Motorists vs Cyclists.... again

[Pandatron]

51 minutes ago, love2fly said:

Probably get lashed by the haters. What they don't get is that even if there is a club safety policy in place, when a marshall is standing in front of a judge after a death answering to what extent he/she was enforcing the policy on the day....

It was at about 08:20/08:30 on the descent from the highest point of the Cradle, riding roughly northbound. By the pace probably A or B bunch. 

I was out at that time, didnt see anything more than the usual

[lechatnoir]

15 hours ago, love2fly said:

Well done to Club Cyclelab bunch riding in the Cradle yesterday morning ...not just over the cycle lane but now even over the centre line....just so you can chat ...and when someone gets hit everyone Bayes for the car drivers blood.

My 2c is to take a photo and approach CL with the details and proof.

[love2fly]

1 hour ago, lechatnoir said:

My 2c is to take a photo and approach CL with the details and proof.

Yeah, not so easy this time due to speed differential but good idea. 👍

[i24]

On 9/9/2024 at 12:20 PM, Mook said:

For the next 2 kilo's I really feared for my life as I was on/off the pavements and threading between parked cars to evade their attempts to get me off my bike. The taxi would race ahead, stop while 2 specimens jump out and attempt to run me off my bike. Thank goodness some motorists witnessed this and came to my rescue by blocking the taxi-driver's plans to take to the sidewalk in his stupor. Thank heavens I was on a bike that could safely negotiate kerbs, driveways, etc.

If you find yourself in a situation like this, try doing a 180 turn and head back the way you came. Hopefully the aggressor will break off at this stage rather than doing a 180 to follow you in the wrong direction. If they don't you should still get a head start to get clear.

Better to avoid the situation in the 1st place.

 

[dave303e]

On 9/9/2024 at 12:45 PM, Jewbacca said:

I am definitely not actually suggesting you throw your bottle at anyone.

Ride/run/walk away... always.

 

win all fights by at least 20meters...

One thing this thread makes me think though- why bother with road running or riding, stick to gravel, mtb and trail...

[ChrisF]

8 hours ago, dave303e said:

win all fights by at least 20meters...

One thing this thread makes me think though- why bother with road running or riding, stick to gravel, mtb and trail...

 

And miss out on ....

 

. Bainskloof

. Franschhoek

. Helshoogte

. Chappies ... endless list of gems ...

 

 

Heck, even the bit of tar to get to the trails .....

[dave303e]

15 hours ago, ChrisF said:

 

And miss out on ....

 

. Bainskloof

. Franschhoek

. Helshoogte

. Chappies ... endless list of gems ...

 

 

Heck, even the bit of tar to get to the trails .....

there is an endless list of gravel and trail gems that are as good, if not better. Ben 10 challenge is a good list to start with.

Having driven chappies last year I honestly don't see the attraction, it is just an accident waiting to happen all the time in my personal opinion. Too many "I" specialists(all different road users: runners, cyclists, cars, tourists) using a narrow road with no room for error, half of them trying to find the ideal spot to get a pic for 'the gram' and not focusing on what they doing.

 

I also happen to live on a farm in the platteland so there is literally endless gravel griding from my doorstep with 0 tar, so I am blessed that way. 

[ChrisF]

1 hour ago, dave303e said:

snip ...

I also happen to live on a farm in the platteland so there is literally endless gravel griding from my doorstep with 0 tar, so I am blessed that way. 

 

That helps ! 👍  I enjoyed it when we had projects in the Northern Cape and I could cycle on the farms.

 

Chappies - outside of the CTCT I only do it on weekdays, when my afternoon meetings finish in Noordhoek.  My appetite for risk certainly dont extend to doing this during high traffic times .....

 

 

Doing gravel around the Northern suburbs means you are going to do a fair amount of tar as part of any route.

 

 

As much as I agree with your sentiment, many of us have to ride a fair bit of tar.  

