Cycle Lab bullies need to be addressed

[The Ouzo]

I was pleasantly surprised yesterday out on Atlas rd.

 

The last few times big groups have come past they have been rather aggressive, but yesterday there was a big group approaching, from far back they let us know they were approaching and one guy even rang his bell. Not one person in the group showed any aggression or anything.

[Chris NewbyFraser]

If this perennial Cyclelab behaviour continues, perhaps the aggrieved riders should seek an appointment with Andrew Kirby, top dog at Toyota, who are cyclelabs sponsor. A threat to withdraw will get MightyMouses ratpack back in line

[EmJayZA]

This Saturday the Cradle was pretty busy. I think I counted 5 CL groups in the Cradle. All of them were courteous, and even greeted. I can imagine those large groups causing a lot of chaos turning around at Caves. It can get a little hairy when those big groups pass, as they don't give you room to move out of the path of an incoming sand patch, or branches. I just slowly inch my way closer into the group and hope they move over. That does not mean I am not holding my line, it just means I am not going to put myself in danger. 

 

Roadies... This is why I ride a mtb. People shouting at each other doesn't sound like fun to me! yeah I know mtb'ers sometimes shout track, but I've noticed most of the time they will sit behind you for a little while to see if you would give track, and only if you don't they'll ask politely if they can pass. At least that's what they do at the back end of races!

 

I have heard MTBers screaming and arguing on the Cradle trails when I ride passed them. One incident was so bad, I could hear the guy throwing abuse for about 30m after I passed him... 

Edited March 5, 2018 by EmJayZA

[Patchelicious]

If this perennial Cyclelab behaviour continues, perhaps the aggrieved riders should seek an appointment with Andrew Kirby, top dog at Toyota, who are cyclelabs sponsor. A threat to withdraw will get MightyMouses ratpack back in line

There are better ways to actually achieve a positive outcome than to just threaten. #EFF

[BMWGSADV]

Where does the arrogance of CL stem from? Without McLean “ CL” .... CL!!! would just be another cycling club with no deity to bow down to. This has been going on for years.... just become worse with with time. Sense of entitlement......

 

Not going to change no matter who sends out what communique.

[IceCreamMan]

Mob mentality, nothing specific to CL.

[Pusher]

Cycle Lab need to address the bullies in the bunches. I was out there Saturday and probably the 3rd or 4th cycle lab group came past. I was minding my own business in the yellow line and some asshole tried to push me off the road twice. Giving me some story about how I should drop back behind the group. The cradle and the cycle lane is for everyone you asshole. Idiots like you give the whole group a bad name.

And why would anyone want to push you off the road!

[Patchelicious]

Where does the arrogance of CL stem from? Without McLean “ CL” .... CL!!! would just be another cycling club with no deity to bow down to. This has been going on for years.... just become worse with with time. Sense of entitlement......

 

Not going to change no matter who sends out what communique.

 

It has nothing to do with CL themselves, and everything to do with the mentality of people just like me and you when we move in large numbers.

[The Ouzo]

It has nothing to do with CL themselves, and everything to do with the mentality of people just like me and you when we move in large numbers.

yes and no.

I believe the clubs should teach and encourage good etiquette, after all, the riders wearing the clubs kit represent the club,

 

You will still get the rogues who think they are demi gods, but these will soon enough be weeded out and brought to task if the majority are lead and encouraged in the right ways.

[Patchelicious]

yes and no.

I believe the clubs should teach and encourage good etiquette, after all, the riders wearing the clubs kit represent the club,

 

You will still get the rogues who think they are demi gods, but these will soon enough be weeded out and brought to task if the majority are lead and encouraged in the right ways.

Yes, but that will be due to the people around the morons saying and doing something about it.

 

Look, I agree that clubs can contribute to improving the situation, but we too often like using that as a scapegoat to not do something about it ourselves first. If you see somebody not riding correctly, having a nice polite chat to him/her will probably yield better real world results than getting a general behaviour email from an Andrew McMouse.

 

I often ride with 2 of the Lab marshals, and trust me they take their roles very seriously, but we are not children and they are not out teachers. We are adults and we can take responsibility for our own actions and our friends.

[Paul Ruinaard]

Where does the arrogance of CL stem from? Without McLean “ CL” .... CL!!! would just be another cycling club with no deity to bow down to. This has been going on for years.... just become worse with with time. Sense of entitlement......

 

Not going to change no matter who sends out what communique.

Ho hum and we are back to Andrew Mclean bashing.... 

 

Andrew has probably done more for the sport and for you as a rider than anyone else in South Africa i can think of mate.

 

Sure not without benefitting him, but that is how it works.

 

So i can't say i agree with you. And whether you like him or hate him you can't question his contribution to the sport.

 

Not sure how long you been on your bicycle but all your online entry and seeding systems that everyone now uses were created largely because of the Cyclelab and Andrew, never mind the TV shows etc.

 

Just saying...

 

Also ridden with CL of and on for over 20 years and have always considered their bunches well mannered and courteous and well organized. I spend almost every weekend out in the cradle riding on my own and have never had an issue with them - there are other clubs which are generally much more undisciplined. Lets not open that can of worms here now as well.

Edited March 6, 2018 by Paul Ruinaard

[s14phoenix]

Yes, but that will be due to the people around the morons saying and doing something about it.

 

Look, I agree that clubs can contribute to improving the situation, but we too often like using that as a scapegoat to not do something about it ourselves first. If you see somebody not riding correctly, having a nice polite chat to him/her will probably yield better real world results than getting a general behaviour email from an Andrew McMouse.

