Cyclists' Safety in the light of Burry and other's recent deaths - Merged Thread.

[megdobson]

We can make as many rules as we like there are still going to be people who break them whether it be the cyclist or the car user and the cyclist is always going to come off second best.

[Headshot]

Popcorn time.

 

But here are the first principles:

 

The first principle of road use is SAFETY. You cannot pass other vehicle, until it is SAFE to do so. You must drive at a SAFE speed. Even if you have right of way at a intersection, you may only proceed once you have determined that it is SAFE to do so.

 

Now safety means, safe for all road users. So if you are on a bicycle, motor cycle, motor car, truck G6 artillery piece ext, SAFETY comes first. If some one gets hurt on the road it is because this rule was violated.

 

Second principle, a vehicle has the right to the entire lane. Cyclists are instructed to stay left as far as it is SAFE to do so. This does not remove their right to the entire lane.

 

Third principle, when passing another vehicle (this includes bicycles and motor bicycles), you must leave the lane, when it is safe to do so and pass the vehicle in front of you and the then return to the lane. THIS IS IGNORED BY MOTOR VEHICLES.

 

Fouth principle, you may not pass a vehicle busy passing another vehicle. So if two cyclists are abreast, you must assume one is passing the other. If it is obvious this is not the case, then you should pass by leaving the lane, when it is sfae to do so, and then pass the two vehicles.

 

Another point, it is interesting that of the 1400 people killed this holiday so many (almost all) where in motor vehicles. Obvious proof that motorcar drivers cause more accidents than any other road users? ANd even more surprising is the majority where HEAD ON COLLISIONS. Which just proves that motorists have some real issues.

 

The most senisble post in the entire thread IMO. Safety first. So much agro and unpleasantness in this thread. Do road cyclists behave any worse here than in Europe for instance? I hear tales of infinite patience from motorists when waiting to pass cyclists on busy alpine passes. Where is the patience here?

 

Most of the posts start with a fallacious premis - that cyclists behaviour somehow contributes to fatal accidents and respect is somehow earned, ie if roadies don't do bunches and stick to red lights, motorists will somehow drive more carefully. This is nonsense. As someone else has pointed out, there is little if any correlation between cyclits breaking the law and fatal accidents.

 

I used to commute via motorcycle years ago. Always headlight on high beam. Still came close to a serious accident when a car cut me off. I drive thousands of km a year but have never had a problem with a cyclist. After ten Argus tours I have given up riding on the road because of motorist behavior. I was hit while out on my MTB in the 1990's - broad daylight. I had right of way, car simply cut me off. I could have ended up like Burry, but luckily flew over the car hood and did a full 360, ended up with minor injuries and walked home.

 

Why blame has to be apportioned to cyclists because some break the road rules makes little sense to me. Cyclists deaths and accidents with cars are not in the main due to cyclsits breaking rules. They are due to negligent car driving and drunk drivers.

 

By all means ride your bike lawfully, with courtesy and consideration but don't expect that to make a jot of difference to your chance of getting hit by a car. Even a minor contact can be fatal for the far lighter more exposed biker/cyclist. You are less visible on your bike and motorists arent attuned to look for cyclists.

[scotty]

Recall Shaun H's Sign-Up initiative, lots of verbal support and encouragement but when it came to putting money to mouth uttering's by sponsoring signs and buying Sign-Up kit, suddenly there was silence.

 

Perhaps it's different this time round and i hope to be proved wrong but me thinks not.

[Slowbee]

Did ShaunH not have that triangle logo thingy ? It is on the back of my hub shirt.

 

Think Bike also did a run of shirts at one stage or other, have one of those t(w)(o)o.

[SwissVan]

I just dont see the point of this topic, in fact every time i see the heading pop up and read the OP i get a bit irritated

 

Yeah i know maybe its the way I interpret it and if you dont like dont read it...

 

Sorry OP if this ruffles a feather or to, just saying

[BergForce]

Knowing what exactly happened is normally necessary to come to grips with the grief. I want to know as much as possible about the accident and the injuries.

Edited January 7, 2013 by Berg Bok

['Dale]

Knowing what exactly happened is normally necessary to come to grips with the grief. I want to know as much as possible about the accident and the injuries.

 

Information does go a long way for closure to be reached.

 

The matter is formally being investigated.

The contributions here are mere speculation but the process of debate and chit chat helps to heal.

[flyguysa]

I went to the memorial ride yesterday and saw exactly where this tragedy took place. The road is close to a perfect road for cycling, nice yellow lane, smooth tar, and reasonably flat. The taxi was traveling in the opposite direction to Burry. With all the holiday traffic on the roads, the taxis were apparently taking a detour through the suburbs to miss the traffic lights and congestion around the Shelley Beach Mall. Burry was travelling North and the taxi South, the taxi turned right, over a solid white line straight into Burry's path. From where the actual impact happend, it looks to me like Burry was in the yellow lane and tried to swerve left (in the same direction of the taxi), but got blocked off. All this not even 100m from his shop, that is how close he was to finishing the ride....

