue but sadly they were 2x10 only. I'd like to see SRAM try the Double tap for 12s Eagle

[sirmoun10goat]

People often talk about past experiences being relevant today, without thinking how these things came about.

The love of manual gearbox has less to do with the action of shifting and notes to deal with how bad auto boxes were-3/4 speed, the inability to hold a gear, gear hopping, the need for torque converters as the auto boxes couldn’t handle high talk, sluggish pull offs, and mostly super slow gear shifts.

The  came flappy tiptronic boxes, which allowed some control of gears, but really was just an auto box with some form of manual shifting.

Nowadays, auto boxes have moss gears, are able to hold a gear, don’t really gear hop as their is intelligence coming from all the tech, allow for super fast pull offs due to launch control but most importantly allow for gear shifts far faster than a manual box. Modern day autos are super fun!

[MTBRIDER1234]

7 minutes ago, sirmoun10goat said:

People often talk about past experiences being relevant today, without thinking how these things came about.

The love of manual gearbox has less to do with the action of shifting and notes to deal with how bad auto boxes were-3/4 speed, the inability to hold a gear, gear hopping, the need for torque converters as the auto boxes couldn’t handle high talk, sluggish pull offs, and mostly super slow gear shifts.

The  came flappy tiptronic boxes, which allowed some control of gears, but really was just an auto box with some form of manual shifting.

Nowadays, auto boxes have moss gears, are able to hold a gear, don’t really gear hop as their is intelligence coming from all the tech, allow for super fast pull offs due to launch control but most importantly allow for gear shifts far faster than a manual box. Modern day autos are super fun!

Yeah autos are fun and 99% of the time they shift better and way faster than a manual could.

But some people just prefer the more immersive experience of driving a manual, and you could argue that it gives you more control over the car (short shifting or revving it out).

Also a manual has more street cred and takes more skill to drive

[sirmoun10goat]

5 hours ago, MTBRIDER1234 said:

Yeah autos are fun and 99% of the time they shift better and way faster than a manual could.

But some people just prefer the more immersive experience of driving a manual, and you could argue that it gives you more control over the car (short shifting or revving it out).

Also a manual has more street cred and takes more skill to drive

Not the new autos-you can short shift or rev it out. They have come a long way, and are absolutely incredible. They will stick in the gear you select and happily redline without shifting. They will downshift only if absolutely necessary which is basically the point of stall

[MTBRIDER1234]

14 minutes ago, sirmoun10goat said:

Not the new autos-you can short shift or rev it out. They have come a long way, and are absolutely incredible. They will stick in the gear you select and happily redline without shifting. They will downshift only if absolutely necessary which is basically the point of stall

I guess maybe what I was trying to say is that for some, manual is deemed more pure, because it is slightly more involved and more oldschool. 

You can have a lot of fun in a car with a DSG 'box for example, and they shift pretty fast.

So I guess auto vs manual is like GX vs XT, there is no right answer and it all comes down to needs and preferences.

[eala]

I have had many groupsets and have had very little problems with any of them .My latest is Shimano ultegra Di2 .I still ride Shimano 11 speed and 2 x 10 .Also Sram eagle XO1,GX,ASX .Shimano Deore ,SLX ,XT are bomb proof and affordable .Sram Gx had issues with shifting so i use XO cassettes .They all work well .I will not buy Sram NX and SX. If i  had to choose one brand it will be Shimano

Edited September 19, 2022 by eala

[MORNE]

discovered a new dislike on my GX "dsg" shifter this past weekend....and i guess thats why shifters have a bit of throw built into them. 

It is extremely easy to "accidentally" shift with the electronic shifter. it is just too sensitive/easy to use it. My hand moved just enough in a few places on the trail that you bump a button just slightly and it shifts you either up or down a gear (since it does so instantly).

they should probably allow you to program the button for some sort of 'long push' setting so it just takes you that split second longer and helps avoid accidental shifts because you just touched it with a thumb or fingertip. 

[BaGearA]

9 hours ago, MORNE said:

discovered a new dislike on my GX "dsg" shifter this past weekend....and i guess thats why shifters have a bit of throw built into them. 

It is extremely easy to "accidentally" shift with the electronic shifter. it is just too sensitive/easy to use it. My hand moved just enough in a few places on the trail that you bump a button just slightly and it shifts you either up or down a gear (since it does so instantly).

they should probably allow you to program the button for some sort of 'long push' setting so it just takes you that split second longer and helps avoid accidental shifts because you just touched it with a thumb or fingertip. 

You could try the updated padle if you haven't already 

[MORNE]

13 minutes ago, BaGearA said:

You could try the updated padle if you haven't already 

Im assuming one can order the rocker lever on its own? Mine is like the one on the bars in the photo. But from what I read its only an option because it confused people that the big lower bit changed into an easier gear and the akward small bit into a bigger. which is backwards to literally everything out there.

But ive been riding bar-end shifters on my gravel bike for a year now with no paddle shifts in sight otherwise so it wasn't that hard to reprogram my brain in that regard.

but i dont see how the new rocker lever will change the fact that it is still just a click activated shift? Anyway, is what it is for now. 

Edited September 19, 2022 by MORNE