kosmonooit Posted July 18, 2021 Share You are forgetting cyclocross ... not quite mtb but true grit nevertheless, and pretty hardcore at times. World champ a few times if memory serves Happy for Ecuador! Edited July 18, 2021 by kosmonooit Long Wheel Base 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mountain Bru Posted July 18, 2021 Share 10 hours ago, dsw said: Vingegaard came in from the left. We will have to wait to see whether he can reproduce his current performance or whether he will be a one hit wonder like Tao G Hart. Ben O'Conner was a revelation but I do not consider him as a legitimate Grand Tour contender. I unfortunately think Vingegaard is going to be a bit of a one hit wonder too in terms of GC podiums. You can't just look at the results, but also how and when those results were obtained. Tao G won the Giro in probably the weakest field possible after all the Covid stories and Thomas etc crashing out. I mean 2nd and 3rd where Jai Hinley and Kelderman that year ????♂️. Mitchelton and Jumbo pulled their whole teams from the race. So yes, he won, but he's not a serious GC contender when the big boys come out to play. Even the year Carapaz won the Giro, I think he got a bit lucky not being marked closely enough when he was 2 minutes down, and then making all that time up on 1 stage. But a guy thats loosing 1:30 to his rivals in a 30km time trial is always going to struggle against the "favourites" like Pog, Rog or Bernal. Ben O'Conner got lucky this year too. Yes he finished 4th, but he was 10 minutes down, and that's after he made up 6 minutes on the stage he won when UAE didn't bother chasing him down in the break. If he was a serious contender, they'd have chased, and he'd likely have ended 16 minutes down in the end. So in my opinion, Jonas' coming second this year in a really weak field proves he's maybe on the "Mas, Lopez, Carapaz, Kelderman, etc" level, but he'll get smoked as soon as there's an uninjured Pog, Rog, Bernal, maybe even Thomas in the field. In previous years, if he finished 5:20 back on the leader, he'd have been 6th or 7th which I think is about right for him. DieselnDust 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dsw Posted July 18, 2021 Share 33 minutes ago, Eldron said: Cough cough mountain biking cough cough. WvA can certainly ride a bike well but with that glaring mtb omission in his plamares he is well behind MvdP on the most complete cyclist scale. Dammit, in my excitement about Wouts performances during the last week I clean forgot about mountainbiking It is such a small sport Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eldron Posted July 18, 2021 Share 1 minute ago, dsw said: Dammit, in my excitement about Wouts performances during the last week I clean forgot about mountainbiking It is such a small sport MvdP also has 1 more CX world title if memory serves. After the TdF I'll happily hand WvA best all round road rider title though. That was an incredible Tour for WvA! There are not enough superlatives! DieselnDust, justinafrika and Koos Likkewaan 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mountain Bru Posted July 18, 2021 Share Whats with all the kids on the podium? This might be an unpopular opinion, but I really don't think there should be kids up there. And as a sponsor, I'd be pissed if my guy, whose salary I pay so that he can be a billboard for my company, gets on the podium of the world's biggest bike race, and then covers up my brand with his kid. Even this?? Hard to say anything bad about WVA though justinafrika 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dsw Posted July 18, 2021 Share 10 minutes ago, kosmonooit said: You are forgetting cyclocross ... not quite mtb but true grit nevertheless, and pretty hardcore at times. World champ a few times if memory serves Happy for Ecuador! Yeah, he has been good and was one of the very few riders who dared to attack Progacor. He has now also become one of the few active riders in the world who has a podium finish in all 3 grand tours. Fantastic performance for a rider who comes from rural Equador where poverty is probably still very prevalent. Vetplant 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mountain Bru Posted July 18, 2021 Share 5 minutes ago, Eldron said: MvdP also has 1 more CX world title if memory serves. After the TdF I'll happily hand WvA best all round road rider title though. That was an incredible Tour for WvA! There are not enough superlatives! He's the Frans Steyn "utility back" of cycling. He won on Ventoux, in the TT, and in a bunch sprint in Paris. The man doesn't seem to understand that you're only supposed to be good at one thing. Vetplant, Eldron and justinafrika 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DieselnDust Posted July 18, 2021 Share 12 minutes ago, Mountain Bru said: Whats with all the kids on the podium? This might be an unpopular opinion, but I really don't think there should be kids up there. And as a sponsor, I'd be pissed if my guy, whose salary I pay so that he can be a billboard for my company, gets on the podium of the world's biggest bike race, and then covers up my brand with his kid. Even this?? Hard to say anything bad about WVA though That lady in the green dress is quite a looker.. Back to Wout https://www.cyclingnews.com/news/wout-van-aert-im-just-a-little-cyclist-compared-with-eddy-merckx/ He had his kid up there as he had limited time to spend with him due to his travel plan scheduling departure to Tokyo at 11:30pm tonight Edited July 18, 2021 by DieselnDust Vetplant and Long Wheel Base 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DieselnDust Posted July 18, 2021 Share 1 hour ago, Mountain Bru said: I unfortunately think Vingegaard is going to be a bit of a one hit wonder too in terms of GC podiums. You can't just look at the results, but also how and when those results were obtained. Tao G won the Giro in probably the weakest field possible after all the Covid stories and Thomas etc crashing out. I mean 2nd and 3rd where Jai Hinley and Kelderman that year ????