Bicycle insurance

[Tandemuis]

2 hours ago, Bub Marley said:

No worries, mate. Whilst I agree that if you are have a large book, then clearly you do have leverage. However some times it’s easier also to just chat nicely with the assessor, give him your reasons for wanting a cash payout, and 99% of the time a big insurer like Santam will just do it. So to end off, my advice is don’t just accept the cash card. Chat with your broker and get them to try and get a cash settlement. It shouldn’t be that difficult if you have a legitimate reason. 

100%

Edited December 19, 2022 by Tandemuis

[Steven Knoetze (sk27)]

17 hours ago, Bub Marley said:

Tell him to get an independent damage report where they state the damage is not repairable. CBR wants business and obviously not gonna say that especially if they vouch for their work. Problem is a bike is not a car. And once you repair a bike, then any value that bike holds is most likely gone.  

Agreed, I have purchased a repaired carbon frame, but knew of it going in and therefore paid accordingly. It did then crack on the same spot and I had it repaired again. I then fell, had it break on a different spot altogether and then called it quits.
I think the value of the asset following a repair would definitely need to be a consideration for the insurer surely.

[incubit_frame_services]

I know this an old post but I'd like to give my 2c on the topic of carbon repairs and insurance.

I have been repairing carbon aircraft my whole adult life so have pretty decent insight on the matter.  Composites are complex and in order to repair them, a very good understanding of all the theory behind it in essential.  If an aircraft which has a highly regulated maintenance and repair process and is safety critical beyond anything that is used on the ground (like a bicycle) can be repaired and deemed safe, then obviously any other composite part can also be repaired successfully.

That said, there are some exceptions due to certain constraints.  The area to be worked and ground around the fracture is so big that in some areas it's simply impossible to properly do the repair.

Now this won't stop someone who thinks they know how to repair carbon from making a quick buck and doing a half assed job.  This is one of the issues with carbon repairs.  Some folks have a shoddy repair done which fails and they are then convinced that carbon repairs are not an option.

So my advice would be to make sure whoever you or the insurance companies use for the repair has a warranty on their repairs and have a stellar track record.  I have had a number of people approach me who have a carbon repair business and ask for training on how to do repairs.  This is very concerning since they are clearly winging it.

Then on the note of insurance opting for a repair over replacement.  I'm obviously biased in being a repairer myself but there is clearly a strong bias from the insured since anyone would prefer a new frame over a repaired one.  This is true wether it be your broken iPhone or your smashed BMW.  However, the insurance model would not be viable if they had to replace your BMW every time you have a fender bender or if they had to buy you a new iPhone every time you crack the screen.  Instead they have you take your iPhone to an iStore where you know you're getting a quality, guaranteed repair or your BMW to an accredited BMW panel shop that you know will deliver your car the same way it was before the sh*t hit the fan.

Point is, like most services we make use of in life, there are cheap and dodgy service providers and there are expensive, highly skilled and qualified service providers.  If you use the latter, you may not get a brand new bike back but you will get your old bike back and you will not notice that it is any different than before. 

[MilkManMike]

Whatever you do, make sure you do it soon. Bike theft seems to be out of control these days. I would feel more comfortable driving a newly bought car than a newly bought bicycle before insuring it…

[DieselnDust]

I’ve been very supportive of Santam I. The past but lately their insurance pricing has escalated and their service declined drastically. They also sneak changes into your policy without communication.eg they no longer let for load shedding damage to electrical appliances.

their assessors also want you to specify every item that goes with you on the bike (probably your onderbroek too). So when you update your schedule include your shoes, gloves , helmet, bike computer, handlebars , groupset , wheels all with individual replacement values.

it’s clearly tough out there but I’m shopping for new short term providers 

[Bub Marley]

43 minutes ago, DieselnDust said:

I’ve been very supportive of Santam I. The past but lately their insurance pricing has escalated and their service declined drastically. They also sneak changes into your policy without communication.eg they no longer let for load shedding damage to electrical appliances.

their assessors also want you to specify every item that goes with you on the bike (probably your onderbroek too). So when you update your schedule include your shoes, gloves , helmet, bike computer, handlebars , groupset , wheels all with individual replacement values.

it’s clearly tough out there but I’m shopping for new short term providers 

Parts of this is not accurate.

