Discovery Health - Vitality & Team Vitality plus everything else you need to know

[shaper]

Yeah, there is that danger, unfortunately. Again, possibly alleviated by improved education and access to unemployment, together with the rampant drug & crime problems those sectors of the population have to deal with (those with truly nothing, that is)

I foresee... open bank account, get shares, sell shares, spend money irrationally.... X months time complain of no upliftment and continued economic disadvantages.

 

The majority of who this targets have no idea with regard to saving or building wealth, they live hand to mouth... and will see this just as free money...

Edited November 16, 2018 by shaper

[Captain Fastbastard Mayhem]

BOOOOOM 

 

For me i hope there is something for my children going forward, all this wealth disparity seems the thing to do now but is there a goal, is there a timeline? where does the line get drawn?

 

Going forward what happens to the 8% of unemployed whites, does that now go for a ball of **** now, im all for changing the 40% unemployment rate but i honestly think the higher powers can think of innovative ways that do not take from one to pay for the other. It really is a mess and why i say that its because the same higher powers i talk about are the same people deep in corruption and scandals and and and. Arrrrg im gonna go ride my bike when i leave work lol - feeling sad.

Yeah, I get that. I have that thought, too... But then I remember that I can afford to buy some Disco shares, I have a few Ripple stashed away waiting for the boom to come again, I have educational cover for my lightie should things go to pot, and I have a decent income to pay for things that, quite frankly, 70% (conservative estimate) of the population can't afford. 

 

So then I think to myself - is this really inconveniencing ME? Or is it allowing someone else, who may not be able to do any of the stuff I can, and who is living on earnings of ZAR200 or less per day, to get a bit of a leg up?

[Captain Fastbastard Mayhem]

I foresee... open bank account, get shares, sell shares, spend money irrationally.... X months time complain of no upliftment and continued economic disadvantages.

 

The majority of who this targets have no idea with regard to saving or building wealth, they live hand to mouth... and will see this just as free money...

there may well be a certain timeline attached to the share ownership. Like, they only vest in 5 years, 10 years etc etc. Again - I don't know the intricacies of the thing, but I'd be surprised if there wasn't some sort of prevention in place for things like that. 

 

There will be people like that, though, for sure. I just hope that they are in a miniscule minority. Call me naive, but it's what I hope. 

[Vetplant]

EDIT EDIT: Whose to say that there won't be a socio-economic / earnings scale for this share incentive scheme? Those with higher earnings receive fewer shares, those with lower, more... I don't know the intricacies of the scheme, nor do I expect I ever will, unless AG does an interview explaining the whole thing (which he might) but it is a possibility that they may have considered. 

This is an unknown currently, so kudo's to them if they do choose to implement it like that.

 

As I have come to experience Discovery, there will be allot of T's and C's in this scheme, so very likely that they already have it in there...

[Rob K]

Discovery is discriminating against people based on the colour of their skin, which is otherwise known as racism.

 

When companies the size of Discovery join in the racism rhetoric - the ruling party have done their job.

 

This is exactly what happened in Zimbabwe and we know how that ended.

[Neverfit]

Yeah, I get that. I have that thought, too... But then I remember that I can afford to buy some Disco shares, I have a few Ripple stashed away waiting for the boom to come again, I have educational cover for my lightie should things go to pot, and I have a decent income to pay for things that, quite frankly, 70% (conservative estimate) of the population can't afford. 

 

So then I think to myself - is this really inconveniencing ME? Or is it allowing someone else, who may not be able to do any of the stuff I can, and who is living on earnings of ZAR200 or less per day, to get a bit of a leg up?

I get your argument, and agree, in part, with your point of view. The bold section though is an assumption. The "qualifying" factor is not your income - but your skin color.

If it were to benefit the poor/needy - then let THAT be your entry point, not your race.

