Help a Roadie understand MTB things

[TNT1]

7 minutes ago, Trashy said:

It does exist. If you can define the range "everything" and are willing to live with compromises within that range.

 

No thank you.

 

[Mountain Bru]

1 hour ago, Jase619 said:

Flat and non technical would be the most weekends kind of vibe, however, if you read further the goal would be to get a bike that if we were to take them away with us, say to a place that is not flat and technical, and we decided to do a race, be it Sani2C, or W2W or whatever the case may be, that we would be correctly kitted out for such an occasion. The decision to ride these races is basically made, just needing the bikes, hence making a decision with that in mind.

I am picking up on a few things here, but I am guessing that a hardtail would not be sufficient in such a case? 

If you read my other post - Buy the bike thats best suited to 90% of the riding you do, or that's gonna make it the most fun for you. That is after all the goal - to enjoy your rides as much as possible. No bike is perfect for everything, and even in one ride, or in one race, there will be sections where a XC bike is better than trail bike and visa versa. There's no right answer here, just smaller compromises. 

If you do Sani2C, or W2W or whatever race, your bike won't be the limiting factor. Guys do those races on hardtails, and fly, so any dual sus will be fine. In terms of the "going away with a bike" situation - realistically, how many rides is that gonna be in a year? And what percentage of those rides is gonna be over really technical terrain? (Just an honest question to consider)

It doesn't make sense to me to buy a certain kind of bike because I might do 2% of my riding in a year over some terrain where a certain bike might be 20% better. I want the bike that is best suited to 90% of my riding in a year, and is competent over the rest. 
If you can, maybe try test ride a bike or two though even if it's just in the parking lot? If you can jump off one and onto another, the differences will become really obvious, really quickly. I rode a 150mm travel bike for maybe 20 meters in a parking lot and knew it was the wrong bike for me, and jumped on a 100mm travel epic and loved it from the start.

[Mountain Bru]

31 minutes ago, MORNE said:

even though now banned in modern dh, GMBN did a test in one episode...full ski suit with makeshift cardboard disk wheels and it was so much faster lol.

this guy was a visionary. 

Did they test if disk wheels make you faster over jumps in a crosswind? ????

Watching Blake ride and jump a gravel bike in a pink helmet convinced me that this thread and discussions about travel are invalid.  

 

[6AL4V]

1 hour ago, Jase619 said:

Flat and non technical would be the most weekends kind of vibe, however, if you read further the goal would be to get a bike that if we were to take them away with us, say to a place that is not flat and technical, and we decided to do a race, be it Sani2C, or W2W or whatever the case may be, that we would be correctly kitted out for such an occasion. The decision to ride these races is basically made, just needing the bikes, hence making a decision with that in mind.

I am picking up on a few things here, but I am guessing that a hardtail would not be sufficient in such a case? 

IMHO this is dependent on the type of hardtail i.e. frame material, geometry and fit.

You will be surprised at what can be ridden on a hardtail.

A well designed steel / titanium hardtail with a good fork (120 / 130 mm travel with 34 / 35 mm stanchions) will be a very nice bike to ride.

Hardtails are also cheaper to maintain than a full suss.

 

[Jase619]

Okay, in terms of taking into account what most of you are saying, would the Trek Top Fuel 7 be a better choice then? If not being specific to brand, but in general range of travel and budget considered? The Scott Spark also can be a contender.

Deciding factor really is stock, especially when looking for two bikes

[Mountain Bru]

5 minutes ago, Jase619 said:

Okay, in terms of taking into account what most of you are saying, would the Trek Top Fuel 7 be a better choice then? If not being specific to brand, but in general range of travel and budget considered? The Scott Spark also can be a contender.

Deciding factor really is stock, especially when looking for two bikes

At the risk of opening another can of worms.........

How many bottle cages do you want on the bike? 

