K2C & e-bikes

[Skubarra]

Quite interesting that with the e-bike question, Dr evil classic says go for it, K2c says not this time. Both races organised in conjunction with each other.

 

K2C is sold out months in advance, Dr Evil is never fully subscribed afaik

 

This probably answer your question on why K2C is not interested in being the pioneers in integrating ebikes and normal bikes on the same event.

[Goodbadugly]

[Whatsup!]

I stubbed my toe last week so I think they should stop discriminating against mountain bikes and e-bikes at Iron Man.  It is just not right that an event can stipulate the type of bicycle that can be used. 

While I am at at, I think we need to re-look at the wet suits allowed and I am sure roller blades are the same as running shoes. 

 

Is it Friday yet !

[Eldron]

I hear you. To me race is a competition and there's prizes of monetary value up for grabs. Fun rides could be timed or not but there there's only ego, bragging rights and Strava KOM's /segment leader rights up for grabs. That's how I distinguish between the two. Not right or wrong, just the way I see it.

I have no desire to race an e-bike.

I also don't think anyone asking for e-bikes is wanting to race them. OP wants to enjoy and experience the vibe of riding along with others since his physical condition doesn't allow that from a normal push bike.

 

I also feel that the abilities of Class 1 E-bikes are being way over stated. Range is calculated for a flat smooth road and an average weight rider aboard the bike. Just looking at the nominal output and  W.hrs of the bikes available they all appear to be around 250W nominal and 600W.hr which isn't going to get a 80kg rider to the finishline at 250W. The bike would have to be more conservative in its output. and assuming the riders contribution remains failry low at say 70W Normalised Power, and the bike in conservation mode (to get the range) at roughly 120W

you're looking at 190W for the ride which is at best mid field

 

A wise man once said "the first bicycle race happened when the second bicycle was built" and that is kinda how I see it. Racing humans versus electricity would destroy the spirit of the race in my opinion. Instead of a bunch of people with a common goal of finishing the race under their own steam and suffering like dogs to make the cut it becomes a motorised farce with people of random ability smashing other people of random ability.

 

Perhaps that is the way the world is going but I don't like it. I'm a little old school where we understood the challenge, took it on, prepared for it and suffered for our results. Having a machine do half the work kinda defeats the point of doing it in the first place. It's a bit like giving out participation medals to everyone. It makes the event less special - if the Epic allowed ebikes then they might as well sell Epic medals for R15 a pop.

 

If I had my way ebikes would remain separated from human bikes in the same way that various disciplines of cycling are separated. I see mtbs and gravel bikes are now starting to compete directly but I'm still happy that it's human versus human.

 

I honestly see no difference between chemical doping, motordoping, taking a short cut, starting 20 mins before your allotted start time, skipping the last lap or the infamous "enter the long race but take the short race turn off then claim the time and result for the long race".

 

Perhaps it's the fact that ebikes are sold in stores which gives tacit approval of their use - I'm guessing if EPO was freely available with a Spesh/Santa Cruz/Niner/Pinarello lable on it that people would want to use it for racing - or if you could buy a top end "skip a lap" card at a concept store that people would gobble them up and show them to race officials hoping to do only 80% of the course but still get a 100% time.

 

If the ebike is doing more work that you are (like in your example) then all hope is lost in my opinion - even half has some kind of "at least I did more work than the machine" pathetic  excuse.

 

Well say - that rant went off in random directions :-)

[Eldron]

I stubbed my toe last week so I think they should stop discriminating against mountain bikes and e-bikes at Iron Man.  It is just not right that an event can stipulate the type of bicycle that can be used. 

While I am at at, I think we need to re-look at the wet suits allowed and I am sure roller blades are the same as running shoes. 

 

Is it Friday yet !

 

Tryathlon!

[Patchelicious]

Tryathlon!

This looks strangely familiar

[Pure Savage]

Tryathlon!

 

Now that actually looks awesome beside the segway...

[Eldron]

Now that actually looks awesome beside the segway...

