Shimano Launch All-New 12-Speed Deore Groupset

[Hairy]

I see light weight - only one option left to chose from: durable or cheap

 

Which will it be?

One good thing RE an internal gearbox is that it would only be the cost of a single speed chain, the odd cog after many thousands of km's and oil once a year in the box to keep the bike rocking and rolling .... so should be ridiculously cheaper in the long run.

[Captain Fastbastard Mayhem]

Shimano Deore FC-M6100 crankset  $94.99

Shimano Deore M6100 12-speed 10-51 cassette  $91.99

Shimano Deore CN-M6100 12-speed chain   $23.99

Shimano Deore RD-M6100-SGS rear derailleur   $54.99

Shimano Deore FC-M6100 shifter   $31.99  

 

 

Full Setup = $297.95 - R5512 odd @ 18.5 exchange rate

No Crank = $202.96 - R3755 odd @ 18.5 exchange rate

 

Please note this is the distribution price and most likely NOT the price in store as there will still be import duties and markup from your local store

 

So with a 15% import duty and a 20% markup (If you have a decent local store)

 

Full Setup = +- R7606 Exc Vat --- R8747 Inc Vat

No Crank = +- R5181 Exc Vat --- R5959 Inc Vat

 

Chainring not included extra on Full Setup R700 odd

Microspline not included at a extra R2000

 

Looking at a 8.7k - 12k to go 12 Speed Deore thats if you can do it all yourself and dont need a LBS to do it on your behalf as you would need to tention/feed the Jigwire, fit microspline, fit casette etc etc.

 

SRAM GX Eagle with Crank and Chainring on RRP comes in at R9000

 

https://www.cwcycles.co.za/product/sram-gx-eagle-dub-groupset-1x12

 

We will have to wait and see the local pricing BUT I can already see it being more expensive than a full GX setup by a long shot

No import duties on spares, mate. Just full bikes and apparel. And no, that's NOT the distro price, that's the suggested retail price. 

 

Yes, we could be screwed with the exchange rate (very likely) but your numbers are off. 

Edited May 12, 2020 by Captain Fastbastard Mayhem

[MTB-More]

No import duties on spares, mate. Just full bikes and apparel. And no, that's NOT the distro price, that's the suggested retail price. 

 

Yes, we could be screwed with the exchange rate (very likely) but your numbers are off. 

 

We'll see when it drops here... Also Importers dont buy single items like us with no duties listed as a spare part. They buy in bulk with distribution in mind.

 

Customs works a little diffirent when you buy as Joe Soap some single chain vs Business buying containers full.

 

Customs have 2 elements as well Duties and Vat. In a case where distribution is concerned the container cant say "Birthday gift" like the chain you buy from CRC and not pay either

Edited May 12, 2020 by MTB-More

[Yyyy]

Shimano Deore FC-M6100 crankset  $94.99

Shimano Deore M6100 12-speed 10-51 cassette  $91.99

Shimano Deore CN-M6100 12-speed chain   $23.99

Shimano Deore RD-M6100-SGS rear derailleur   $54.99

Shimano Deore FC-M6100 shifter   $31.99  

 

 

Full Setup = $297.95 - R5512 odd @ 18.5 exchange rate

No Crank = $202.96 - R3755 odd @ 18.5 exchange rate

 

Please note this is the distribution price and most likely NOT the price in store as there will still be import duties and markup from your local store

 

So with a 15% import duty and a 20% markup (If you have a decent local store)

 

Full Setup = +- R7606 Exc Vat --- R8747 Inc Vat

No Crank = +- R5181 Exc Vat --- R5959 Inc Vat

 

Chainring not included extra on Full Setup R700 odd

Microspline not included at a extra R2000

 

Looking at a 8.7k - 12k to go 12 Speed Deore thats if you can do it all yourself and dont need a LBS to do it on your behalf as you would need to tention/feed the Jigwire, fit microspline, fit casette etc etc.

 

SRAM GX Eagle with Crank and Chainring on RRP comes in at R9000

 

https://www.cwcycles.co.za/product/sram-gx-eagle-dub-groupset-1x12

 

We will have to wait and see the local pricing BUT I can already see it being more expensive than a full GX setup by a long shot

 

if you look at whats available online, GX eagle is generally around the same price as XT and more expensive than SLX.

 

I am assuming the prices we see now online are based on the existing stock and at the prices these shops paid when the ZAR was stronger (before lock down)

 

Assuming the prices you have stated above are correct and we do see massive price hikes due to the exchange rate, you can expect price increases across all brands of groupsets to follow suit.

 

However if these stores are buying in bulk perhaps they getting it at a much cheaper price than the prices you quoting.

 

(Cant say for sure, dont have the inside info)

 

I think if things become too expensive and people may look towards alternative non mainstream groupsets in future......

My opinion, nothing wrong with the good old 2x or 1x 11 or 10 speed groupset.

[MORNE]

snip

 

if you say so lol...

 

https://www.evobikes.co.za/components/groupsets/shimano-slx-m7100-1x12-transmission-groupset.html

 

https://www.evobikes.co.za/components/groupsets/shimano-xt-m8100-1x12-transmission-groupset.html

 

 

also..you dont NEEED microspline ;-)

 

https://www.evobikes.co.za/components/groupsets/shimano-xtr-12-speed-upgrade-kit-with-sunrace-cassette.html

 

point is...it will come in cheaper than full SLX by probably the relative percentage difference between XT and SLX...that will already make it way cheaper than GX since SLX already is. But then again...SRAM will probably be forvced to drop the prices on those now.

