Cyclists with a "Running" Problem

[Ronniek]

With only a small portion of the fee going to ASA and a sense of loyalty to my club I will probably purchase a licence. Can’t see myself actually utilising it this year though.

[dave303e]

Still don't get running clubs, it is an individual sport, why do you need to represent a club?

 

Yes they organise time trials and runs and races. But they can still organise races without having everyone pay a yearly fee. You don't need club facilities to go run. Look at trail running, no clubs but they run fine and are still racing. Clubs can easily just become race organisers, maybe if that happens you will have better organised events. 

 

Too much about running is being seen running. Must be seen at club runs, must be seen at time trial, must be seen at the coffee shop after a run, must be in the pub after timetrial, must post to strava, fb and insta that you ran...

 

Put a pair of shoes on, step out the door, go run.

 

Paddling has reasons to have clubs because they do the safety training and river certification. You also need their facilities to train a lot of the time. 

 

Anyway, rant over carry on...

[Jaws677]

.

Edited April 5, 2022 by Jaws677

[Chris_]

I like the way Run Zone is set up. The yearly fee is a couple hundred bucks so lets call it negligible, it does get you the ASA license and a shirt anyway.

 

But what I like is when you decide to run with them, you give a 20 buck donation, and then you get a table of water/drinks/sweets etc every 5kms. and the routes go up to 25/30 kms. Sometimes its nice not having to carry my own or plan a longer route. I do go very infrequently, but its a nice to have.

 

Plus Graham is a legit OG - he ran 100 milers incl western states before they were even a real thing.

[dave303e]

Yea don't agree at all.

 

Clubs definitely have their place. Especially to give new people a platform to start running from.

 

You are probably a pro that love running solo.

 

Im a social runner and the fun in running for me is sharing the experience with others.

 

Especially trail running. I'm too lazy to plan runs and do research, but there is always someone in the group with a brigh plan. I just tag along and enjoy the ride.

 

I run for 4way and its a lekker club where I've met some pretty amazing individuals.

 

I do agree thag clubs like Discovery should die they do way more damage than good

 

Also running alone in Jhb in the early mornings is not a good idea. So most of my runs are with my mates.

 

The natural Competative nature of man helps us to push our own limits, checking how your mates did and congratulating them on platforms like Strava by giving a kudos or two can help keeping them motivated as well.

 

I've never even had a running program or plan I literally do whatever is decided the night before on the WhatsApp group

 

You can have that Whatsapp group and running mates without paying a club yearly.

You can enter races without being part of a club and have your running mates to run with the rest of the time.

 

Competitive nature is a load of rubbish as well, you will never beat them if you only ever run with them. You will also never run your true potential pace in a group, unless you are the slowest one there. If you are the slowest one there you are never able to run to a plan and give yourself a chance to do recovery runs or slow runs because you always trying to keep up. 

 

Deciding the night before on whatsapp is also great, until they decide a tempo run is in order and your legs are broken because you have been at it too hard in other aspects of life(cycling) and then you end up injured.

 

Motivation from others? You running for their approval/congratulations or are you running for you?

 

But ya, each to their own. . . 

 

*also by no means a pro runner. 

Edited February 11, 2021 by dave303e

[Hacc]

A CGA license is R120 this year for seniors (not sure how much is going to ASA, so I will treat them as one affiliation). (I am excluding juniors from my very rough calculation)

 

If we take Comrades runners, +- 20 000 runners, that is R2.4 mil a year that CGA/ASA is making.

Add another 20 000 (complete guestimate) Non Comrades runners that belongs to clubs - another R2.4 mil a year. 

 

Temp Licenses at races cost R35 (2020 cost, let's ignore the R100 for a 42km). Let's say 40% of runners don't have licenses and there are +- 3000 runners per race (on average, including the 10km distance). There is a race almost every weekend of the year. For argument sake let's exclude 10 Sundays. For 42 races the cost is roughly R1.8 mil

 

Each club must pay an affiliation fee per year. That is R450 per club and R1000 for corporate clubs. 

(CGA's k@k website keeps crashing so I couldn't find the list of registered clubs) Let's add another R100k.

 

There are race levies per race to be paid to CGA. 10% of the entry fee per finisher... Let's work on 3000 runners and 80% of the field finished. On average a 10km race costs around R100, a 21km around R200 and 42km around R300.

If we split a race 40% 10km, 40% 21km and 20% 42km that gives us R43200 per race for 42 races. Total of R1.8 mil

(in 2020 Johnson Crane paid R350 000 as race levies.... so I think my sums are completely wrong)

 

Then they get sponsorships they print on the numbers that they always moan about showing. 

