NicoBoshoff Posted May 3, 2017 Share Nige I saw a comment from some guy from Fort Bill - on how the weather forecast predicted howling winds at 4. They reduced the practice sessions and brought everything forward - i.e. adjusted the schedule. This was for the world enduro series...would that not have been allowed for the world cup?It was for the BDS not EWS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nigelhicks Posted May 3, 2017 Share yeah, but as a top qualifier I think you earned the right choose your race day strategy, i.e. if it looks like the weather is going to act up, you ought to be allowed to take your run earlier in the line-up.This sounds like a great plan in theory - but would not work in reality. The issue again comes down to broadcasting and race organisation (for spectator value) logistics.If the event is being aired live - then the camera crews would need to film every rider, with the producing team then having to pick and choose who would be in the broadcast - this would mean they would have to actually show ALL 80 riders as you have no idea if someone is going to better say Minnaars time if he went early ... Freecaster tried this and it was a failure as tv viewers got bored after 30 minutes of watching ... Also from a spectator valueship perspective the format as is - slowest to fastest seeding gives the viewers an edge of your seat type of participation in the race - as you know the top women and guys (who have the best chance of winning) come down last .... so its knife-edge stuff seeing if they will beat the time set on the board ....If riders could choose - then it would end up being a damp squid - as say Loic and all the hotshots come down early and smash it - leaving behind the remainder 60-80 seeded qualifiers - the event would stagnate, and no one would stay to watch .......Pretty much what the rain caused on the weekend.But weather like that is not the norm ... BaGearA 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Odinson Posted May 3, 2017 Share It is tactics - it has been done on MANY occasions by ALL of the worlds top riders. This isn't that much of an option anymore, as your qualification run scores you points. Qualify intentionally poorly and you're also losing out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BaGearA Posted May 3, 2017 Share Well the issue is being raised now and I am of the view that there's room for improvement. It seems that the general mood is that this was one of the most disappointing races in a very long time. So either that or we're all butt-hurt as you say. But let me entertain your non sequitur - Let's say someone did slip on icy mud and broke their neck and died. Would that then have been within the realm of reasonable for this sport? Is that what riders signed up for? Do we send Rampage Riders down the cliff when winds are pumping? Do guys paddle out when Chopes is unsurfable and dangerous?Wind or no wind Doing rampage is risking your life Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nigelhicks Posted May 3, 2017 Share Nige I saw a comment from some guy from Fort Bill - on how the weather forecast predicted howling winds at 4. They reduced the practice sessions and brought everything forward - i.e. adjusted the schedule. This was for the world enduro series...would that not have been allowed for the world cup?No as EWS has no live broadcasts ... remember that DH and XCO dont just go out on Red Bull but also on major networks - (Previously Supersport), EuroSport, and im sure a good few others - so it is these broadcast times that are the limiting factor mostly. Stretch 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NicoBoshoff Posted May 3, 2017 Share And Nige, dem's the rules. Agreed. Whihc is why Bruni got slapped by his managers. BUT those rules need relooking and we sure as hell can't have a situation where rider safety and, ironically, viewer enjoyment gets sacrificed at the altar of a schedule. Red Bull may have been the tail wagging the dog, but that blew up in their face if true. How many people didn't even bother with the replay having heard it was such an abortion in the end? How much did their brand suffer? I'd say a bit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NicoBoshoff Posted May 3, 2017 Share Then maybe they should just not do the DH live and go the EWS route with 30-45 minute race recaps and live timing? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Headshot Posted May 3, 2017 Share Well the issue is being raised now and I am of the view that there's room for improvement. It seems that the general mood is that this was one of the most disappointing races in a very long time. So either that or we're all butt-hurt as you say. But let me entertain your non sequitur - Let's say someone did slip on icy mud and broke their neck and died. Would that then have been within the realm of reasonable for this sport? Is that what riders signed up for? Do we send Rampage Riders down the cliff when winds are pumping? Do guys paddle out when Chopes is unsurfable and dangerous?I put it to yous, that it would be very hard to draw the line anywhere on that day. It was windy and cold earlier and got damper by degrees over a period of many minutes. At which point do you say the last few riders get to run again another day, or cancel the whole event and bin everybody's points for the weekend? As I said WC races have been run in far worse conditions. Gwin and Hart may have fallen off but GM and several others didn't. In fact GM clocked the best time of the top ten. So while it may have been disappointing for several reasons, in no way was it too dangerous to race IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nigelhicks Posted May 3, 2017 Share This isn't that much of an option anymore, as your qualification run scores you points. Qualify intentionally poorly and you're also losing out.Yes for sure - but no where near as much as if you have a ruined race run just due to weather. Id rather forfeit say 50 points for a win in Qualies in the hope that a clean run in finals would net me 200 if I KNEW it was going to rain ... If you are mid pack though (10th onwards) - I would DEF, forfeit Qualis points to get more in the final if we knew something this this was going to happen... But it is just a gamble at the end of the day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eddy Gordo Posted May 3, 2017 Share They should have had 2 winners. One for dry conditions and the other for wet!!! Like on Topgear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Headshot Posted May 3, 2017 Share It was for the BDS not EWSYes, they shortened the track because the ski lift could not access the peak due to the wind/rain/snow I think. They shuttled up the jeep track to a point lower down and raced from there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nigelhicks Posted May 3, 2017 Share Well the issue is being raised now and I am of the view that there's room for improvement. It seems that the general mood is that this was one of the most disappointing races in a very long time. So either that or we're all butt-hurt as you say. But let me entertain your non sequitur - Let's say someone did slip on icy mud and broke their neck and died. Would that then have been within the realm of reasonable for this sport? Is that what riders signed up for? Do we send Rampage Riders down the cliff when winds are pumping? Do guys paddle out when Chopes is unsurfable and dangerous? Unfortunately there is not much you as an organiser can do - other than cancel the event ...Major changes in Schedule cant be accommodated ... The last time this happened was 2007 ... so 1 in 10 years is good going. Put it this way however ....WHAT IF .... (and this has happened on LOTS of occasions in the last couple of years) ...There is a massive rainstorm before the event begins - this hinders the first 40 riders who rider in absolutely attrocous conditions and basically "clean" the track for the later riders as the rain stops and the track begins to dry .... Then the top "contendors" of that event have good conditions ... Isnt this just as unfair for the first 40 riders??? This has happened on a number of occasions - but interestingly - there is never a complaint when it happens this way around .... Headshot 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nigelhicks Posted May 3, 2017 Share Yes, they shortened the track because the ski lift could not access the peak due to the wind/rain/snow I think. They shuttled up the jeep track to a point lower down and raced from there.That was a National Champs round - it was a week before a World Cup a couple of years ago - the riders said that was a Dog Show Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Odinson Posted May 3, 2017 Share Some perspective as to how 'dangerous' the conditions were for the top dogs: Rachel Atherton's winning time: 3:21:430Greg Minnaar's 59th place time: 3:09:986 The conditions didn't stop the top riders from still putting down fast times (relatively). Eddy Gordo 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BaGearA Posted May 3, 2017 Share Some perspective as to how 'dangerous' the conditions were for the top dogs: Rachel Atherton's winning time: 3:21:430Greg Minnaar's 59th place time: 3:09:986 The conditions didn't stop the top riders from still putting down fast times (relatively). Did Rachel beat Garlicki ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Odinson Posted May 3, 2017 Share Did Rachel beat Garlicki ? No. Garlicki: 3:08:652Rachel Atherton: 3:21:430 BaGearA and Captain Fastbastard Mayhem 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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