 

 

and only the top of the line microspline freebodies go for ~2k, more like 1.5k if you know where to shop...like the hope ones etc. other options for generic hubs like novatech etc are also cheaper:

 

like: 

https://www.rapide.co.za/product/rapide-ultralight-pro-shimano-micro-spline-cassette-body/

or 

 

https://www.on-lynecomponents.com/products/jb01-free-hub-body-shimano-microspline

 

and at the top end

https://www.custombikes.co.za/collections/hope-spares/products/hub-spares-freehub-assembly-hope?variant=32041662382161

 

 

also...as mentioned....0% duties on spares. 

Edited May 12, 2020 by morneS555

[Grease_Monkey]

We'll see when it drops here... Also Importers dont buy single items like us with no duties listed as a spare part. They buy in bulk with distribution in mind.

 

Customes works a little diffirent when you buy as Joe Soap some single chain vs Business's buying a containers full. 

 

Customs works the same for distribution in mind. I imported and distributed bicycle parts for a while and was no charged a single Rand on duties, only VAT.

 

Like other mentioned, when distributers bring in GX Eagle parts at the new exchange rate the price will also jump dramatically. 

 

Not arguing with the fact that Deore won't be cheap, but relative to what other parts are going to cost it will be cheaper. The exchange rate is going to screw us with everything.

Edited May 12, 2020 by Grease_Monkey

[Captain Fastbastard Mayhem]

We'll see when it drops here... Also Importers dont buy single items like us with no duties listed as a spare part. They buy in bulk with distribution in mind.

 

Customs works a little diffirent when you buy as Joe Soap some single chain vs Business buying containers full.

 

Customs have 2 elements as well Duties and Vat. In a case where distribution is concerned the container cant say "Birthday gift" like the chain you buy from CRC and not pay either

Yes, and spare parts are not dutiable items. Whether you're a distro or joe soap, it doesn't matter. 

 

They'll still pay VAT on the value of the shipment plus 10%, but spare parts do NOT attract duties. 

[MORNE]

literally the only difference between distributors and 'joe soap' importers is the amount they are allowed to import. The rest is literally all the same.  As a distributor you give DHL/UPS/ARAMEX or whatever your import licence number when it hits the border either here or that side. As joe soap you give them your ID number. in the latter case you are limited to around R50k per year on your ID number before you will be forced by SARS to get an import licence....and in some cases 20k per order max, also usually no more than 3 orders a year....as long as it does not raise concerns about whether or not you want to resell it locally. I've been importing crap as a Joe soap since 2004 when the rand was sub 6 to the dollar....ahhh - good old days.

Edited May 12, 2020 by morneS555

[MTB-More]

I think I just need to rephrase. Import duties+Vat is 15%

15% is comprised in this regard as Vat and not duties.

 

On single imports you can get away the value being a lot less than ATV but on containers you can't as the value needs to be disclosed hence the 15% Duties+Vat (In parts case just Vat)

 

Long and short we the consumer are going to get screwed. The end

Edited May 12, 2020 by MTB-More

[Grease_Monkey]

I think I just need to rephrase. Import duties+Vat is 15%

15% is comprised in this regard as Vat and not duties.

 

On single imports you can get away the value being a lot less than ATV but on containers you can't as the value needs to be disclosed hence the 15% Duties+Vat (In parts case just Vat)

 

Long and short we the consumer are going to get screwed. The end

 

Can't argue with that.

[Captain Fastbastard Mayhem]

I think I just need to rephrase. Import duties+Vat is 15%

15% is comprised in this regard as Vat and not duties.

 

On single imports you can get away the value being a lot less than ATV but on containers you can't as the value needs to be disclosed hence the 15% Duties+Vat (In parts case just Vat)

 

Long and short we the consumer are going to get screwed. The end

ATV isn't a duty, though. All it does is increase VAT from 15% to 16.5%. 

 

Duties are added before VAT & ATV are calculated. With bike parts, frames, any spare part for the use on a bicycle, there are no duties. It IS an extra tax, of sorts, but it's not a duty. 

[MTB-More]

ATV isn't a duty, though. All it does is increase VAT from 15% to 16.5%. 

 

Duties are added before VAT & ATV are calculated. With bike parts, frames, any spare part for the use on a bicycle, there are no duties. It IS an extra tax, of sorts, but it's not a duty. 

 

Are you paying 15% more for the item to move though customs? Be it duties, vat, tax or your 40k post count to just post anything you possibly can to have a say? ... Yes

 

Duties in my mind is the complete process of item release. Sorry I didnt spell it out but the principle of the post was not to be exact with every possible regulation to calculate it to the cent but to give a overall feel for the price agains the current competition and pricepoint.

 

To be fair my post and your reply is moot as we will need to see what the local market prices it at so for all intentional purposes you are just pushing your post count and I am just thinking out load on a forum with no relevance to anything other than that. 

 

So maybe lets just move on

[Jensie]

This, paired with an XT shifter....

 

How much difference is the XT shifter compared to normal deore?? 

[Captain Fastbastard Mayhem]

How much difference is the XT shifter compared to normal deore?? 

Not a lot, but just enough to make a big diff in feel.

 

More changes per press on the downshift (1 on deore vs 3? on XT)

Metal thumb lever

Smoother actuation (bearings vs bushings)

 

It results in a slightly crisper & smoother feeling. 

Edited May 12, 2020 by Captain Fastbastard Mayhem

[MORNE]

Not a lot, but just enough to make a big diff in feel.

 

More changes per press on the downshift (1 on deore vs 3? on XT)

Metal thumb lever

Smoother actuation (bearings vs bushings)

 

It results in a slightly crisper & smoother feeling. 

yup. multi-shift up and down. 

[Jensie]

Not a lot, but just enough to make a big diff in feel.

 

More changes per press on the downshift (1 on deore vs 3? on XT)

Metal thumb lever

Smoother actuation (bearings vs bushings)

 

It results in a slightly crisper & smoother feeling. 

Thanks...