♂️. Mitchelton and Jumbo pulled their whole teams from the race. So yes, he won, but he's not a serious GC contender when the big boys come out to play. Even the year Carapaz won the Giro, I think he got a bit lucky not being marked closely enough when he was 2 minutes down, and then making all that time up on 1 stage. But a guy thats loosing 1:30 to his rivals in a 30km time trial is always going to struggle against the "favourites" like Pog, Rog or Bernal. Ben O'Conner got lucky this year too. Yes he finished 4th, but he was 10 minutes down, and that's after he made up 6 minutes on the stage he won when UAE didn't bother chasing him down in the break. If he was a serious contender, they'd have chased, and he'd likely have ended 16 minutes down in the end. So in my opinion, Jonas' coming second this year in a really weak field proves he's maybe on the "Mas, Lopez, Carapaz, Kelderman, etc" level, but he'll get smoked as soon as there's an uninjured Pog, Rog, Bernal, maybe even Thomas in the field. In previous years, if he finished 5:20 back on the leader, he'd have been 6th or 7th which I think is about right for him. I'mnot sure we watched the same race. Let me offer an alternative pov and we can re-open the discussion at the next GT that Jonas Vingegoart participates in. Up until Stage 8, where Primoz basically bowed out Vingegoart was a few seconds ahead of Primoz and playing the wingman. His time loss on Stage 8 was more due to tactical indecision on the part of the team. He was 5min down from this point and basically yoyoed around that mark for the next 11 stages which is quite telling sine he didn't have the support until around Stage 13. It took TJV a while to regroup and decide on a course of action after Primoz realised he wasn't going to be a factor. Once they realigned and got their plan working Jonas delivered whereas Ben , Guillaume and others all fell away, including Dick Carapaz. TJV will certainly groom this young man and he'll likely come back next year as the planned back up for Primoz rather than super domestique. Its taken a few stages for Jonas to realise his own abilities. This will only increase his confdence. Vetplant, Danger Dassie, Eldron and 3 others 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris_ Posted July 19, 2021 Share 7 hours ago, Mountain Bru said: Whats with all the kids on the podium? This might be an unpopular opinion, but I really don't think there should be kids up there. And as a sponsor, I'd be pissed if my guy, whose salary I pay so that he can be a billboard for my company, gets on the podium of the world's biggest bike race, and then covers up my brand with his kid. Even this?? Hard to say anything bad about WVA though You're on your own with that one Long Wheel Base, Meezo, DieselnDust and 8 others 10 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vetplant Posted July 19, 2021 Share 6 hours ago, DieselnDust said: I'mnot sure we watched the same race. Let me offer an alternative pov and we can re-open the discussion at the next GT that Jonas Vingegoart participates in. Up until Stage 8, where Primoz basically bowed out Vingegoart was a few seconds ahead of Primoz and playing the wingman. His time loss on Stage 8 was more due to tactical indecision on the part of the team. He was 5min down from this point and basically yoyoed around that mark for the next 11 stages which is quite telling sine he didn't have the support until around Stage 13. It took TJV a while to regroup and decide on a course of action after Primoz realised he wasn't going to be a factor. Once they realigned and got their plan working Jonas delivered whereas Ben , Guillaume and others all fell away, including Dick Carapaz. TJV will certainly groom this young man and he'll likely come back next year as the planned back up for Primoz rather than super domestique. Its taken a few stages for Jonas to realise his own abilities. This will only increase his confdence. Yeah. Vingegaard beat Pog by 25s in the TT and was able to stick with Pog on the climbs when no-one else but Carapaz could. TJV will be very pleased with what they have found in Jonas. He might be a good option as the main protected rider at the Giro next year and then co-leader for Primos later at the TDF. DieselnDust and CraigT48 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jewbacca Posted July 19, 2021 Share I dig seeing the kids on the podium with their dads. It shows a very human side to the athletes. If I was a sponsor and my athlete was on the podium beaming proudly while his kids