Cyclists with a "Running" Problem

[shaper]

After some "light"   reading on the DC Rainmaker site:

 

Those with Fenix 5 or similar can install the Garmin Running Power App to get some Running power functionality without spending additional cash.

 

For those with Fenix 3 or similar, like me... we can't get the Garmin Running Power App but there is a privately developed App to try:https://apps.garmin.com/en-US/apps/530bd211-afd5-41a6-8204-9a2f7ac94541#0

 

I'll give it whirl and let you guys know. The reviews look good, but it will obviously fall far short of a dedicated Power Running device.

Just been reading the reviews on the app, looks interesting.  Once you have tried it out, please let us know if it gives real time data as you run or whether it just gives average per lap (as some seem to say).  Post run it looks like it downloads the power data to Garmin connect, so possibly can be exported to other platforms.

 

When training and racing with power, you need the data to be in real time on your watch which you can see and then adjust your running accordingly.

[Andymann]

All very interesting, thanks for the explanations.

 

Out of interest Andymann, do you guys have stock of the newer Stryd that also takes wind into account?

 

We have one left - my one, but it's still in the box.  I was going to try it this weekend but there seems to be a demand, so we might decide to sell it.

[Andymann]

What I have also found that not only can you pace or push better, but in training with stryd I have become more efficient a runner. Where last year, my pace would be relevant to a certain power, now at the same power my pace is faster! It is a small percentage but it can make a huge difference in overall race time.

 

Definitely - when I first started using mine, the first hill I hit I had to slow to a very uncomfortable shuffle - to a point where I (in my Expensive kit and watch) was passed by a lady with a bag on her head running to catch a taxi 

 

Was very humbling.

 

Now though, my running style has adapted and for the same power I can run hills much faster.

[shaper]

Definitely - when I first started using mine, the first hill I hit I had to slow to a very uncomfortable shuffle - to a point where I (in my Expensive kit and watch) was passed by a lady with a bag on her head running to catch a taxi 

 

Was very humbling.

 

Now though, my running style has adapted and for the same power I can run hills much faster.

lol even in more recent times some of the more hilly races, I watch runners fly past me on hills as I slow down to stay close to my target race power, only to either pass them on the downhill or at some point later in the race as they fatigue quicker.  Running to power has improved efficiency, pacing and finishing strong!

[Frosty]

After some "light" reading on the DC Rainmaker site:

 

Those with Fenix 5 or similar can install the Garmin Running Power App to get some Running power functionality without spending additional cash.

 

For those with Fenix 3 or similar, like me... we can't get the Garmin Running Power App but there is a privately developed App to try:https://apps.garmin.com/en-US/apps/530bd211-afd5-41a6-8204-9a2f7ac94541#0

 

I'll give it whirl and let you guys know. The reviews look good, but it will obviously fall far short of a dedicated Power Running device.

Just been reading the reviews on the app, looks interesting. Once you have tried it out, please let us know if it gives real time data as you run or whether it just gives average per lap (as some seem to say). Post run it looks like it downloads the power data to Garmin connect, so possibly can be exported to other platforms.

 

When training and racing with power, you need the data to be in real time on your watch which you can see and then adjust your running accordingly.

From the reviews I read, it shows current power, and the max and average is calculated by Garmin Connect. That was what the developer says in a reply on the app review in GC.

 

I might go for a run today, just to try it out.

Edited June 25, 2020 by Frosty

[Pieter-za]

Just been reading the reviews on the app, looks interesting.  Once you have tried it out, please let us know if it gives real time data as you run or whether it just gives average per lap (as some seem to say).  Post run it looks like it downloads the power data to Garmin connect, so possibly can be exported to other platforms.

 

When training and racing with power, you need the data to be in real time on your watch which you can see and then adjust your running accordingly.

Been playing with it for some time now, and the RP app also has a data field(s) for use while running.  (Time duration is definable for measurement interval.)

 

The 'Gradient' is also part of it.

Edited June 25, 2020 by Pieter-za

[ScottCM]

After some "light"   reading on the DC Rainmaker site:

 

Those with Fenix 5 or similar can install the Garmin Running Power App to get some Running power functionality without spending additional cash.

 

For those with Fenix 3 or similar, like me... we can't get the Garmin Running Power App but there is a privately developed App to try:https://apps.garmin.com/en-US/apps/530bd211-afd5-41a6-8204-9a2f7ac94541#0

 

I'll give it whirl and let you guys know. The reviews look good, but it will obviously fall far short of a dedicated Power Running device.

 

I've been using it for 5 weeks or so now. The "Figure" used in the garmin is almost double the cycling metric figure. My cycling (Garmin Vector 3S) FTP is 228W and with the Garmin Fenix 5 running is 340W.

 

It seems consistent though which is the main thing i suppose. 

[Chris_]

Keep your Comrades... the boss of bosses is here:

 

The “Washie Weekend Virtual Run” is a 3 day 100 mile / a 160.940 km virtual running event that will take place from 03-05 July 2020.