 

Pricing of insurance has definitely increased. A large proportion of the increase is related to load shedding. Wrt Santam not covering Electrical appliances, this is not true. The only changes that have happened across most insurers are higher excess for load shedding and total grid failure exclusion. You still have cover as before just with a higher excess.

 

You also do not need to specify all those items however for high valued items it is recommended. You can claim them under unspecified as long as they fall within the item limit you’ve selected. So if you have R 10000 unspecified as an example, with an item limit of R2000, you can essentially claim upto R 10,000 total with a maximum item value of R 2k. These item limits can be amended, however its an item valued at 10k like a garmin computer, i would definitely specify the item instead. Normally works out cheaper.

 

[AR SLABBERT]

@DieselnDust I can't speak for other insurance policies like contents or car insurance however I can fully vouch for JaSure on bicycle insurance. I recommend giving them a look. Their pricing is competitive but at no expense of service. Top-notch from policy inception to claim settlement. You can easily update your policy to include changes or upgrades without ever needing to speak to a call centre.

Edited June 7, 2023 by AR SLABBERT

[ChrisF]

1 hour ago, DieselnDust said:

I’ve been very supportive of Santam I. The past but lately their insurance pricing has escalated and their service declined drastically. They also sneak changes into your policy without communication.eg they no longer let for load shedding damage to electrical appliances.

their assessors also want you to specify every item that goes with you on the bike (probably your onderbroek too). So when you update your schedule include your shoes, gloves , helmet, bike computer, handlebars , groupset , wheels all with individual replacement values.

it’s clearly tough out there but I’m shopping for new short term providers 

 

"Santam" is a strange animal with multiple faces ....

 

With Santam, ONLY work via a good broker !!!!!  Mine keeps me posted on these ongoing items.

 

Working directly is a hit and miss mess .....

 

 

By the nature of our business I deal with a lot of different insurers on large industrial policies.  As noted by @Bub Marley ALL the insurers have sharpened their pencils along the same lines.  No surprise, as they all have the same re-assurers in Europe and America.

 

 

A colleague had a fender bender last week.  R4,8k repair, with a R5k excess.  If she was at Santam she would have zero excess, purely based on her age.  She saves a few rand a month on a call centre insurance, but now ends up paying more .....  No thank you.  Work via a good broker and a decent insurance company.

 

[Shebeen]

On 11/14/2022 at 9:56 AM, Alastair_S1D said:

So I was with Cyclesure since 2016. But unfortunately they recently kicked me off as an undesirable. 

 

Unfortunately I hit a stroke of bad luck between 2019 and 2021. I lost 4 bikes and a wheelset totalling near enough 160K. 3 bikes and wheels to theft from the house and the last bike was getting hit by a car. We live in a very high risk area in Cresta close to Windsor and our landlord was VERY lax on security. So even though we did the best we could to lock up our garage and keep the bikes safe ultimately the perps were still gaining easy access to the complex grounds because of the lax security.

 

So ultimately we bought our own place and moved to a safer complex and area. But I guess in their eyes it was too late as Cyclesure paid out the last claim and kicked me to the kurb.

Reply to old post.

House break in every year is a bit much. I am ok with that. If careless theft is paid out everytime then we all lose.

 

 

[bleedToWin]

I'm with cyclesure. According to mates I'm overpaying, but I've had two claims for accidental damaged settled with no issue, so reluctant to switch. Am upgrading now, and dreading the possible new premiums though...

[Robbie Stewart]

1 hour ago, DieselnDust said:

The past but lately their insurance pricing has escalated

this. I was browsing my bank statement last month and noticed I am paying more for my Santam premium, yet I haven't been informed of such nor have I claimed in that last maybe 3 years at least.

 

mmmm. time to start shopping I guess.

[DieselnDust]

1 hour ago, Bub Marley said:

Parts of this is not accurate.