looked on proudly I would be so stoked. Family, love and solidity is so important. Sponsors, organisers and fans should embrace the human element of the riders. All too often we as fans are so hyper critical of their performances as athletes we forget they are just vulnerable humans who are just exceptional at cycling. The racist and just plain nasty comments coming out of the Euros proves that fans get so caught up in the game and the performances they forget these guys actually have feelings, families and their own issues. I'd also like to add that 3 weeks in a team/race bubble, with how long before the race? Some of these guys probably haven't seen or held their kids for a long time. I start getting anxious after 3 days away from my boy. I'd never be able to live in a world that judges me so hard so openly. I'm glad I don't have fans who tell me my family detracts from getting on the podium of a sport event Edited July 19, 2021 by Jewbacca bubble life Long Wheel Base, DJuice, Vetplant and 12 others 15 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robbie Stewart Posted July 19, 2021 Share If I am expected to support a company that values branding over family then my wallet will remain firmly shut. These riders on the podiums have done enough to be brand ambassadors for the 3 weeks they spent riding the Tour, and if their sponsors would be so selfish to not allow the kids on the podium then perhaps its time to relook the sponsorship deal and align with a company that has better values. The sacrifices made by the riders in being away from their loved ones, not just during the race, but also during lead-up training and the entire season as a whole means that any time to celebrate should include the families who also give up of their time with the sponsored riders so that they can train for the possibility of standing on the podium at the end. To us as viewers its a sport. To the riders its a life and essentially their jobs. If my boss expects me to shaft my family in the interest of the bottom line then he should know that I'm leaving the first chance I get. 9 hours ago, Mountain Bru said: Whats with all the kids on the podium? This might be an unpopular opinion, but I really don't think there should be kids up there. And as a sponsor, I'd be pissed if my guy, whose salary I pay so that he can be a billboard for my company, gets on the podium of the world's biggest bike race, and then covers up my brand with his kid. Long Wheel Base, Escapee.., CraigT48 and 6 others 8 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
'Dale Posted July 19, 2021 Share 9 hours ago, Mountain Bru said: Whats with all the kids on the podium? This might be an unpopular opinion, but I really don't think there should be kids up there. And as a sponsor, I'd be pissed if my guy, whose salary I pay so that he can be a billboard for my company, gets on the podium of the world's biggest bike race, and then covers up my brand with his kid. Even this?? Hard to say anything bad about WVA though It’s a nomadic lifestyle, the WorldTour. Maybe home for 1/2 of the year, even less so being in a biosecure environment. Performance challenges may not be what keeps many talented athletes out of the team room; the lifestyle is a major variable. After 3 weeks of crashing, cold, heat and luxury prison living (hotels), all that an athlete needs is the touch of home. ???? Jewbacca, CraigT48, FootballingCyclist and 6 others 9 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FootballingCyclist Posted July 19, 2021 Share 14 hours ago, Vetplant said: Yellow Jersey, White Jersey? Polka Dots anywhere? Onderbroek? His left shoe was white with red polka dots. Edited July 19, 2021 by FootballingCyclist Vetplant 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kosmonooit Posted July 19, 2021 Share 41 minutes ago, Jewbacca said: I dig seeing the kids on the podium with their dads. It shows a very human side to the athletes. If I was a sponsor and my athlete was on the podium beaming proudly while his kids looked on proudly I would be so stoked. Family, love and solidity is so important. Sponsors, organisers and fans should embrace the human element of the riders. All too often we as fans are so hyper critical of their performances as athletes we forget they are just vulnerable humans who are just exceptional at cycling. The racist and just plain nasty comments coming out of the Euros proves that fans get so caught up in the game and the performances they forget these guys actually have feelings, families and their own issues. I'd also like to add that 3 weeks in a team/race bubble, with how long before the race? Some of these guys probably haven't seen or held their kids for a long time. I start getting anxious after 3 days away from my boy. I'd never be able to live in a world that judges me so hard so openly. I'm glad I don't have fans who tell me my family detracts from getting on the podium of a sport event Ditto and and with Wout having to gap it to CDG to fly to Tokyo 4 hours later, time with family was very precious for him, I think it was great to see. Also Richard's kids, they must have come a long way. Vetplant, Long Wheel Base, Scary Rider and 1 other 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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