 

 

I am of the opinion that it is 100% the fault of the taxi driver, firstly crossing a solid white line and secondly, not even looking out for cyclists at an intersection. I sincerely hope the Law takes It's course and makes an example of him. I think that is the only way to create awareness amongst those who have no regard for the Rules of the Road is to punish them to the maximum.

[Weight Weenie]

Apparently the driver has been left off with a warning until 22 March and the case postponed.

[Jaco-fiets]

Unfortunately discrimination in this country carries a higher penalty than murder

[awesme]

sad,

 

so that he can probably get back into his taxi and do it again, by accident.

 

G

 

Apparently the driver has been left off with a warning until 22 March and the case postponed.

[peadar]

Following the tragic passing away of Burry Stander I cannot stop to think of what can be done.

So many emotions running though my head. For the first time I have thought of selling my bikes but what good will that do.

What can we do about this problem we are facing? Not just as Cyclists but as pedestrians and alike.

 

In some many ways everyone has to play a part. For the purpose of this article I will just say cyclists and motorists.

 

There is a huge drive for this 1.5m distance between cyclist and motorist this is all good and will create an awareness. This if passed and adhered to will make some difference. However! I do feel it is way bigger and deeper than that. Look I’m not slating the proposal of it (as I am fully committed to it and love to have this law passed) but we need to get to the route of the problem. If a motorist can’t even obey the law of stopping at a red robot or not driving in the yellow lane what is to stop them to adhere to the 1.5m rule.

 

The lack of law or implementation of it is shocking!

 

Let’s start at the beginning getting your drivers license. Today it’s very easy to get your license all depends how deep your pockets go. So now we have a lot of bought licenses out there.

Report the offenders giving the drivers tests! Have them pay a fine or lose the jobs! This is way bigger than a stupid paper saying you have a drivers license its safety on the roads they are playing with. At the end of the day some one’s life is worth R50 to the examiner!? Pass the learners of the skills and not on payments.

 

The Driver said he never saw Stander. In the K53 it does state proceed in turning once you have looked at your blind spots and all around you then if it is safe turn do so. This simple act would have saved plenty of life’s. fine the Taxi association on every accident caused by a Taxi (they are not a law on to them self’s).

 

Cyclists need to ride more aware and obey the rules of the road too.

In other countries it’s a serious offense to hit a pedestrian or cyclist and the driver will pay. Can S.A not adopt this attitude! Just look at how long the Jub Jub trial lasted! Discussing!!

 

Something needs to be done!

 

Any comments?

[Stretch]

I went to the memorial ride yesterday and saw exactly where this tragedy took place. The road is close to a perfect road for cycling, nice yellow lane, smooth tar, and reasonably flat. The taxi was traveling in the opposite direction to Burry. With all the holiday traffic on the roads, the taxis were apparently taking a detour through the suburbs to miss the traffic lights and congestion around the Shelley Beach Mall. Burry was travelling North and the taxi South, the taxi turned right, over a solid white line straight into Burry's path. From where the actual impact happend, it looks to me like Burry was in the yellow lane and tried to swerve left (in the same direction of the taxi), but got blocked off. All this not even 100m from his shop, that is how close he was to finishing the ride....

 

 

I am of the opinion that it is 100% the fault of the taxi driver, firstly crossing a solid white line and secondly, not even looking out for cyclists at an intersection. I sincerely hope the Law takes It's course and makes an example of him. I think that is the only way to create awareness amongst those who have no regard for the Rules of the Road is to punish them to the maximum.

 

all reports seem to say that the taxi was travelling in the same direction- was the opposite confirmed at the ride yesterday? The Witness newspaper had a photo of the spot in the paper today

[Bianchi]

Apparently the driver has been left off with a warning until 22 March and the case postponed.

 

Sources?

<snipped>

I asked, chances are he was released without a bail request and requested to appear in court on the next date of appearance.

Edited January 7, 2013 by Bianchi

[Karooryder]

Please don't turn this into where it's undoubtedly headed.

Edited January 7, 2013 by Karooryder

[Bianchi]

all reports seem to say that the taxi was travelling in the same direction- was the opposite confirmed at the ride yesterday? The Witness newspaper had a photo of the spot in the paper today

 

If a car turns left in front of you and you t-bone him, the impact wouldn't be all that great, since all the momentum is going in one direction (taxi - bike)

If a car turns right in front of you and you t-bone him, momentum from both directions will result in a combined speed of the taxi + the bike.