[DJR]

20 hours ago, ChrisF said:

 

And miss out on ....

 

. Bainskloof

. Franschhoek

. Helshoogte

. Chappies

... endless list of gems ...

 

 

Heck, even the bit of tar to get to the trails .....

Just couldn't resist adding Clarens Drive and Cape Point

 

Edited September 18 by DJR

[Bl4d3]

On 9/16/2024 at 12:11 PM, love2fly said:

Yeah, not so easy this time due to speed differential but good idea. 👍

If you haven't already done so, I recommend reporting it to the team at Cycle Lab. They take these complaints very seriously and don't just shrug it off.

[ChrisF]

This driver reminded me just how exposed we are out on the road.  Lost track of how many times he/she drifted from the centre line onto the shoulder and back ....

 

 

EDIT - download the short video to see it.  (not sure why it is not showing on the thread)

 

Thankfully he/she managed to keep it in the lane while we passed cyclists.

 

 

At a guess - drifting while texting, then a short straight section, then another section of drifting, again and again.  I kept a 3 second distance, even the Fortuner behind me fell back.

Edited October 1 by ChrisF

[Zebra]

An unpopular viewpoint, from a patient driver, and lifelong/avid cyclist…

I just read this in a magazine article, lamenting the death of Jono (cyclist, Stellenbosch) though not directly related to his accident:

A Facebook user, who wished to remain anonymous, shared their thoughts on the platform. The user shared ‘in the light of seeing the recent news of another fatal cycling accident in CT, its been on my mind to make a post about the impatience of CT drivers, especially on the Atlantic Seaboard where so many sports people train, children and families enjoy the area with their pets. The speed on the roads & impatience at traffic lights in particular is getting ridiculous!’

For context, I drive - daily - the Llandudno to Camps Bay to Green Point to Paarden Eiland route, in a largish van…. The reason i mention the van is partly its size makes it wider & longer, but in addition, motorists BEHIND me cannot see whats ‘holding me up..’, and it is NEVER a line of single-file cyclists, but rather 2 riders, side-by-side, in the NARROWEST of roads, basically saying ‘f*ck the traffic’…sad to say…

Last week, after waiting a minute or 2 to pass cyclists i had to ‘toot’ a BRIEF ‘here I am’ toot, to side-by side riders, but they chose to continue - through CLIFTON, as well as big-bunch wheel overlappers, through Camps Bay…, these were not riders overtaking one another, but having a chat, side-by-side, and not acknowledging traffic - patient traffic-, and then blowing through the next 2 sets of traffic lights! 

The arrogance is astounding. Cyclists - SOME cyclists - are their own worst enemies.

(2 years back, I confronted the owner of a well-known bicycle shop, after him giving me the finger, after a POLITE toot to alert him to my presence, since he and his girlfriend were riding -slowly - 2 abreast through Clifton. I had waited a couple of minutes for them to return to single file, but they never did….)

I write this reluctantly, but some cyclists are giving others a bad name, and there are occasionally 2 sides to the motorist versus cyclist story.

Chris.

[cadenceblur]

43 minutes ago, Zebra said:

An unpopular viewpoint, from a patient driver, and lifelong/avid cyclist…

I just read this in a magazine article, lamenting the death of Jono (cyclist, Stellenbosch) though not directly related to his accident:

A Facebook user, who wished to remain anonymous, shared their thoughts on the platform. The user shared ‘in the light of seeing the recent news of another fatal cycling accident in CT, its been on my mind to make a post about the impatience of CT drivers, especially on the Atlantic Seaboard where so many sports people train, children and families enjoy the area with their pets. The speed on the roads & impatience at traffic lights in particular is getting ridiculous!’