[Trashy]

14 minutes ago, Jase619 said:

Okay, in terms of taking into account what most of you are saying, would the Trek Top Fuel 7 be a better choice then? If not being specific to brand, but in general range of travel and budget considered? The Scott Spark also can be a contender.

Deciding factor really is stock, especially when looking for two bikes

Quite honestly, as long as you are buying a reputable brand, it's almost impossible to buy a bike that you will be unhappy with. Anything with 130mm travel or less will be amazing, hardtails included!

Mountain biking is fun, period. I'm not sure why people are so set on making it sound miserable to ride a bike that is not perfectly suited to the given terrain at any one moment.

Go ride a few bikes and let your body decide what feels right, then ride away into the sunset with a smile on your face.

Also, your wife may prefer a Scott, and you the Trek, matching bikes are not a necessity, as cool as it might be.

[Spafsack]

Actually a very good question

[DieselnDust]

1 hour ago, Mountain Bru said:

At the risk of opening another can of worms.........

How many bottle cages do you want on the bike? 

drum roll......and the can opener award goes too................drum roll

[DieselnDust]

55 minutes ago, Trashy said:

Quite honestly, as long as you are buying a reputable brand, it's almost impossible to buy a bike that you will be unhappy with. Anything with 130mm travel or less will be amazing, hardtails included!

Mountain biking is fun, period. I'm not sure why people are so set on making it sound miserable to ride a bike that is not perfectly suited to the given terrain at any one moment.

Go ride a few bikes and let your body decide what feels right, then ride away into the sunset with a smile on your face.

Also, your wife may prefer a Scott, and you the Trek, matching bikes are not a necessity, as cool as it might be.

spot on!

 

and don't forget after you buy that bike you fell in love with tomorrow you will see one you think you should have bought and then you will start upgrading your current bike till it matches that one you thought you should have bought. Once you get there you will sell this upgraded bike because well soema, and then you will buy another porject,.....sooorry bike and cycle off into the sunset ....till the sunrises

[Noshow]

My tuppenceworth is you're on the right track with the 120mm top fuel, spark etc.  Ideally not the super steep head angle race bikes (go for less than say 68 deg), and if you get one with a fork that can easily be extended with spacers (most Rockshox) you have the option to add 20mm at the front at minimal costs later on if you feel like you want more travel.

The only time you will need more than that is if you are doing pretty steep downhill tracks (certainly steeper than you'll see on S2C, W2W etc) - then as a relative beginner it will help with the over the bars feeling (or reality!) which can be intimidating (a dropper post will also help with this).

If you ride a 140+ bike like a Stumpjumper on a stage race or one day event, and even for regular flattish rides over say 2 hrs, you will be slow and knackered and wish you'd gone for something lighter and more efficient.  Tyres also make a big different here. 

Definately 29er.  You could get a nice hardtail, but I think you would appreciate the comfort of duel suspension.  Also depends on budget, a good spec hardtail would be better than a heavy entry level dual suspension for the same price. 

And as many have said it depends on what you will be riding most of the time. 

[Dicky DQ]

5 hours ago, Jase619 said:

Flat and non technical would be the most weekends kind of vibe, however, if you read further the goal would be to get a bike that if we were to take them away with us, say to a place that is not flat and technical, and we decided to do a race, be it Sani2C, or W2W or whatever the case may be, that we would be correctly kitted out for such an occasion. The decision to ride these races is basically made, just needing the bikes, hence making a decision with that in mind.

I am picking up on a few things here, but I am guessing that a hardtail would not be sufficient in such a case? 

Here is the rub, a hard tail will cover anything you would want to ride unless you are going to go bombing down Black Diamond trails. It will be a bit bore white knuckle that is all. That said, any dual susser will cover 150% of what 90% of so called had core MTB's call heavy trails. I have never had the fortune of being able to own a dual susser of any kind and I am never left on the gnarly trails. 

HOWEVER!!!! I have ridden an XC bike on gravel roads with corrugations and soft grass fields, THAT IS WHERE the suss comes into its own. So If you are going to be riding mostly gravel travel with a few normal single tracks an XC bike is more than you need.

