Motorists vs Cyclists.... again

[Tomik]

Folding a mirror is not malicious damage to property (unless you broke the mirror). Whipping is assault, period. You are in the right here, no matter that you instigated it by folding his mirror. If you had punched him, and then he whipped you, that's a different matter. But someone can't assault you for touching their car. Problem is that it would take a lot of capacity and energy to take this to court, and the satisfaction you get from it will be fleeting.

Yes, I agree, Uber is really poor from a customer perspective.

I also get angry when buzzed by a car as it is 30cm away from potential death if you think about it. Most drivers have poor judgement so not much room for error. My strategy for this to try memorise the number plate, if I see the car again, I let down a tyre with a valve tool. 5 seconds and done. Then I go back and leave a note if near my house. 

[The Ouzo]

1) I can totally relate, when the adrenalin is going I too sometimes do silly things. Slapping mirrors closed is a favourite of mine. I think something that has saved me more times than it should has been not been able to catch the car in that moment. Once the adrenalin wears off you kind of come to your senses and realise how stupid that would have been.

2) I would think assault would be a more serious crime than damage to property. Cops were as usual just being full of excrement.

3) The stories i've hear about Uber, they are not doing themselves any favours.

[Shebeen]

13 hours ago, Mamil said:

So here's an unpleasant experience. Riding back from my evening intervals session in bishops court headed down campground road in Newlands where the road narrows just after the robot when a chop in an beat up Toyota close passes me. Very close call. I shout "hey @sshole" which elicits a finger out the window.

He stops, looks like an uber driver letting out a passenger and pull up next to him and say "what the f$ck". He tells me to "f@ck off" and then I made a bad mistake. I hit his mirror pushing it closed and said "with pleasure" and rode off. 

Next thing he's roaring after me swearing and brake checking me. I dodge him and head through the traffic lights against the light. He chases after me, pulls up alongside and headed down  Camp ground road leans out of the window and starts whipping me with a sjambok. We're going about 35km an hour. Cars around hooting. I thought about pulling out my pepper spray but thought better of it cos ... Well he was barely in control of the car. Hit me 3 or 4 times.

I slammed on anchors to get away from him. He roared off, shooting the light. I chased him but couldn't keep up.

I went to the cop shop and told them what happened. Was pointed out to me that my hitting the mirror constituted grounds for him to open a case of malicious damage to property. I told them I'd think about whether I want to open a case. 

As it stands, he doesn't know who I am and has zero way of identifying me. Opening a case identifies me and opens me to a counter claim.

I have a partial number plate and the address where he dropped his passenger so making an ID is probably quite easy. 

The injuries are minor, I had more painful jacks at school. The situation was very dangerous though 

School fees, never smack someone's mirror.

Interested to hear Hubber thoughts.

,My initial thoughts:

You escalated the situation out of control. Why be aggressive when you're on the bike? A friendly wave and a query gesture might have got you an apology instead of a car chase.

 

[Shebeen]

1 hour ago, Tomik said:

Folding a mirror is not malicious damage to property (unless you broke the mirror). Whipping is assault, period. You are in the right here, no matter that you instigated it by folding his mirror. If you had punched him, and then he whipped you, that's a different matter. But someone can't assault you for touching their car. Problem is that it would take a lot of capacity and energy to take this to court, and the satisfaction you get from it will be fleeting.

Yes, I agree, Uber is really poor from a customer perspective.

I also get angry when buzzed by a car as it is 30cm away from potential death if you think about it. Most drivers have poor judgement so not much room for error. My strategy for this to try memorise the number plate, if I see the car again, I let down a tyre with a valve tool. 5 seconds and done. Then I go back and leave a note if near my house. 

@Tomik

Is this just a strategy or have you actually done this?

[Mamil]

14 minutes ago, Shebeen said:

,My initial thoughts:

You escalated the situation out of control. Why be aggressive when you're on the bike? A friendly wave and a query gesture might have got you an apology instead of a car chase.

 

That would be the pinnacle of sang froid after a 20cm close pass at 300 watts - I aspire to that level of impulse control.

A snap poll of some offline mates reveals that about half have slapped a car's mirror closed or hit against a bonnet in frustration or similar which is interesting. I wonder how many of us have done that here.

It's also a temperament thing - in the old days of club cricket teammates and opposition would say "Jeez you're such a nice oke off the field after the game" but on the field, especially when bowling I would be incredibly verbally confrontational. I work in a field that requires immense interpersonal patience and empathy and emotional regulation which I do well but on a sports field it's a different maminal.

I agree it was the mirror slap that enraged him out of control but I don't buy that I'm responsible for the incident.

 

[Tomik]

28 minutes ago, Shebeen said:

@Tomik

Is this just a strategy or have you actually done this?

I can neither confirm nor deny the allegations. Lol.

[Shebeen]

10 minutes ago, Mamil said:

That would be the pinnacle of sang froid after a 20cm close pass at 300 watts - I aspire to that level of impulse control.