For context, I drive - daily - the Llandudno to Camps Bay to Green Point to Paarden Eiland route, in a largish van…. The reason i mention the van is partly its size makes it wider & longer, but in addition, motorists BEHIND me cannot see whats ‘holding me up..’, and it is NEVER a line of single-file cyclists, but rather 2 riders, side-by-side, in the NARROWEST of roads, basically saying ‘f*ck the traffic’…sad to say…

Last week, after waiting a minute or 2 to pass cyclists i had to ‘toot’ a BRIEF ‘here I am’ toot, to side-by side riders, but they chose to continue - through CLIFTON, as well as big-bunch wheel overlappers, through Camps Bay…, these were not riders overtaking one another, but having a chat, side-by-side, and not acknowledging traffic - patient traffic-, and then blowing through the next 2 sets of traffic lights! 

The arrogance is astounding. Cyclists - SOME cyclists - are their own worst enemies.

(2 years back, I confronted the owner of a well-known bicycle shop, after him giving me the finger, after a POLITE toot to alert him to my presence, since he and his girlfriend were riding -slowly - 2 abreast through Clifton. I had waited a couple of minutes for them to return to single file, but they never did….)

I write this reluctantly, but some cyclists are giving others a bad name, and there are occasionally 2 sides to the motorist versus cyclist story.

Chris.

Spot on, even when out on rides, I’m often incensed by having to go to the middle of a lane to pass cyclists that are more interested in their chat than to keep left/ride single file. 
I commute almost daily by motorcycle and the lane  drifters in the shared are very common and sometimes admittedly I give them an earful with the throttle when I pass them 

[Jan D]

1 hour ago, Zebra said:

Last week, after waiting a minute or 2 to pass cyclists i had to ‘toot’ a BRIEF ‘here I am’ toot, to side-by side riders, but they chose to continue - through CLIFTON, as well as big-bunch wheel overlappers, through Camps Bay…, these were not riders overtaking one another, but having a chat, side-by-side, and not acknowledging traffic - patient traffic-, and then blowing through the next 2 sets of traffic lights! 

I understand the frustration with people not sticking to traffic rules when you are being patient with them, but I do want to respectfully give a little pushback here and say that if you are unable to overtake cyclists riding two abreast safely, there is no room for you to overtake a single file safely. I've been "punished" for keeping left many times on the Atlantic Seaboard by cars overtaking me way too narrowly. On two occasions I got sideswiped because cars overtook me in a blind bend, not realising there was oncoming traffic, and chose to swerve into me rather than brake. If I'd taken the lane, this would not have happened.

A safe overtake means that you are able to move into the other lane, and overtake as you would a car. Arguably, when applying that logic, it is easier and quicker to overtake cyclists riding two abreast, as the overtaking distance will be shorter. This does mean not overtaking over a solid white line, which motorists do to cyclists.

Of course, I understand this is not you, and you are going the extra mile ensuring you don't endanger anyone so this is in no way directed at you. It's more that the single-file rule imo is outdated and treats cyclists as a nuisance, rather than valid traffic participants.

Best case scenario is real cycling infrastructure, but we're a long ways from that.

Edited October 20 by Jan D
Spelling

[Mamil]

Maybe the cyclists are riding 2 abreast (as noted umpteen times in all sorts of fora this, although illegal in ZA is often a safer way to ride because it discourages the I'll just squeeze past mentality) BUT ....

The motorists are all transporting 2 sofas, a hi Fi, 80 liters of liquid storage, 350 liters of dry good storage, 4 light assemblies, how many square metres of carpeting?, 3 mirrors and a tonne and a half of plastic, glass and metal around a crowded urban landscape ....

Imagine cities designed around people instead of cars.

[Jan D]

3 minutes ago, Mamil said:

Imagine cities designed around people instead of cars.

The new local spatial development framework for the CBD is cause for careful optimism, with the city expressing the intention to create a car-free City Center. However, my optimism gets tempered whenever I see new roads being constructed with either no bike lanes, or bike lanes that are unusable because the crossings are horrendously designed, or the lane drops the road level every time there's a sidestreet or driveway, rather than have cars slow down and rise to the level of the lane