 

In total CGA/ASA is making (a very very rough estimate)  R 8.5 million a year for doing absolutely nothing. Please explain to me what they do with all this money? What are they doing for the upliftment of our sport?

 

I love my running club and my running friends I made at the club. I am still in two minds if I will join again this year.

 

 

[PhilipV]

I, like Dave, don't see the need to join a running club. I run alone, or with my wife.

But on the other hand Daren, joining a club was the best thing my cousin did when she started running it provided the structure and motivation that she needed, and she progressed immensely.

[L46]

You can have that Whatsapp group and running mates without paying a club yearly.

You can enter races without being part of a club and have your running mates to run with the rest of the time.

 

Competitive nature is a load of rubbish as well, you will never beat them if you only ever run with them. You will also never run your true potential pace in a group, unless you are the slowest one there. If you are the slowest one there you are never able to run to a plan and give yourself a chance to do recovery runs or slow runs because you always trying to keep up. 

 

Deciding the night before on whatsapp is also great, until they decide a tempo run is in order and your legs are broken because you have been at it too hard in other aspects of life(cycling) and then you end up injured.

 

Motivation from others? You running for their approval/congratulations or are you running for you?

 

But ya, each to their own. . . 

 

*also by no means a pro runner. 

 

"You can have that Whatsapp group and running mates without paying a club yearly.

You can enter races without being part of a club and have your running mates to run with the rest of the time."

 

 

So you create a whatsapp group, a few friends get added... Let's organize our own little runs... Let's meet at the coffee shop as a starting point... Coffee afterwards... I'll pay, you get the next one... How about we do a race together... I'll enter, pay me back... I'll get the licenses, pay me back... Let's get matching shirts... I'll order, pay me back... Can I drive with you? Sure, we can split petrol, pay me back next time... The system works, the whatsapp group grows as more friends gets added. Essentially, it's too much for one person to pay every time and wait for the paying back, so you need a kitty where money gets put in to use for these things.

 

Is that not perhaps how clubs started initially?

 

I also do most runs solo and offroad and don't belong to a club, but I can see Jaws677's points, especially if you do road races and needs logistics to be sorted i.t.o. registrations, ASA numbers etc. and the benefit of having a club gazebo to relax at or wait for family members/friends that is still running.  Also at longer races like Comrades a club gazebo with your supporting nutrition /back-up gear would make sense.  Added that, for some people, especially ladies, it makes sense to join others during early morning or late afternoon runs, it makes them feel safe and it is something we as men tend to overlook.

 

I think there is a place for both solo running and club running, depending on your own situation.

 

Just my 2 cents, each to their own

[Andrew Steer]

Yea don't agree at all.

 

Clubs definitely have their place. Especially to give new people a platform to start running from.

 

You are probably a pro that love running solo.

 

Im a social runner and the fun in running for me is sharing the experience with others.

 

Especially trail running. I'm too lazy to plan runs and do research, but there is always someone in the group with a brigh plan. I just tag along and enjoy the ride.

 

I run for 4way and its a lekker club where I've met some pretty amazing individuals.

 

I do agree thag clubs like Discovery should die they do way more damage than good

 

Also running alone in Jhb in the early mornings is not a good idea. So most of my runs are with my mates.

 

The natural Competative nature of man helps us to push our own limits, checking how your mates did and congratulating them on platforms like Strava by giving a kudos or two can help keeping them motivated as well.

 

I've never even had a running program or plan I literally do whatever is decided the night before on the WhatsApp group

Love my running club... very happy to pay over that little bit of cash each year and chip in to help make our race a success and help our top runners develop etc.

 

Clubs are the backbone of pretty much all running in this country, it's the reason we have incredible running options and cheap entry fees as you've got volunteers making races far easier to host every weekend of the year. 

 

It's one of the places cycling went wrong, we lost our club culture and with that the events they organised. Now we largely pay professional race organisers an arm and a leg to put on races as they do it for a living, have to cover all costs and marshalls etc. Clubs bring manpower and passion, you can't buy that.

 

Long live the club culture and the club races 

[Andrew Steer]

PS: Let's not confuse paying ASA and paying a club fee...

ASA suck and they offer virtually nothing. That's the South African way though. We have a massive strong running culture in spite of them... and that again, is largely thanks to the clubs

We're very lucky, and I for one will not take it for granted.
 

[Shebeen]

I, like Dave, don't see the need to join a running club. I run alone, or with my wife.

But on the other hand Daren, joining a club was the best thing my cousin did when she started running it provided the structure and motivation that she needed, and she progressed immensely.

I have never been a member of a running club, always just done temp licences.

I didn't see the point for me.

