Bike washing theory

[Murrob]

1 hour ago, RobertWhitehead said:

I can buy that that specific brand may cause some issues but definitely not all car wash shampoos. Just think about the queue of unhappy customers lining up at every single car wash in the country if that was the case. I have been using car shampoo on my own and other bikes for close to 10 years without any issues. 

Agreed, that was my thinking as well, but perhaps it’s a combination of the soap which is rinses off though and Brunox stantion lube? Like I said, it’s a theory and my ‘empirical’ research is really just me now sticking with particular brand of cleaning product. Also washing the bike myself may mean a better process or less other chemicals. The other option is maybe the seals were exposed or had issues before being fitted? But twice seems odd.

[Barry]

22 minutes ago, Murrob said:

I also used Ecologic, but I think the concentration was too much as it seemed to impact the paint on a Fox fork on my Giant Anthem years ago, making it dull. I still use it for other jobs and it work great for getting stains out of clothes and degreasing. 

Yes would be the concentration i had it with a Rock shox and when bike was dry could see it was milky where the soap was sprayed. But i used 50/50 so my own fault didn't RTFM think Jack Frost did change his formulation. Most car soaps contain Hydrofluoric acid (HF) anodized parts and acid are not best friends. 

Edited September 22, 2023 by Barry

[PregoRoll]

Keep an eye out for this stuff in stores soon. Its landing with us next week. 

 

[Murrob]

57 minutes ago, Barry said:

Yes would be the concentration i had it with a Rock shox and when bike was dry could see it was milky where the soap was sprayed. But i used 50/50 so my own fault didn't RTFM think Jack Frost did change his formulation. Most car soaps contain Hydrofluoric acid (HF) anodized parts and acid are not best friends. 

Interesting, because to add to my detailed theory, I also had a set of conti GP5000’s on one of my bikes that did this weird perishing thing. Tried to warranty, but no luck, and this was also when I was using the shield car wash soap and or Ecologic (admittedly too strong)

[MORNE]

Not everyone will agree, but I feel there is such a thing as over washing.

I always make sure my suspension and seals are wiped clean…and if they look particularly dry…give them some brunnox once in a while, cycle, wipe excess. I lower service once or twice a year depending on how much I rode a particular bike. Major service after 2 lowers. My stuff looks and works perfect. 

I dont wash the paint off my bikes after every single ride. I dont use cleaners either. I wipe my chain, re-lube.
Getting water in everything once or twice every week causes just as much poef imo. Why?

It’s just dust…or a muddy speck here or there. It wont fall apart or stop working☺️

Edited September 22, 2023 by MORNE

[Barry]

3 minutes ago, Murrob said:

Interesting, because to add to my detailed theory, I also had a set of conti GP5000’s on one of my bikes that did this weird perishing thing. Tried to warranty, but no luck, and this was also when I was using the shield car wash soap and or Ecologic (admittedly too strong)

On the MTB tyre side you will see that the yellow on the MAXXIS or other starts to turn soap yellow then probably not a good idea to use that soap to harsh.

[MORNE]

Also, Hambini doesnt wash his bikes either 😅 5 year olds know best!

im not talking about maintaining your drivetrain, but washing your bike and getting water and degreasers and soap and chemicals on and into places they shouldn't really be. I try to minimise that. Thats also why my pivot bearings, headsets, bb’s ets seem to last forever imo.

 

[love2fly]

12 hours ago, Murrob said:

So, for the last few services on my bike, I could never understand why the dust seals on my fork and in particular the shock are not lasting. I hear when a 50 hour service is near as the rear shock would start to squeak and Fox refer to much longer service intervals as well that just don’t seem to happen in SA. Now before everyone runs off in the direction of my bike shop fleecing me I inspect the seal myself and there is no doubt that they are toast. 
 