 

Given that e-athletes have real medical issues preventing them from running, riding, breathing or standing up - it's only fair they get to use mobility scooters   

 

[Shebeen]

I am rubber you are glue - everything bounces off me and sticks to you.

 

Roses are red, violets are blue, ebikes are not bicycles and don't belong in races. Boohoo.

 

Damn. I really thought that would make me feel better.

cute, I got a poem!

 

 

in other news this thread has overtaken the "ebikes in races" thread,

https://community.bikehub.co.za/topic/163005-electric-mountain-bikes-on-a-mtb-race/page-1

 

but is still miles behind the "ebikes on the mountain" thread.

[Thor Buttox]

Given that e-athletes have real medical issues preventing them from running, riding, breathing or standing up - it's only fair they get to use mobility scooters

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1z43muPetNc

You'd need a dropper post for K2C, what with all the bad backs and terribly rough roads.

[rorydewet]

check this link

 

it does all the maths

 

https://www.bosch-ebike.com/en/service/range-assistant/

 

 

I hear you. To me race is a competition and there's prizes of monetary value up for grabs. Fun rides could be timed or not but there there's only ego, bragging rights and Strava KOM's /segment leader rights up for grabs. That's how I distinguish between the two. Not right or wrong, just the way I see it.

I have no desire to race an e-bike.

I also don't think anyone asking for e-bikes is wanting to race them. OP wants to enjoy and experience the vibe of riding along with others since his physical condition doesn't allow that from a normal push bike.

 

I also feel that the abilities of Class 1 E-bikes are being way over stated. Range is calculated for a flat smooth road and an average weight rider aboard the bike. Just looking at the nominal output and  W.hrs of the bikes available they all appear to be around 250W nominal and 600W.hr which isn't going to get a 80kg rider to the finishline at 250W. The bike would have to be more conservative in its output. and assuming the riders contribution remains failry low at say 70W Normalised Power, and the bike in conservation mode (to get the range) at roughly 120W

you're looking at 190W for the ride which is at best mid field

Edited August 14, 2018 by rorydewet

[DieselnDust]

check this link

 

it does all the maths

Thanks but no link present

[Jewbacca]

check this link

 

it does all the maths

 

https://www.bosch-ebike.com/en/service/range-assistant/

Yes

 

But this opens the door for top cyclists to be motopaced by other top cyclists for the win.

 

Adding 120 wattys on to Karl Platt even in his old age will allow him to tow one of his team mates to the win.

 

I dunno. I really don't care. If you guys want e-bikes at races then cool. I don't really do races anymore because I would prefer to ride empty trails when everyone else is racing.

 

Guys are being called names, people are being mean and petty and personal now. Over e-bikes.

 

pffft...... 

[dannygirl]

check this link

 

it does all the maths

 

https://www.bosch-ebike.com/en/service/range-assistant/

 

Haha - according to this, if a 100kg of you (with bike et al) cycle at 60rpm / 18kmph, on the 'tour' setting, you might just have something left in the tank going up Simola!

 

[DieselnDust]

check this link

 

it does all the maths

 

https://www.bosch-ebike.com/en/service/range-assistant/

It seems to support my thinking:

 

100kg all up weight (conservative and on the higher performance end)

Power Pack 500

Active line motor

eMTB selected

 

for an average speed of 17km/hr you'd get 108km of range at best in ECO mode.

 

to get any sort of race winning performance out of the eMTB you'd need to have around 1300W.hr pack since its going to be more than x2 as heavy as a the Power 500.

 

Most e-bikers are going to be pottering around the mid to back of the field anyway just by virtue of the battery limitation. Ain't no body "racing" there

Edited August 14, 2018 by DieselnDust

[DieselnDust]

Haha - according to this, if a 100kg of you (with bike et al) cycle at 60rpm / 18kmph, on the 'tour' setting, you might just have something left in the tank going up Simola!

 

ebike.JPG

did you set the terrain to mountainous?

The range comes down quite a bit.

Most e-bikers will be pushing a lead sled long before then.

They have to go slower just to last the distance

Edited August 14, 2018 by DieselnDust