WTF CSA?

[Danger Dassie]

wrt to the bit in bold,

1) Day License gives you access to the CSA insurance for the day. There is limitations on the policy wrt to this so best to request a copy of the policy doc and review it. Whether you get a response or not I guess is up to your regional rep. You could also email an exco member form another region

 

2) there is no difference to membership vs full racing license at a regional level for all categories excluding Elite Men and Women and Junior Men and Women who require full racing license at all times to compete in sanctioned events. Other age categories only need a membership. This was implemented to promote growth in age category racing.

At a National level any rider wishing to compete in age category events is required to have a full racing license to participate in e..g National XCO champs, 

Where is this stated then?

Because then someone is talking porky pies. To have a seeding at national events you need a provincial ranking and seeding index.

 

From the site itself; 

 

https://www.cyclingsa.com/membership/

 

Licence structure explained

Full Racing License

This category of license is for riders from the age of 17-years-old who wish to be eligible for provincial and national selection and respective colours award. The bearer of a full license is entitled to partake in national championships or series race and be seeded accordingly. Those of who race in the UCI categories (Junior, U23 and Elite) earn UCI points, which will assist them in being seeded at future UCI category events, UCI World Cups and UCI World Championships. The cost of a full racing license is R450 per year, and the applicant has to be member of an affiliated club, as well as be a registered member of Cycling SA. These MUST be done simultaneously for a Full Racing License to be valid. Full Racing Licenses are only valid from 1 January to 31 December each year.

Membership

As from 1 November 2017, a membership of Cycling SA costs R250 per year. A membership holder is entitled to enter any event, irrespective of discipline, without having to purchase a day license. A member is allowed to participate in a national series event, but will not be eligible for national or provincial selection. A membership of Cycling SA is the most basic form of license and is an agreement of the rider to abide by the rules of the event in which they participate.

Day License

The Day-license is designed to allow the absolute newcomers of the sport to participate within the rules and regulations of the sport. These participants, who do not hold a full license or membership, need to purchase a day license. By purchasing a day license the rider agrees to participate in the event and abide with the rules of the event and those of Cycling SA for that day. A day license costs R35 and is only valid for one day.

Membership downloads

• Procedure to Apply for an International Racing License

Procedure to Apply for an International Racing Licence

 

Cyclists who wish to race abroad, and/or participate in local UCI events are required to obtain an International Racing Licence, after applying for permission to race in the international events.

 

Applications need to be made in writing to Cycling South Africa, and must be accompanied by an insurance policy and the policy’s exclusions (terms and conditions). 

 

The rider needs to have a valid Domestic Racing License. Youth riders (U16) are only required to become members and will receive all the benefits of a domestic racing license.

 

The rider needs to forward their departure and arrivals dates.

 

The International Licence, which comes at no additional cost, will only be issued once Cycling SA has received a copy of the cyclist’s insurance and the policy’s exclusions (Terms and Conditions).  No International Licenses will be issued without proof of valid Medical, Travel and Repatriation Insurances.

 

 

As per Cycling South Africa RULES:

 

1.3.1.5 INTERNATIONAL LICENSE - A rider has to apply for permission to race in international events.

 

1.3.1.5.1 No international License will be issued without the proof of Medical, Travel (when racing outside the South African Borders) and Repatriation insurance.

 

1.3.1.5.2     All licenses will be issued with ‘valid from’ and ‘valid until’ fields which will be determined by the validity of the Insurance provided.

 

1.3.1.5.3     All riders from a Professional Continental and Pro Tour team whose particulars reflect on the UCI website as a registered member will be issued with an INTERNATIONAL LICENSE when applying for a RACING LICENSE.

 

1.3.1.5.4     No additional costs will apply to be issued with an INTERNATIONAL LICENSE. 

 

1.3.1.5.5     CYCLINGSA will issue a letter of permission to participate internationally reflecting all insurance particulars.

 

1.3.1.5.6     Applications need to be made in writing to CYCLINGSA accompanied by the insurance policy.

[Patchelicious]

Imagine how cool it would be if there was a CSA representative who could answer these questions.

[Andrew Steer]

Imagine how cool it would be if there was a CSA representative who could answer these questions.

Are you not keen to volunteer - wouldn't that be fun   

 

I must say I just don't know about anything anymore - the most obvious worry for me is the lack of transparency in the organisation. It makes it impossible to know what is going on... so while I do have some good experiences in working with certain people at CSA, I haven't a clue who the rotten eggs are or might be...

 

And it doesn't seem like any answers will be forth coming anytime soon either 

[Patchelicious]

Are you not keen to volunteer - wouldn't that be fun

 

I must say I just don't know about anything anymore - the most obvious worry for me is the lack of transparency in the organisation. It makes it impossible to know what is going on... so while I do have some good experiences in working with certain people at CSA, I haven't a clue who the rotten eggs are or might be...

