Tour de France 2021

[Patchelicious]

6 minutes ago, Danger Dassie said:

Ja and I can see his reasoning, but then that would only really apply if there was another Alpecin/Fenix rider under consideration. 

I was being facetious

[DieselnDust]

10 minutes ago, The Commuter said:

If MdvP planned to ride the entire tour he would have approached it way differently, me thinks.  I think it is unfair to compete with riders who know they must do a 3 week tour and you planning just to do a week.  They must spare themselves whilst you can go harder and be a disrupter because of your mindset of only doing this for a week.

I do not like it, never liked it when a rider pulls out other than with a crash, injury or sickness. 

It should not be tolerated.

Professional bike racing is war. In the past when teams had 10 riders they would deliberately use their classics riders to keep the pace high for the first week to animate the race. Once the tour hit the mountains those boys went home. this has always been employed in the tour, it is not new to the MvdP situation so there is no "unfair". Its war and war has strategy and tactics that are employed daily. Nothing about MvdP only week in the tour was unfair as the precedent is there,.......and he and his team were honest about it since like March already.

Unfair because he took another riders dream away...????? ???? That's really funny and I'm sure this was intended to be in comic sans.

If it wasn't for MvdP, Alpecin Fenix would not have had enough points to be included as a wild card entry. He's earned his right to follow his plan and program for 2021. We would not be discussing this if the Olympic Games had gone ahead in 2020 and MvdP would have been racing the entire TdF. Instead he gave everything to his team for a week and gave them more exposure than they would have had by not being there at all.

yet somehow this is unfair...??????

[Chris_]

At the risk of repeating myself from the other day and continuing this circle, I feel everyone in dissent with EM is saying the same thing. 

I think MvdP saying upfront he was only doing a week of the tour, and his heroism etc is irrelevant.

EM was on drugs, and is old, is irrelevant.

Pou Pou was celebrated, and non cycling fans became fans, is irrelevant.

The point to me is that the tour is a 3 week affair. Its not a 5 day tour. Its not a 1 day tour. Entering a 3 week race to bury yourself, maybe your team, maybe other riders who can't keep up your 1-day pace, to get a jersey and then dropping out once your mission is over is against the spirit of it being a celebration of people who can endure 3 weeks of probably the most jaw-dropping feat of fitness and pain tolerance.

Commentators always mention whomever is the x hundredth rider to wear the yellow jersey. Theres so few of them. and for good reason. I think MvdP-like tactics will tarnish that halo. He's not riding the same race.

[Dirt Tracker]

Looking at the profile for today I'm guessing the grupetto is going to be the peloton again today and massive. They need to keep Cav' in there to the line and hope it comes home in time or hope ASO aren't going to time cut 50+ riders. I wonder how Froome will go today. 

Really hope BikeExchange don't ride against Cav today to put out him out and over the time cut. That would be a d*/k move. 

[DieselnDust]

4 minutes ago, Chris_ said:

At the risk of repeating myself from the other day and continuing this circle, I feel everyone in dissent with EM is saying the same thing. 

I think MvdP saying upfront he was only doing a week of the tour, and his heroism etc is irrelevant.

EM was on drugs, and is old, is irrelevant.

Pou Pou was celebrated, and non cycling fans became fans, is irrelevant.

The point to me is that the tour is a 3 week affair. Its not a 5 day tour. Its not a 1 day tour. Entering a 3 week race to bury yourself, maybe your team, maybe other riders who can't keep up your 1-day pace, to get a jersey and then dropping out once your mission is over is against the spirit of it being a celebration of people who can endure 3 weeks of probably the most jaw-dropping feat of fitness and pain tolerance.

Commentators always mention whomever is the x hundredth rider to wear the yellow jersey. Theres so few of them. and for good reason. I think MvdP-like tactics will tarnish that halo. He's not riding the same race.

 

yes its a 3 week tour where traditionally teams have used riders in a sacrificial manner. Are you asking that Grand Tour stage racing tactics must be re-written or more regulated....?

Please we don't need more rules in life and sport. We're already paying lawyers far too much to get riders out of illegal sock height sanctions and bidon discarding violations.

Stage racing is about attrition, strategy, tactics, strength, endurance. If you use a few riders to mess with others endurance and they fall for it then maybe they should employ better DS

[TNT1]

11 minutes ago, Chris_ said:

At the risk of repeating myself from the other day and continuing this circle, I feel everyone in dissent with EM is saying the same thing. 

I think MvdP saying upfront he was only doing a week of the tour, and his heroism etc is irrelevant.

EM was on drugs, and is old, is irrelevant.

Pou Pou was celebrated, and non cycling fans became fans, is irrelevant.

