Kevin Evans accepts doping charge

[Thor Buttox]

I agree with you that measured performance does predict capabilities. But measured against a set of constants. You need to limit the variables to increase accuracy of the measurement.

 

Also, people mustn't now go and assume that I'm claiming that there is no merit in climb comparisons, but if you want to measure climb comparisons you need to take the variables into account.

 

Eg. If Froome climbed Ventoux in 45mins in 2015 during the Tour and again climbed it in 45mins at a training camp in 2016, you cannot with certainty say that his capabilities were identical in both attempts based purely on ascent times. You have to take other factors into consideration.

So 2+2 is only 4 under certain conditions..

[rouxtjie]

Man, this bust has really showed some of the pro's / industry players's true colours(for both sides of the coin I might add). From current pro's, magazines, journos, retailers, event organizers, product agents. 

Edited January 21, 2016 by rouxtjie

[DIPSLICK]

So 2+2 is only 4 under certain conditions..

Bwhaaaaaa,

We HUBBERS are strange creatures indeed, we agree on something, so that's no fun so then we look at angles to agree to disagree, knowing we mostly agree.

[DIPSLICK]

Tumbles brother newds to do some homework on ozone therapy and ts acceptance in conventional medicine... I thought KE had just made a typo and he was referring to the blood transfusions - I should pay closer attention sometimes - my BS alarm should go off faster.

50cc,,,,,I don't know how you can actually concentrate with your BS alarm going off as much as it does, I think you enjoy the few seconds a day that you have when that alarm is being fixed. Play nice now boys tomorrow is Friday

[tubed]

I am trying to figure this all out, so maybe writing it out helps me.

Some years ago the former big time pro gets done for EPO – finally, the sponsor clique gets partially shattered, the former teammates/ movie producers are aghast and so the process starts.

Recently the upstart from KZN gets pinged for the same – embarrassing defences aside, it seems he wasn’t the brightest of the bunch. The process is in full swing.

Then another finding and this time the excuse is convoluted, almost tugging at the heart strings. Tight circle is still aghast, lines are drawn supporters vs cynics. More to come it seems.

Then the fun starts:

The guy who has always supplied lots of the bikes is unhappy, especially with the ‘journos’. Threats.

The ‘journos’ are up against the sports scientists who stick to the facts and keep asking so many irritating questions. (isn’t that what journos are supposed to do?)

The ‘journos’ are turning against each other, because the free Oakleys, event invites, product launches etc have compromised them and nobody knows who’s friends with who and who said what, all of a sudden the ‘integrity’ of the journos is seen to be in question! Shock and horror, so did that pic of you in a sponsored jersey or those new shoes mean you cant really say too much about that distributors riders.

The current riders then have their own conflicts, so its OK to go after that big bike distributor or ex rider, but hey wait you have just hitched your desperate plea for a sponsor to the controversial supplement supplier. Now put aside the fact that the product supplier and their two brands are the primary sponsor of supplements to a host of pinged athletes and former brand ambassadors, you need the cash and the Epic entry, so you jump on board – ask no questions, tell no lies.

Then there is the biggest mtb race, unquestionable ethics thus far and quick to turn on and disqualify some of the dopers above, but in this age of dwindling sponsors, up pops the guy with the aggressive marketing for his supplements and you too have a new event sponsor.

Just my humble opinion – because it seems everyone has one. The only professionals here are the sports scientists, they are sticking to the facts.

If I were advising a young rider, I would say get yourself an education and a profession or a trade, something honourable, because this mess aint going to get sorted out for some time and so when someone offers you a box of free supplements and an entry to an event – you can say yes OK or no thanks. But when you can only say yes OK, then you are along for the ride and all that comes with it.

 

​

[raptor-22]

You applying the wrong formula.

 

2a+2a=4a where a is a variable

Other applicable formulae would be

 

2a+2b =2(a+b)

 

2a x 2b=4ab

 

Where a is not = to b

a is a variable

b is a variable

[NotSoBigBen]

And so the 'useful' contributions dry up ..... ah well it will now be relegated to the also rans and I will patiently await the 'imminent' next announcements 

[Thor Buttox]

Bwhaaaaaa,

We HUBBERS are strange creatures indeed, we agree on something, so that's no fun so then we look at angles to agree to disagree, knowing we mostly agree.

Unfortunately some angles are really obtuse.

[Tumbleweed]

You applying the wrong formula.

 

2a+2a=4a where a is a variable

Other applicable formulae would be

 

2a+2b =2(a+b)

 

2a x 2b=4ab

 

Where a is not = to b

a is a variable

b is a variable

 

So, basically, you're saying something doesn't add up?