 

I often ride with 2 of the Lab marshals, and trust me they take their roles very seriously, but we are not children and they are not out teachers. We are adults and we can take responsibility for our own actions and our friends.

 

 

Maybe some people need to be treated like children? Send them home and off the group ride immediately. Someone needs to be made an example of.

 

Strong words maybe but its like crossing the centreline in races - individuals need to be DQ'ed and made example of. Probably you will find that it is the same n0bs on group rides ignoring the unwritten rules and the written ones...

[The Ouzo]

Yes, but that will be due to the people around the morons saying and doing something about it.

 

Look, I agree that clubs can contribute to improving the situation, but we too often like using that as a scapegoat to not do something about it ourselves first. If you see somebody not riding correctly, having a nice polite chat to him/her will probably yield better real world results than getting a general behaviour email from an Andrew McMouse.

 

I often ride with 2 of the Lab marshals, and trust me they take their roles very seriously, but we are not children and they are not out teachers. We are adults and we can take responsibility for our own actions and our friends.

Been there, done that, have stopped because I prefer not have abuse thrown at me on my rides.

 

Someone mentioned there are marshals in these groups, well maybe these marshals need to get stricter. Mandatory 2 hours of lectures on riding etiquette before the offenders can join the group ride again or something like that.

[Pall Catt]

yes and no.

I believe the clubs should teach and encourage good etiquette, after all, the riders wearing the clubs kit represent the club,

 

You will still get the rogues who think they are demi gods, but these will soon enough be weeded out and brought to task if the majority are lead and encouraged in the right ways.

 

When we talk about how the clubs are responsible for this, we seem to think there is some higher authority that has power over all of its minions and dictates how the clubs behave. That's not the case at all. Club "leaders" have very little power to do anything about bad behaviour. What can they really do, threaten to expel the person from the club? That's hardly punishment because there are 40 other clubs to go and join. They cant impose financial penalties or anything like that. On top of that, most of the time any "club" ride will have numerous non-club members who join or get picked up along the way. Is someone supposed to be policing the entire bunch all the time and taking a constant roll call? So the person who acts like an idiot might be riding with CL but could very possibly not be a CL member at all. To try and pin this on some sort of management structure is just misguided. Clubs are just collectives of ordinary people and people are ****. The reason why CL often comes up is probably just because they are one of the bigger clubs and so they have more people and therefore more chance of having **** people.

[Patchelicious]

When we talk about how the clubs are responsible for this, we seem to think there is some higher authority that has power over all of its minions and dictates how the clubs behave. That's not the case at all. Club "leaders" have very little power to do anything about bad behaviour. What can they really do, threaten to expel the person from the club? That's hardly punishment because there are 40 other clubs to go and join. They cant impose financial penalties or anything like that. On top of that, most of the time any "club" ride will have numerous non-club members who join or get picked up along the way. Is someone supposed to be policing the entire bunch all the time and taking a constant roll call? So the person who acts like an idiot might be riding with CL but could very possibly not be a CL member at all. To try and pin this on some sort of management structure is just misguided. Clubs are just collectives of ordinary people and people are ****. The reason why CL often comes up is probably just because they are one of the bigger clubs and so they have more people and therefore more chance of having **** people.

 

This!

[Paul Ruinaard]

Maybe some people need to be treated like children? Send them home and off the group ride immediately. Someone needs to be made an example of.

 

Strong words maybe but its like crossing the centreline in races - individuals need to be DQ'ed and made example of. Probably you will find that it is the same n0bs on group rides ignoring the unwritten rules and the written ones...

Hmm- there is a lot of arrogance and this is really a minority element that tends to get all the attention in any group. Generalisations are dangerous but should i venture to say it's likely an Elite group of fast and strong guys?

 

 

This thread is honestly unfair as every club has a bunch who is convinced of their own self importance and its sometimes the strong and fast guys who are in that bunch so by implication they are the clubs elites. Not always but often this is the case. They set the cultural example for the bunch and for the club and this filters downwards as to how its done. swe are fast therefore we are better than others and make our own rules, cause fast = good cyclist?

 

Every club has its club strong man who everyone looks up to and obeys on the road. And every club has their rogues who see themselves as having a god given right to the road.

 

FWIW: Have you ever lead a ride or tried to marshall a big bunch. It's a way to screw up your ride. IN between shouting and screaming just to keep a large bunch safe you haven't often got time to teach and be polite. Often there is immediate danger that you need to make people aware of. You can't just steer a bunch around an obstacle or through a changing traffic light or something unanticipated. It's not like that - everyone has a mind of their own.

 

Also my comfort zone with cyclists close to me is much lower than for example my wife's who panics every time someone is near. I trust my skills whereas she is much more edgy. 

 

Thing is maybe someone sees you moving over when a big bunch is passing because like my wife is you are edgy with the bunch being so near, and then taps you or warns you to just stay put. That's normal for me. My wife would go crazy. So do you let a bunch crash and multiple people fall because you are passing a nervous noob or what do you do on at the time? Then someone panics and starts shouting and cursing because they are threatened and scared and with bunch probably chirps them back. then all hell breaks loose. I have seen it many time.

 

Then whatever club it is a bunch of knobs etc.

 

Lets just understand the dynamic above - it aint easy trying to take 5 big bunches through the cradle two weeks prior to the Argus. Chances are you will infringe on or have incidents rathe rthan not. In fact its a miracle that more incidents dont occur.

 

And yes bunches have mob mentality by implication so just chill and work out a way to let them pass without any issues. Remember they are also at risk.

 

Again my 2 cents worth...

Edited March 6, 2018 by Paul Ruinaard