The point to me is that the tour is a 3 week affair. Its not a 5 day tour. Its not a 1 day tour. Entering a 3 week race to bury yourself, maybe your team, maybe other riders who can't keep up your 1-day pace, to get a jersey and then dropping out once your mission is over is against the spirit of it being a celebration of people who can endure 3 weeks of probably the most jaw-dropping feat of fitness and pain tolerance.

Commentators always mention whomever is the x hundredth rider to wear the yellow jersey. Theres so few of them. and for good reason. I think MvdP-like tactics will tarnish that halo. He's not riding the same race.

Well then you have to bar riders like Yates from even starting, as they stated before the start that they are going there simply to try and pick up a stage win. That negates the focus on three weeks of overall contention right off the bat.

Keep in mind, the reason Van Der Poel left early is the Olympics. That's very possibly a once in a lifetime chance at a gold medal (yeah, he's young, but a lot can happen in 4 years, and it's one day, injury or illness cannot be ruled out).

[DieselnDust]

8 minutes ago, Dirt Tracker said:

Looking at the profile for today I'm guessing the grupetto is going to be the peloton again today and massive. They need to keep Cav' in there to the line and hope it comes home in time or hope ASO aren't going to time cut 50+ riders. I wonder how Froome will go today. 

Really hope BikeExchange don't ride against Cav today to put out him out and over the time cut. That would be a d*/k move. 

that's tactics and I'm pretty sure it will play out that way. Bahrain Victorius will likely work with Bike Exchange to achieve this if they're smart. That leaves the Green Jersey up for grabs. Colbrelli and Matthews can easily make the time cut. If Cav can't then that's just haarhties. DS are going to have to use lots of sticky bottles to get Cav home today or risk half their team being eliminated

[Dirt Tracker]

Chippo never finished a Tour and he was never dragged over the coals like this. When he's talked about it's always with a smile and a 'well that's just Mario' tone. It's a pretty unique year. The Olympics only come every 4 years and he's got an opportunity to do it. What does it serve his team or sponsors to sit in the Grupetto day after day, come out the other side and be flogged? 

I don't have a problem with it at all. He's been smashing it for way longer than anyone apart from Wout this year, did a full cyclo-x season, came world champ, did a classics season and scored there, won a couple of MTB races along the way, made a massive impact on the tour and now has a chance to to and compete in Tokyo. Fair play. Some riders only aimed for Le Tour and used all the other great races around the year as training treating them as such. 

As for taking another teammates place. Really? There isn't another rider in that team that will bring the publicity, keep the sponsors happy, give a ROI, reach an audience that no other rider currently can and deliver the wins across the board, all year. Cycling is a business and also a business of survival. The level of exposure the team is getting this year especially will help keep current sponsors interested, attract new sponsors and in turn help keep MVDP in Alpecin which in turn give him the freedom to do what he wants and not get bored. 

If ASO have a problem they would do something but they don't. He has added a massive story to this years tour, he battled and to see the jersey and publicity is up. They will be stoked. 

Edited July 7, 2021 by Dirt Tracker

[Patchelicious]

People prefer that people finish what they start. It’s in our nature.

We do not have to like that he and others, abandon. It’s ok to not like that.

There is no need to always find some rational justification for an emotional position.

Edited July 7, 2021 by Patchelicious

[Danger Dassie]

33 minutes ago, Patchelicious said:

I was being facetious

I blame the long Vid  .... ????

[dsw]

Eddie Merckx, Tiger Woods, Pele, Michael Jordan, Usain Bolt,  Michael Phelps, Lionel Messi, Roger Federer and Bob Dylan can say whatever they want to say.  The rest are just pretenders.

[TNT1]

5 minutes ago, dsw said:

Eddie Merckx, Tiger Woods, Pele, Michael Jordan, Usain Bolt,  Michael Phelps, Lionel Messi, Roger Federer and Bob Dylan can say whatever they want to say.  The rest are just pretenders.

I never knew Bob Dylan took performance enhancing drugs.

 

What's the link between these names?

[Patchelicious]

1 minute ago, TNT1 said:

I never knew Bob Dylan took performance enhancing drugs.

 

What's the link between these names?

They aren't pretenders, read man read!

[lechatnoir]

33 minutes ago, Dirt Tracker said:

<..> 

Really hope BikeExchange don't ride against Cav today to put out him out and over the time cut. That would be a d*/k move. 

Cav will need to be aware of the BE team car... though, he's in green, not blue, so perhaps they'll be confused?

[dsw]

7 minutes ago, TNT1 said:

I never knew Bob Dylan took performance enhancing drugs.

 

What's the link between these names?

He did say " Everybody must get stoned" though   

[lechatnoir]

actually, this conversation on finishing or not finishing is irrelevant. The true winner this year will be Lachlan Morton. But we knew this last week already.