 

And it doesn't seem like any answers will be forth coming anytime soon either

You joke, but it is something that I offered to do on two occasions to two separate people at CSA a few years back when I thought they still wanted to make a difference.

[shaper]

Imagine how cool it would be if there was a CSA representative who could answer these questions.

That would mean they are accountable and liable..... it does not seem to be the CSA ethos!!

Edited October 9, 2018 by shaper

[DieselnDust]

Where is this stated then?

Because then someone is talking porky pies. To have a seeding at national events you need a provincial ranking and seeding index.

 

From the site itself; 

 

https://www.cyclingsa.com/membership/

 

Licence structure explained

Full Racing License

This category of license is for riders from the age of 17-years-old who wish to be eligible for provincial and national selection and respective colours award. The bearer of a full license is entitled to partake in national championships or series race and be seeded accordingly. Those of who race in the UCI categories (Junior, U23 and Elite) earn UCI points, which will assist them in being seeded at future UCI category events, UCI World Cups and UCI World Championships. The cost of a full racing license is R450 per year, and the applicant has to be member of an affiliated club, as well as be a registered member of Cycling SA. These MUST be done simultaneously for a Full Racing License to be valid. Full Racing Licenses are only valid from 1 January to 31 December each year.

Membership

As from 1 November 2017, a membership of Cycling SA costs R250 per year. A membership holder is entitled to enter any event, irrespective of discipline, without having to purchase a day license. A member is allowed to participate in a national series event, but will not be eligible for national or provincial selection. A membership of Cycling SA is the most basic form of license and is an agreement of the rider to abide by the rules of the event in which they participate.

Day License

The Day-license is designed to allow the absolute newcomers of the sport to participate within the rules and regulations of the sport. These participants, who do not hold a full license or membership, need to purchase a day license. By purchasing a day license the rider agrees to participate in the event and abide with the rules of the event and those of Cycling SA for that day. A day license costs R35 and is only valid for one day.

Membership downloads

• Procedure to Apply for an International Racing License

Procedure to Apply for an International Racing Licence

 

Cyclists who wish to race abroad, and/or participate in local UCI events are required to obtain an International Racing Licence, after applying for permission to race in the international events.

 

Applications need to be made in writing to Cycling South Africa, and must be accompanied by an insurance policy and the policy’s exclusions (terms and conditions). 

 

The rider needs to have a valid Domestic Racing License. Youth riders (U16) are only required to become members and will receive all the benefits of a domestic racing license.

 

The rider needs to forward their departure and arrivals dates.

 

The International Licence, which comes at no additional cost, will only be issued once Cycling SA has received a copy of the cyclist’s insurance and the policy’s exclusions (Terms and Conditions).  No International Licenses will be issued without proof of valid Medical, Travel and Repatriation Insurances.

 

 

As per Cycling South Africa RULES:

 

1.3.1.5 INTERNATIONAL LICENSE - A rider has to apply for permission to race in international events.

 

1.3.1.5.1 No international License will be issued without the proof of Medical, Travel (when racing outside the South African Borders) and Repatriation insurance.

 

1.3.1.5.2     All licenses will be issued with ‘valid from’ and ‘valid until’ fields which will be determined by the validity of the Insurance provided.

 

1.3.1.5.3     All riders from a Professional Continental and Pro Tour team whose particulars reflect on the UCI website as a registered member will be issued with an INTERNATIONAL LICENSE when applying for a RACING LICENSE.

 

1.3.1.5.4     No additional costs will apply to be issued with an INTERNATIONAL LICENSE. 

 

1.3.1.5.5     CYCLINGSA will issue a letter of permission to participate internationally reflecting all insurance particulars.

 

1.3.1.5.6     Applications need to be made in writing to CYCLINGSA accompanied by the insurance policy.

 

 

So as I understand it that section in bold is for non age category i.e riders not registered into an age category series.

In WPCyling age category members are eligible for WP colors in their age category but not at elite level. So I think the bit in bold applies to riders who should be eligible for Elite.

I'll find the bit on this on the wpcyling website this evening.

[Rolling Stone]

Answer the question directly without deflection and obfuscation please.

 

Based on past experience and related by Frosty, region does not answer. So you as a representative of the region are now being asked.

When and where is the AGM?

 

And fyi any constitution and financials should be available publicly. Like for example the website, which is nothing more than a landing page currently.

cgccycling.co.za

The facebook page, of which there are two, has been purged of a lot of content. Twitter account, dormant.

The CSA website has conflicting info on wether or not Gauteng actually has an exco representive.

You assume too much bud

I am not from Gauteng East

[Rolling Stone]

You assume too much bud

I am not from Gauteng East

Maybe you should tell us what region you are from and what your beef with CSA is

For a Guy that has so many questions you surely have a lot to say.