[raptor-22]

I am trying to figure this all out, so maybe writing it out helps me.

Some years ago the former big time pro gets done for EPO – finally, the sponsor clique gets partially shattered, the former teammates/ movie producers are aghast and so the process starts.

Recently the upstart from KZN gets pinged for the same – embarrassing defences aside, it seems he wasn’t the brightest of the bunch. The process is in full swing.

Then another finding and this time the excuse is convoluted, almost tugging at the heart strings. Tight circle is still aghast, lines are drawn supporters vs cynics. More to come it seems.

Then the fun starts:

The guy who has always supplied lots of the bikes is unhappy, especially with the ‘journos’. Threats.

The ‘journos’ are up against the sports scientists who stick to the facts and keep asking so many irritating questions. (isn’t that what journos are supposed to do?)

The ‘journos’ are turning against each other, because the free Oakleys, event invites, product launches etc have compromised them and nobody knows who’s friends with who and who said what, all of a sudden the ‘integrity’ of the journos is seen to be in question! Shock and horror, so did that pic of you in a sponsored jersey or those new shoes mean you cant really say too much about that distributors riders.

The current riders then have their own conflicts, so its OK to go after that big bike distributor or ex rider, but hey wait you have just hitched your desperate plea for a sponsor to the controversial supplement supplier. Now put aside the fact that the product supplier and their two brands are the primary sponsor of supplements to a host of pinged athletes and former brand ambassadors, you need the cash and the Epic entry, so you jump on board – ask no questions, tell no lies.

Then there is the biggest mtb race, unquestionable ethics thus far and quick to turn on and disqualify some of the dopers above, but in this age of dwindling sponsors, up pops the guy with the aggressive marketing for his supplements and you too have a new event sponsor.

Just my humble opinion – because it seems everyone has one. The only professionals here are the sports scientists, they are sticking to the facts.

If I were advising a young rider, I would say get yourself an education and a profession or a trade, something honourable, because this mess aint going to get sorted out for some time and so when someone offers you a box of free supplements and an entry to an event – you can say yes OK or no thanks. But when you can only say yes OK, then you are along for the ride and all that comes with it.

 

​

 

And fans of brand/event /product /rider all believe whatever is their favourite cannot be part of the problem because (pick one)

 

- They're in it for the love

- Their smile is infectious and therefore must be good / decent

- Aren't interested in making money, the love brings the money

- Are never aware of whats going on around them

- Are just innocent victims of someone else's greed

[raptor-22]

So, basically, you're saying something doesn't add up?

Only when you don't know, want to know, or can't understand what a or b is

[Patchelicious]

Man, this bust has really showed some of the pro's / industry players's true colours(for both sides of the coin I might add). From current pro's, magazines, journos, retailers, event organizers, product agents.

The one good things that's seems to be happening is the very aggressive condemnation by some pros on those being caught. Before not much was said. I like that this is changing.

 

Its not much, but it's something positive.

[Paul Ruinaard]

Cheap is relative. Most South Aftican Pro cyclists probably couldn't afford your monthly coffee bill. Most white collar professionals aged 30-50 (Vets) probably could.

 

Also the risk, if you get caught using HGH at a race, you wouldn't lose your medical license, pro cyclists would.

 

Surely it's not hard to see that the barrier to entry and risks is lower for Vets to dope. Again not saying that they do, but that's it's just less off a mission for them too if they choose to do so. They also have less incentive to do so, it's only competitive nature that drives them, not a need to maintain their jobs, so it's not all against them

Been saying this a long time on all these threads since the pre-Lance days.

 

If you had to get most of the faster guys in the field (lets say A bunch and Vets)  and run some tests on them I predict you would be shocked what you would find. I reckon they could melt the test tubes with some of the concoctions they are using.

 

These guys are cheque book warriors and as such there is no risk to them as you point out. And no real desire to police them as well, because its just recreational sports.

 

A lot of the stories are anecdotal and there are some pretty lurid ones at that, and some are not so anecdotal and you sit there thinking "Did I really see that?"

[ChUkKy]

The one good things that's seems to be happening is the very aggressive condemnation by some pros on those being caught. Before not much was said. I like that this is changing.

 

Its not much, but it's something positive.

 

Hmmm, until they themselves get caught 

Maybe its easy to spot the dopers, they dont shout so loud when their mates get bust

[NotSoBigBen]

Hmmm, until they themselves get caught 

Maybe its easy to spot the dopers, they dont shout so loud when their mates get bust

 

I'm not so sure, as I've said many times I am most suspicious of those who shout the most ......

[Patchelicious]

So 2+2 is only 4 under certain conditions..

Hahaha I dig this place ????????????