So I started thinking about potential external contaminates, also as I understand the fact that the rear shock is inverted also plays a role in the seals getting dry. I have been a fan of stantion lubes and have always been meticulous in terms of cleaning and lubing. But still had issues, so I have been conducting a bit of empirical research. I have recently been only washing my bike with Mucoff and using the products as directed. Whereas before I had been washing with Shield Extreme car wash soap. It looks like it was the car wash soap that was causing the problems as we are well into the latest block without any squeak or dry seals. So use it, don’t use it, but I am pretty convinced that car wash soap, in particular it seems Shield X-treme car does not agree with seals on forks and shocks.

I used to head up the marketing for one of this brands opposition brands....as our technical guy, a doctor of Chemistry nogal said to me at the time...."you mix one cap of product in a bucket of water and expect it to cover the entire car in a layer of wax" ....🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣

Like someone said below. Don't wash with chemicals ....mud and general dirt doesn't need degreaser....where my chain or BB emit some grease I use degreaser carefully or on a cloth.

I use Brunox stanchion lube every month or so.

[babse]

Am I the only one using dishwashing liquid without issues for years?

R40 for 750ml instead of overpriced bicycle specific products.

[PregoRoll]

13 minutes ago, babse said:

Am I the only one using dishwashing liquid without issues for years?

R40 for 750ml instead of overpriced bicycle specific products.

Out of interest, do your fork lower still have a glossy finish, or are the now a dull, matte grey?

[babse]

46 minutes ago, PregoRoll said:

Out of interest, do your fork lower still have a glossy finish, or are the now a dull, matte grey?

yeah the gloss black lowers on my fox has definetly lost its sheen over the years

[robbybzgo]

3 hours ago, Murrob said:

External rubber seals are the ones I’m having issues with. 

Try and drop some old (used) rubber seals into a diluted solution of that Wash and Wax and let sit for a few hours, then take out and dry them off. Repeat for a few days and see if your theory holds out that the solution is degrading the rubber.

As a note I've used a car dashboard protector (Johnson Rally UV protector) applied with an ear bud onto the rubber seals to stop them from cracking/deteriorating.

[PregoRoll]

32 minutes ago, babse said:

yeah the gloss black lowers on my fox has definetly lost its sheen over the years

unfortunately, stuff like sunlight is a bit harsh and sucks the oils out of the paint. Leaving you with a dehydrated finish. Its very noticeable on fork lowers for some reason. 

[dasilvarsa]

4 hours ago, Murrob said:

External rubber seals are the ones I’m having issues with. 

After Washing.

Put Some oil on the Seals and on the Stanchions and compress using Brake.

Use the Same OIL you do Lowers Service With (15W Fork OIL works) Not Engine OIL

Rubber Seals Need oil. (Hydraulics 101)

No Need to Wash Bikes Too Much It's Just Gonna get Dirty Again.

 

Edited September 22, 2023 by dasilvarsa

[love2fly]

1 hour ago, robbybzgo said:

Try and drop some old (used) rubber seals into a diluted solution of that Wash and Wax and let sit for a few hours, then take out and dry them off. Repeat for a few days and see if your theory holds out that the solution is degrading the rubber.

As a note I've used a car dashboard protector (Johnson Rally UV protector) applied with an ear bud onto the rubber seals to stop them from cracking/deteriorating.

I wouldn't recommend that. Dash products usually contain silicone which is a dust magnet. The part of the seal which counts most is that which contacts the stanchion. That's why I Brunox the stanchion and then wipe everything clean.

 

Edited September 22, 2023 by love2fly

[love2fly]

1 hour ago, dasilvarsa said:

After Washing.

Put Some oil on the Seals and on the Stanchions and compress using Brake.

Use the Same OIL you do Lowers Service With (15W Fork OIL works) Not Engine OIL

Rubber Seals Need oil. (Hydraulics 101)

No Need to Wash Bikes Too Much It's Just Gonna get Dirty Again.

 

Without drifting the thread, isn't the lubricating oil in a fork same as motor oil and the hydraulic oil is the fork oil?

@droo ?