 

You get 3 days so it should be easy 

[Chris_]

Keep your Comrades... the boss of bosses is here:

 

The “Washie Weekend Virtual Run” is a 3 day 100 mile / a 160.940 km virtual running event that will take place from 03-05 July 2020.

 

You get 3 days so it should be easy 

 

Haha you pay them 50 whole bucks and they send you a virtual race number. Thats it.

 

Theres no winner, you get alphabetically listed results, you don't have to supply proof, you get no tshirt, no medal, niks fokol.. 

 

This is the jam!

[shaper]

From the reviews I read, it shows current power, and the max and average is calculated by Garmin Connect. That was what the developer says in a reply on the app review in GC.

 

I might go for a run today, just to try it out.

What you need to do is runs at different paces, firstly to see how constant the power reading is and to start building a pace correlation to power spreadsheet.  i.e something like 200w is 6min/km pace, 220w is 5:30min/km (which will be specific to you).  If it is consistent over time running similar pace and getting power, then you can do a critical power test and start building your Power Distribution Curve.

 

https://support.stryd.com/hc/en-us/articles/115003989074-How-do-I-perform-a-critical-power-test-and-get-my-critical-power-and-zones-

https://support.stryd.com/hc/en-us/articles/360039261314-Critical-Power

 

If you are still using your WK04, you will be able to create a running power curve.  If you have started using Golden Cheetah, you can use the in built cycling power curve and then use the filter for running activities only.  You will also need to filter your cycling power curve in Golden Cheetah for cycling activities only.  Running power numbers are higher than cycling, so you need to have the 2 different power curves else things get a bit skewed.

 

And if still using Xert, they do not differentiate activities in their power calculations, even though this has been asked for in the forums.  Xerts answer is that you have to create 2 profiles, one for cycling and one for running, and upload your activities accordingly, so that you don't skew the power curves 

Edited June 25, 2020 by shaper

[shaper]

I've been using it for 5 weeks or so now. The "Figure" used in the garmin is almost double the cycling metric figure. My cycling (Garmin Vector 3S) FTP is 228W and with the Garmin Fenix 5 running is 340W.

 

It seems consistent though which is the main thing i suppose. 

Running power is always higher than cycling power, you cannot compare the two.  

[travisza]

Running power is always higher than cycling power, you cannot compare the two.  

 

Ya don't bother comparing them. Not the same thing at all.

[Frosty]

What you need to do is runs at different paces, firstly to see how constant the power reading is and to start building a pace correlation to power spreadsheet. i.e something like 200w is 6min/km pace, 220w is 5:30min/km (which will be specific to you). If it is consistent over time running similar pace and getting power, then you can do a critical power test and start building your Power Distribution Curve.

 

https://support.stryd.com/hc/en-us/articles/115003989074-How-do-I-perform-a-critical-power-test-and-get-my-critical-power-and-zones-

https://support.stryd.com/hc/en-us/articles/360039261314-Critical-Power

 

If you are still using your WK04, you will be able to create a running power curve. If you have started using Golden Cheetah, you can use the in built cycling power curve and then use the filter for running activities only. You will also need to filter your cycling power curve in Golden Cheetah for cycling activities only. Running power numbers are higher than cycling, so you need to have the 2 different power curves else things get a bit skewed.

 

And if still using Xert, they do not differentiate activities in their power calculations, even though this has been asked for in the forums. Xerts answer is that you have to create 2 profiles, one for cycling and one for running, and upload your activities accordingly, so that you don't skew the power curves

Thanks. Lot to learn, but that’s cool.

[shaper]

Thanks. Lot to learn, but that’s cool.

Once you have a critical power number then you can create workouts and train accordingly, same as you would do with cycling.

 

Also once you have a spreadsheet with different powers relating to different pace, you can do a run or race at specific power.  Stryd app has a calculator to do this but is easy enough to create a spreadsheet of the correlation of power to pace.  i.e, if you want to run a 10km at 6min/km, that will relate to say 200w (for ease of numbers).  Irrespective of whether it is a flat 10km or hilly 10km, if your run to power (a consistent 200w) you expend the same amount of energy but will be more efficient especially on the hilly course.

Edited June 25, 2020 by shaper

[Jewbacca]

How would the stryde work on trails?

 

With very different running patterns and foot movements?

 

It would be pretty cool to see data on technical trails vs road

[Andymann]

How would the stryde work on trails?

 

With very different running patterns and foot movements?

 

It would be pretty cool to see data on technical trails vs road

It's messy on Trails I won't lie - this is my file from CT Trail last year - couple of things.  I started way too hard - my fault - Trail running in CT is not Cowhouse Farm running in Gauteng!  Also, my inexperience of descending is clear to see - usually my power on the descents is the same as the ascent - but in this case I had to walk a bit on the downhills.  But in general my power was fairly constant, and i finished well - probably more on adrenaline than good pacing!

Edited June 25, 2020 by Andymann