A snap poll of some offline mates reveals that about half have slapped a car's mirror closed or hit against a bonnet in frustration or similar which is interesting. I wonder how many of us have done that here.

It's also a temperament thing - in the old days of club cricket teammates and opposition would say "Jeez you're such a nice oke off the field after the game" but on the field, especially when bowling I would be incredibly verbally confrontational. I work in a field that requires immense interpersonal patience and empathy and emotional regulation which I do well but on a sports field it's a different maminal.

I agree it was the mirror slap that enraged him out of control but I don't buy that I'm responsible for the incident.

 

I totally disagree. I didn't say you were responsible but you took the aggressive blue pill when the pacifist red pill could actually have had a better outcome. What do we have now, another motorist who hates cyclists. Thanks.

I have never called a motorist rude words to cause a scene. Cyclists need to be chilled, it's just that simple. The whole thread title is "Motorists vs Cyclists", why does it have to be us vs them? Why does it have to be a confrontation?

 

It doesn't, and from a cyclist perspective it definitely doesn't because of the whole 2tons of metal with an angry driver thing. Share the road, do your bit to make that actually happen.

 

 

 

 

[The Ouzo]

1 hour ago, Tomik said:

Most drivers have poor judgement so not much room for error

Up here in the big smoke my experience has been those with smaller cars are the biggest problem.

And then on the other end of the scale, the side tipper truck brigade. But I dont think these are poor judgement but rather DGAF attitude, judging by the amount of crashes I see them reported in.

 

And then lets not forget the white Fortuner brigade, but again they DGAF about anyone (stereotypically speaking)

[Skubarra]

14 hours ago, Mamil said:

So here's an unpleasant experience. Riding back from my evening intervals session in bishops court headed down campground road in Newlands where the road narrows just after the robot when a chop in an beat up Toyota close passes me. Very close call. I shout "hey @sshole" which elicits a finger out the window.

He stops, looks like an uber driver letting out a passenger and pull up next to him and say "what the f$ck". He tells me to "f@ck off" and then I made a bad mistake. I hit his mirror pushing it closed and said "with pleasure" and rode off. 

Next thing he's roaring after me swearing and brake checking me. I dodge him and head through the traffic lights against the light. He chases after me, pulls up alongside and headed down  Camp ground road leans out of the window and starts whipping me with a sjambok. We're going about 35km an hour. Cars around hooting. I thought about pulling out my pepper spray but thought better of it cos ... Well he was barely in control of the car. Hit me 3 or 4 times.

I slammed on anchors to get away from him. He roared off, shooting the light. I chased him but couldn't keep up.

I went to the cop shop and told them what happened. Was pointed out to me that my hitting the mirror constituted grounds for him to open a case of malicious damage to property. I told them I'd think about whether I want to open a case. 

As it stands, he doesn't know who I am and has zero way of identifying me. Opening a case identifies me and opens me to a counter claim.

I have a partial number plate and the address where he dropped his passenger so making an ID is probably quite easy. 

The injuries are minor, I had more painful jacks at school. The situation was very dangerous though 

School fees, never smack someone's mirror.

Interested to hear Hubber thoughts.

Rationalising behind the safety of a keyboard it is very easy to say you should have just shrugged it off and let things be (and that is the correct advice).

But being buzzed by a car is a pretty harrowing experience and I certainly don't blame you for lashing out moments after you saw your life flashing past your eyes, I can see myself doing something similar in that situation.

However at this point I don't see what can be gained by pursuing this further? An apology? A warning? Is this something worth spending your valuable time and money on?

['Dale]

19 hours ago, Mamil said:

So here's an unpleasant experience.

SNIP

The injuries are minor, I had more painful jacks at school. The situation was very dangerous though 

School fees, never smack someone's mirror.

Interested to hear Hubber thoughts.

I can imagine that you were adrenalized and psychologically aroused after your interval session. You also shared here recent absolutely frightening experiences on the road (see here predisposed sympathetic nervous system that is in fight, flight or freeze mode) that might have led to your low impulse control, aggressive reaction and fury. You are only human, man. 

I feel for you as cycling is intended to bring in joy, relaxation, meaning, connection to the Great Outside, as well as the other million reasons we roll. Now, it has escalated into a few experiences of real disharmony and angst.

However, the best way to manage conflict or a potential war situation is to not have war at all. My bottom line to you: Protect your inner peace at all costs. Remember your ‘Why’. See pic. 

Sterkte, Bru. 💟

Edited December 7, 2023 by 'Dale

[ChrisF]

4 hours ago, Michael Dewing said:

Dooood Uber are soo bad when it comes to things like this.! 😡

I had an altercation with an Uber driver who’s driving was soo bad.. he missed an off ramp then drove off on the next one, missed another turn off from that off ramp, stopped the car, reversed while other cars had to dodge him, turned off and then stopped in some suburb and told me that was the destination, when I said it wasn’t he told me I must have made a mistake, I’m stupid and to get out.. I told him what I thought of him and got out.. 

no doubt one stars were given from us both.. 