[madmarc]

Sorry, what?! Have you not read what I've said? I've said that I recognise the other side of the coin, have considered it and have determined that the benefits of what they're doing in an attempt to alleviate wealth disparity overcome the negatives. Therefore I support the initiative, but I recognise that some people may not. And I'm fine with that. 

 

As for the telling clients they would be foolish to cancel just because Disco Bank will be earmarking 10% of its share allocation towards social upliftment of a historically disadvantaged subset of the population, whose unemployment and average earning figures are FAR worse than those complaining about this whole thing, damn right I would. If a product works, it works. A share incentive scheme that you (the client) disagrees with doesn't change that. I work on determining the ideal policy structure, efficiency, product and price for a particular client, based on their circumstances. This changes none of that, and I'd be failing in my job as a Financial Advisor if I did otherwise. 

 

 

As for the italicized bit - are you sure, cos this only came to light on Wednesday. A lot of people are trying to reduce their outgoings, and generally life assurance and med aid are the first items on the chopping block. I'm also certain that that is a hyperbole. 

I have no doubt that this was deeply considered, and this blowback (as small as it probably is) was considered as well. 

 

"As small as it is" taken to mean that those who are making a noise on social media are, in my opinion, a very small set of society, and probably not even Discovery clients. 

 

EDIT: Improperly placed apostrophe. My pet hate. Grrrr. Also removed something that didn't need to be there. 

 

EDIT EDIT: Whose to say that there won't be a socio-economic / earnings scale for this share incentive scheme? Those with higher earnings receive fewer shares, those with lower, more... I don't know the intricacies of the scheme, nor do I expect I ever will, unless AG does an interview explaining the whole thing (which he might) but it is a possibility that they may have considered. 

 

Still doesn't change the fact that its racist. Something that we don't need in this country right now. Support or not support i suppose is everyone right, I for one wont support a racist company because i'm not a racist, anyone that does is a racist in my eyes.

 

Or maybe its white guilt, or maybe its just another White monopoly capitalist company honing on the growing black rand. Who Knows ?

 

If i was a black dude, poor or rich, i'd be insulted.

 

The biggest mistake the capitalist world has made in Africa is creating these schemes of aid and assistance in the name of closing the poverty gap. They've turned the continent into a continent of "Entitlement" its gone from expecting it for free to demanding it for free.

 

This is just another one of those schemes - But it will fail just like every other BBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBEEEEEEEEEEEEE scheme has failed to uplift the poor black people and succeeded in making the few rich black dudes even richer.

[Captain Fastbastard Mayhem]

I get your argument, and agree, in part, with your point of view. The bold section though is an assumption. The "qualifying" factor is not your income - but your skin color.

If it were to benefit the poor/needy - then let THAT be your entry point, not your race.

yeah, true - but the point is, as well, that the overwhelming majority of people in that and worse positions are black south africans. The data on that is irrefutable, and it's bloody depressing at times. Imagine what could have been, with proper education and diversion of funds away from the pockets of the greedy. 

[Craai]

Still doesn't change the fact that its racist. Something that we don't need in this country right now. Support or not support i suppose is everyone right, I for one wont support a racist company because i'm not a racist, anyone that does is a racist in my eyes.

 

Or maybe its white guilt, or maybe its just another White monopoly capitalist company honing on the growing black rand. Who Knows ?

 

If i was a black dude, poor or rich, i'd be insulted.

 

The biggest mistake the capitalist world has made in Africa is creating these schemes of aid and assistance in the name of closing the poverty gap. They've turned the continent into a continent of "Entitlement" its gone from expecting it for free to demanding it for free.

 

This is just another one of those schemes - But it will fail just like every other BBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBEEEEEEEEEEEEE scheme has failed to uplift the poor black people and succeeded in making the few rich black dudes even richer.

Better get off this site then too dude; There are racists on this site and you being here makes you a racist as well Edited November 16, 2018 by Craai

[madmarc]

Better get off this site then too dude; There are racists on this site and you being here makes you a racist as well

 

How so ?