 

Go talk to your region

If you are a CGC member PM me with all your details and I can try to let you have all the info you require.

alternatively just go and read on the CSA web site.

Edited October 9, 2018 by Rolling Stone

[Rolling Stone]

Maybe you should tell us what region you are from and what your beef with CSA is

For a Guy that has so many questions you surely have a lot to say.

 

Go talk to your region

If you are a CGC member PM me with all your details and I can try to let you have all the info you require.

alternatively just go and read on the CSA web site.

CHC web site is very new and will be populated in due course

we have however not withheld any info from members that have enquired as far as I know.

I cannot speak for previous years, but we are happy to share whatever info we have from those years.

Last communications with the previous chairman/general manager was through lawyers. Requesting info and backup documentation that we still do not have.

[Rolling Stone]

So as I understand it that section in bold is for non age category i.e riders not registered into an age category series.

In WPCyling age category members are eligible for WP colors in their age category but not at elite level. So I think the bit in bold applies to riders who should be eligible for Elite.

I'll find the bit on this on the wpcyling website this evening.

the way I understand it any youth younger than 17 does not need a racing license , not even for nationals, provincials etc.

They must however have a CSA membership to do provincials, nationalsvetc.

Any rider older than 17 must have a full racing licensa in order to do provincials, nationals etc (even vets and masters)

 

For the rest a standard CSA membership is adequate. unless you wantbto race in the licensed cats or do provincials or nationals.

[Rolling Stone]

So as I understand it that section in bold is for non age category i.e riders not registered into an age category series.

In WPCyling age category members are eligible for WP colors in their age category but not at elite level. So I think the bit in bold applies to riders who should be eligible for Elite.

I'll find the bit on this on the wpcyling website this evening.

the way I understand it any youth younger than 17 does not need a racing license , not even for nationals, provincials etc.

They must however have a CSA membership to do provincials, nationalsvetc.

Any rider older than 17 must have a full racing licensa in order to do provincials, nationals etc (even vets and masters)

 

For the rest a standard CSA membership is adequate. unless you wantbto race in the licensed cats or do provincials or nationals.

 

There is a lot of confusion with regards to membership and full racing License.

even officials sometimes get it wrong.

Edited October 9, 2018 by Rolling Stone

[Patchelicious]

Maybe you should tell us what region you are from and what your beef with CSA is

For a Guy that has so many questions you surely have a lot to say.

 

Go talk to your region

If you are a CGC member PM me with all your details and I can try to let you have all the info you require.

alternatively just go and read on the CSA web site.

Why can’t you post the answers here for all of us to see?

[Rolling Stone]

Why can’t you post the answers here for all of us to see?

[Rolling Stone]

Why can’t you post the answers here for all of us to see?

[Danger Dassie]

RS, let me help you out here, bud as there is no "assume" of anything.
I don't have a "beef" as you put it.
Consistently dodging questions and deflecting answers however, does nothing to endear a productive line of engagement. No assumptions. 

You decided to post on the hub as a communicator, albeit under the most figurative of approaches and basically it was pulling teeth to get you to declare your posistion.
That already sets a tone of suspicion with the intended audience. Communication is a two way street, but fair enough maybe communication isn't a strong suit.
But then put your hand up and just say "Looks guys, I am only involved at X level and can't answer questions on Y"

I am no longer a club or regional member, bar day licences. That doesn't make myself or others uninterested partys however.

Publicly open the AGM and invite all riders and interested partys to attend, that way it can at least be seen as open and the support you guys need will be more than likely forthcoming.
 
But using the old structures. Telling people to contact someone in a probable none existent position, send a PM and look up CSA with conflicting information. That's a hiding to nowhere. It has been for the last good few years and is so currently.
So choose to share the AGM info, or not. 

Forget about waiting to populate the site with all the bells and whistles, put up a one pager notice updating visitors the situation as it stands. Mention that there is a current legal issue and it is being worked on.
Clean up the social media accounts, especially the Facebook pages. The one FB account that I was directly invloved has had much of it's previous content removed, for whatever reason.

This is the actually the correct format and easier to communicate for formal organisations with members and has a searchable handle (@cgcycling) - https://www.facebook.com/CGCycling/

This on the other hand isn't a great layout and format, currently seems to be a classifieds for everyone - https://www.facebook.com/groups/130031263887/?ref=br_rs

Simple basics that will cut out much of the challenge and encourage people to be more supportive.

[Pure Savage]

We knot picking around with CSA, we should be doing something like park run. How does ASA deal with that? We are being far too exclusionary and our sport is getting old fast.

 

Something needs to be done ASAP to stop the average age of a cyclist creeping above 55!