 

Pricing of insurance has definitely increased. A large proportion of the increase is related to load shedding. Wrt Santam not covering Electrical appliances, this is not true. The only changes that have happened across most insurers are higher excess for load shedding and total grid failure exclusion. You still have cover as before just with a higher excess.

 

You also do not need to specify all those items however for high valued items it is recommended. You can claim them under unspecified as long as they fall within the item limit you’ve selected. So if you have R 10000 unspecified as an example, with an item limit of R2000, you can essentially claim upto R 10,000 total with a maximum item value of R 2k. These item limits can be amended, however its an item valued at 10k like a garmin computer, i would definitely specify the item instead. Normally works out cheaper.

 

This is how is should be  but boy how’s it’s happening to my claim. They’re trying some luck 

[Oufy MTB (Roadie)]

I’m with outsurance

1, bike stolen, paid out no hassles

2, crashed road bike, wheels damaged, paid for new wheels.

3, crashed MTB , top tube cracked, front wheel damaged by hub, garmin screen cracked, got assessed. Paid out.

all of this was hassle free, so I can’t complain. I know others had different experiences, but can’t moan for now. 

[Eugene]

8 hours ago, incubit_frame_services said:

I know this an old post but I'd like to give my 2c on the topic of carbon repairs and insurance.

I have been repairing carbon aircraft my whole adult life so have pretty decent insight on the matter.  Composites are complex and in order to repair them, a very good understanding of all the theory behind it in essential.  If an aircraft which has a highly regulated maintenance and repair process and is safety critical beyond anything that is used on the ground (like a bicycle) can be repaired and deemed safe, then obviously any other composite part can also be repaired successfully.

That said, there are some exceptions due to certain constraints.  The area to be worked and ground around the fracture is so big that in some areas it's simply impossible to properly do the repair.

Now this won't stop someone who thinks they know how to repair carbon from making a quick buck and doing a half assed job.  This is one of the issues with carbon repairs.  Some folks have a shoddy repair done which fails and they are then convinced that carbon repairs are not an option.

So my advice would be to make sure whoever you or the insurance companies use for the repair has a warranty on their repairs and have a stellar track record.  I have had a number of people approach me who have a carbon repair business and ask for training on how to do repairs.  This is very concerning since they are clearly winging it.

Then on the note of insurance opting for a repair over replacement.  I'm obviously biased in being a repairer myself but there is clearly a strong bias from the insured since anyone would prefer a new frame over a repaired one.  This is true wether it be your broken iPhone or your smashed BMW.  However, the insurance model would not be viable if they had to replace your BMW every time you have a fender bender or if they had to buy you a new iPhone every time you crack the screen.  Instead they have you take your iPhone to an iStore where you know you're getting a quality, guaranteed repair or your BMW to an accredited BMW panel shop that you know will deliver your car the same way it was before the sh*t hit the fan.

Point is, like most services we make use of in life, there are cheap and dodgy service providers and there are expensive, highly skilled and qualified service providers.  If you use the latter, you may not get a brand new bike back but you will get your old bike back and you will not notice that it is any different than before. 

You hit the nail on the head. You refer to a BMW accredited dealer or an iPhone store. 

Who accredits carbon repairers? Is there a carbon industry body? Is there a certification for a carbon repairer issued from an accredited agency? 

I have not heard of any (maybe I am wrong). Until that happens, I would want my insurer to replace rather than repair. 

[Tomik]

I've spoken to a few people, including those at the body repairer of my car brand and anecdotally Santam's service has slipped recently. Been with them for over 10 years but the last 3 claims (2 for minor car repairs and one for a frame, all three combined totalling less than 100k) were very frustrating. And that was through a good broker. 

I got a comparative quote from another insurer with another broker (a cyclist friend). Got the same premium with lower excess on all items and higher insured values on my 3 premium cars, my house and household contents. 

[Alastair_S1D]

7 hours ago, Shebeen said:

Reply to old post.

House break in every year is a bit much. I am ok with that. If careless theft is paid out everytime then we all lose.

 

 

Oh yes yes because obviously it was careless. Nice. One. It's like. I just left. My bike on the lawn with a sign "please steal me" . 🙄 No I definitely didn't take any precautions to try lock my bikes away whatsoever.