[Captain Fastbastard Mayhem]

Still doesn't change the fact that its racist. Something that we don't need in this country right now. Support or not support i suppose is everyone right, I for one wont support a racist company because i'm not a racist, anyone that does is a racist in my eyes.

 

but is it racist? I can still buy shares in the company. I still have access to them, little though my affordability may be. A section of the shares is being allocated to those who historically and currently would not be able to get access to them, in exchange for signing up for a bank account which they also may not have had access to in the past, for various reasons. 

 

That those shares are given out, free of charge, is what is being railed against. 

 

If I couldn't invest in the company, if the shares (on the open market) were not available to me or you, THEN I'd agree with you. But in my opinion, this is a corporate social responsibility thing aimed at the people who need it. 

 

Those people in the middle and upper echelons who would benefit from this are still in teh minority. The black middle class makes up more than the entire white population, true. But that's still not even 10% of SA. Maybe let's be generous, and say the entire middle class & up represents 25% of the population (when the unemployment figure is upwards of 40%, this is a distinct possibility when the rest are either kids or pensioners) but I don't have the actual figures to hand, so this is an educated guess at best.

 

Should something not be done to help the rest? The 75% that are either unemployed or pensioners, or living in squalor, earning a fraction of what we are?

 

I think this is one of those things that will help those people. Especially if it helps them improve their financial standing, and - like the promise of the bank itself - teaches them about responsible handling of finances. 

 

FWIW - % of the white population unemployed = 8% (iirc)

That, of a demographic that makes up 8.9% of the population.

 

Therefore - unemployed white pop = 0.712% of the population. 

[shaper]

 

 

Should something not be done to help the rest?

 

 

You cannot help the rest if they do not want to be helped or take responsibility...... the rest just want something for nothing and believe they are entitled to it!!

 

Fundamentals need to change... by starting off and telling the "entitled" that they are entitled to nothing.... but if they are willing to work for it and uplift themselves then they will get assistance..... pretty much what happens in the developed economies of the world !!

Edited November 16, 2018 by shaper

[madmarc]

but is it racist? 

 

Yes of course. You cannot sugar coat it. You exclude people on the color of their skin its racism pure and simple. no matter what the color is.

 

Exclude the rich .....make it easier for the poor to get a leg up...now we talking, i'll open an account tomorrow, i'll support any company that's trying to make a difference to the poor across the board even though they exclude me.

 

Same as government pensions - If you earn a private pension or income over a certain amount you don't qualify for state pension. Its not a color thing.

[Captain Fastbastard Mayhem]

Maybe it's a way to adhere to some shareholding requirement of opening a new bank, in that they needed to ensure a certain base level of black share ownership, and not just giving them to a few directors / key persons / employees

Edited November 16, 2018 by Cptmayhem

[Gen]

Maybe it's a way to adhere to some shareholding requirement of opening a new bank, in that they needed to ensure a certain base level of black share ownership, and not just giving them to a few directors / key persons / employees

This is most likely what it is.

 

BUT

 

DISC target market is not those who need uplifting...so Discovery that is a bad spin on a shite argument... those who need uplifting send "pls call me's" from button phones.

 

Edit..

 

 

The fat cats on numerous gravy trains will be first to open disc accounts to get their hands on those free shares.

Edited November 16, 2018 by Gen

[Captain Fastbastard Mayhem]

This is most likely what it is.

 

BUT

 

DISC target market is not those who need uplifting...so Discovery that is a bad spin on a shite argument... those who need uplifting send "pls call me's" from button phones.

 

 

The fat cats on numerous gravy trains will be first to open disc accounts..

Lol. I've already put my name on the list. Definitely taking up this offer of the bank, and I'll buy some shares as well.

 

 

Edit: yes, those that most need it probably won't see it, safly

Edited November 16, 2018 by Cptmayhem