Better question is, what is the budget and what is the bike with the best, lightest components you can get. AND one that feels comfortable the moment you get on it and turn the pedals. To me that is what you should use as the measure. Simple!
 

[Rolf Hansen]

2 hours ago, Trashy said:

Quite honestly, as long as you are buying a reputable brand, it's almost impossible to buy a bike that you will be unhappy with. Anything with 130mm travel or less will be amazing, hardtails included!

Mountain biking is fun, period. I'm not sure why people are so set on making it sound miserable to ride a bike that is not perfectly suited to the given terrain at any one moment.

Go ride a few bikes and let your body decide what feels right, then ride away into the sunset with a smile on your face.

Also, your wife may prefer a Scott, and you the Trek, matching bikes are not a necessity, as cool as it might be.

Absolutely. I ride a 26" Cannondale dual suspension that is an XC bike from days gone by but it is a bit of an inbetween XC/Trail bike when compared to other bikes of the time. 

It now has more aggressive tires fitted, short stem and wide bars so it is leaning even more towards a trail bike. I like gnarly trails with tough technical single-track and don't like flat gravel and Jeep tracks. Is this 14 year old xc/trail bike mishmash the perfect bike for the riding I do? Probably not even close but I bloody love riding this bike anywhere I like. 

[Mountain Bru]

2 hours ago, DieselnDust said:

drum roll......and the can opener award goes too................drum roll

Still waiting for an answer.... 

5 pages of discussion later, this might be the only question that matters.

Who cares how much travel you have and what your frame is made out of when you're passed out on the side of the road completely dehydrated from only being able to carry 1 bidon. Or when your back has cramped into oblivion from having to carry a camelback, or worse....... A fanny pack ????

 

[mrcg]

So, as with many other similar threads, my own opinion is, that the real question starts not with "which bike should I get" but with what type/kind of rider am I/is my wife?

If you are a skilled rider, or learn easily, up for a challenge, not scared of technical stuff, looking for speed, racing (amateur serious) at events, can blend into one with your bike, then the choice is clear: a HT or dualsus carbon frame, light and attacking setup.

If on the other hand, you're chilled, not very skilled, unsure on technical stuff, a little heavy on the brakes and nervous, not competitive, then you would rather drift over to a trail bike (entry level).

Whatever, whoever you are as a rider, determines your weapon. And as mentioned, it might be different for your wife and yourself. Women are generally more cautious, if not scared of technical. Just as most people "need" a dropper, as they want the security, comfort etc. Very capable riders will forsake the dropper for losing weight and because they manage without.

Once you have decided what type of rider you are, then you test ride a few different brands. There are slight but crucial differences between them which will make it feel just right to you. A lefty will appeal to some, but put off others.

Getting "your" bike is a personal journey. Nobody on the sacred hub will be able to answer that question for you. Sorry

Edited July 26, 2021 by mrcg
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[Mamil]

5 hours ago, Jase619 said:

Okay, in terms of taking into account what most of you are saying, would the Trek Top Fuel 7 be a better choice then? If not being specific to brand, but in general range of travel and budget considered? The Scott Spark also can be a contender.

Deciding factor really is stock, especially when looking for two bikes

Would be my next bike if I had the cash on hand. Came to mtb 5 years ago as a complete noob. Bought a cheap hard tail that I sold after realising it was trying to kill me. Bought a merida XC dual suss which I love. The top fuel is slacker and longer than my merida and of course newer drive train tech (I'm still 2x). I admire the trek whenever I'm in the lbs. 

Ive ridden 100 milers on the merida as well as trailseeker marathons and countless loops of the tyger berg mtb trails. 

If I were starting out in mtb now I would go for the trek.... But probably because its the featured brand at my mtb shop. 

I do think that as another poster said, any of the major brands will be a good bike. The standard seems to me to be very high, as it should be considering the investment.