I reported it but later received an email from Uber about the verbal altercation and the drivers safety being of utmost importance, my account will be suspended blah blah.. I responded with the events that lead up to the altercation and how it was actually my safety, their customers safety, that they should be concerned about.. they were having none of it and the response was generic and still all about their drivers safety.. 

I don’t use Uber anymore

 

IF Uber could be bothered ... there are multiple cameras in their vehicles !!!

 

They CAN see the full interaction .... again, if they could be bothered to ....

[Jewbacca]

3 minutes ago, ChrisF said:

 

IF Uber could be bothered ... there are multiple cameras in their vehicles !!!

 

They CAN see the full interaction .... again, if they could be bothered to ....

Are there cameras in ALL Ubers? 

If so, how do we destroy footage?

Asking for a friend

[ChrisF]

1 minute ago, Jewbacca said:

Are there cameras in ALL Ubers? 

If so, how do we destroy footage?

Asking for a friend

 

When I fly to Lanceria I typically use Uber to my sites.

 

With the last trip I asked the driver about the unit next to the A-pillar - it looked like a radar unit.  He proceeded to point out all the cameras.  It covers all road angles, as well as driver and passengers.

 

Ironically (thankfully), my interactions with Uber drivers over the last 6 years have been good.

 

No fuss of renting a vehicle.  No issues with trying to find your way in unknown areas.  No driving through Diepsloot, as Garmin sees this as the shortest route !!  I always sit in front, and chat to the driver.  Actually works out cheaper for shorter trips.

 

One of my sites from OR Tambo is too far, and I must rent a vehicle .... what a shlep by comparison ....

 

Last couple of trips the one common feedback - Uber is NOT paying these drives enough !!  Their pay has not kept pace with petrol, vehicle costs, cost of living.  Drivers with nearly a decade of experience wanting to stop working for Uber.  At this rate the decent drivers are jumping ship, and things may well get worse ....

[The Ouzo]

2 minutes ago, ChrisF said:

 

When I fly to Lanceria I typically use Uber to my sites.

 

With the last trip I asked the driver about the unit next to the A-pillar - it looked like a radar unit.  He proceeded to point out all the cameras.  It covers all road angles, as well as driver and passengers.

 

Ironically (thankfully), my interactions with Uber drivers over the last 6 years have been good.

 

No fuss of renting a vehicle.  No issues with trying to find your way in unknown areas.  No driving through Diepsloot, as Garmin sees this as the shortest route !!  I always sit in front, and chat to the driver.  Actually works out cheaper for shorter trips.

 

One of my sites from OR Tambo is too far, and I must rent a vehicle .... what a shlep by comparison ....

 

Last couple of trips the one common feedback - Uber is NOT paying these drives enough !!  Their pay has not kept pace with petrol, vehicle costs, cost of living.  Drivers with nearly a decade of experience wanting to stop working for Uber.  At this rate the decent drivers are jumping ship, and things may well get worse ....

I'm yet to see a camera in an Uber (granted I very seldom use one). But I sell many cars to Uber owners and the owners mention nothing about installation of cameras.

 

Have you seen what hidden charges get added to your bill when you Uber to an Airport ? These are not quoted upfront, but debited from your credit card automatically. Again Uber just shrugs their shoulders and offers a BS excuse.

[ChrisF]

2 minutes ago, The Ouzo said:

I'm yet to see a camera in an Uber (granted I very seldom use one). But I sell many cars to Uber owners and the owners mention nothing about installation of cameras.

 

Have you seen what hidden charges get added to your bill when you Uber to an Airport ? These are not quoted upfront, but debited from your credit card automatically. Again Uber just shrugs their shoulders and offers a BS excuse.

 

Interesting about the cameras.  I will certainly look for this on my next trip.

 

I have had one off R25 added on one trip.  Day still a few R100 cheaper than a rental.

 

With rental cars you always wait to see how much toll gets added, or if they want to add fuel .... we have to wrap up our account to our client before we even get final feedback from the rental company.  And that infernal block on my card .... I really dislike rental cars. 😛

 

 

There certainly is a time and a place for each of these.

[The Ouzo]

25 minutes ago, ChrisF said:

 

Interesting about the cameras.  I will certainly look for this on my next trip.

 

I have had one off R25 added on one trip.  Day still a few R100 cheaper than a rental.

 

With rental cars you always wait to see how much toll gets added, or if they want to add fuel .... we have to wrap up our account to our client before we even get final feedback from the rental company.  And that infernal block on my card .... I really dislike rental cars. 😛

 

 

There certainly is a time and a place for each of these.

Nothing against Uber as a concept, I think they are  a great idea. Its more the SA drivers and Uber's no chalant responses that get me riled up.