 

BUT, since we had some stabbings in mzb mountains we have a whatsapp trail group that has blossomed (so much that it's now a telegram group due to WA member limits). I have really enjoyed the camaraderie and fun and games. our clubhouse is a pub and we have kit to wear.

 

where clubs are important is races, they do the races. and i don't see this ever falling away.

[Shebeen]

I have a question aimed mostly at the ultra athletes.... So I have always just used a basic watch with nav/route follow function for most 100 milers as the route is usually 'marked' with ribbon or reflective pegs.

 

I am taking on an unmarked route race later in the year and will need a nav device.

 

I am loath to use a watch as the race is long. Like at least 3 nights out on course long. Charging the watch with a power bank could prove tricky if still needed to nav.

 

So far I have looked at the Garmin eTrex variants, the Oregon variants and the gpsmap hand helds.

 

All seem to take rechargeable packs OR 2x AA batteries.

 

Is there actually a good option or should I just settle on a cheap Etrex10 and carry a bunch of AA batteries?

 

I don't want to spend 10k on a Garmin Instinct solar as the race will be run in July and it might rain the entire 4 and a half days!

 

I know you done the eTrex already, but my starting point would be to hit up those who have done munga trail. i remember the first or second one seeing Nicky finishing with her suunto charging strap dangling down to her wrist, looked terribly inconvenient!

 

if people started using a larger device and worked out how to mount well, then that's worth it. 2 sets of lithium energixers should do the trick

[dave303e]

I know you done the eTrex already, but my starting point would be to hit up those who have done munga trail. i remember the first or second one seeing Nicky finishing with her suunto charging strap dangling down to her wrist, looked terribly inconvenient!

 

if people started using a larger device and worked out how to mount well, then that's worth it. 2 sets of lithium energixers should do the trick

 

When you do the math on weight(including a massive powerbank) cost and hassle. In my opinion the etrex still wins.

 

A big powerbank is expensive, heavy. You then need to keep cable dry and have a good resealable dry bag for it. Also good luck if it pours with rain and you need to recharge and have it out in the rain to nav. A suunto 9 will also really hit the bank balance.

 

You can get a few sets of replacement batteries for the etrex and cling wrap/duct tape them to keep them dry till use. If you pass a bin at an aid station you can drop them in the bin and have less weight to carry going forward. Where as a powerbank you will keep all the way. The other option could have been a Garmin foretrex, which is like an etrex with a watch strap. But they are a bit more limited in terms of route points and a lot more expensive again.

 

You also never have to juggle a cable while 'running'

[Ronniek]

If I recall correctly I think the clubhouse sees me about thrice a year. Two of those being the Comrades socials before and after. I however make use of the club gazebos after races much more often. Have met many club friends away from the clubhouse in and after races. I always make a point of marshaling at our club events, it is only a ten km in January, a half marathon in July and we also do the FNB one run. For three mornings a year I can run any other races and appreciate the effort other clubs put into organizing their events.

Ps not judging anybody else on what works for them just my humble opinion.

Edited February 11, 2021 by Ronniek

[b-rad]

 

 

In total CGA/ASA is making (a very very rough estimate)  R 8.5 million a year for doing absolutely nothing. Please explain to me what they do with all this money? What are they doing for the upliftment of our sport?

 

 

I love my running club and my running friends I made at the club. I am still in two minds if I will join again this year.

In 2019 ASA revenue from membership was R6.6mil.

 

Would be very interesting to see their financials for 2020.

 

As far as what they do with the money. A big spend is on salaries, travel, and food. And highly doubt much of this is on athletes. Not surprising really.

Upliftment of the sport is something I am yet to see in any form.

 

Please support your running club and join them. It's a separate membership to ASA and the provincial bodies as has been pointed out. It's very very important that clubs are kept strong and supported. Clubs are the backbone of running in SA and pull a lot of the weight of the various bodies.

[b-rad]

Even if you don't attend your running club and prefer running alone that's perfectly fine. But please join and support your running clubs. Without the running clubs we'd be in a far far worse position in regards to the running environment in SA.

 

To me a running club is far more than the running. Even though I prefer running alone and generally always do so, that weekly meetup (maybe more at other clubs) at the clubhouse is so important. It's about the social side and getting to know people who have a common interest regardless of abilities. It's about learning from the seniors and encouraging beginners. It's about community (something seriously lacking in society).

Getting involved with the club race is something everyone should do too. Maybe then some might realise what goes into a race rather than complain about everything on social media.

 

For a nominal fee I have gained so much from the club environment and I'm sure for many it's the same. Get involved and you might find it's quite fun. If your club does a monthly or weekly time trial go participate. You can run alone if that's what you prefer. But please try stay for a cooldrink/water/beer etc afterwards.

Edited February 11, 2021 by b-rad