SA Gravel Champs 2023

[Jbr]

Funny to see there are two topics related to gravel, one complaining there's too much road, the other that the course is too technical 🤣

 

Seems the gravelers are a happy crowd

[J Wakefield]

1 hour ago, buckstopper said:

 Wasn't even near there. Just saw comments by a couple of racers who's views I rate is all.  I'm really trying to understand (the mindset of the organisers of) gravel racing in SA vs say, Europe. 

If my fitness is at the right level I'll give my age group a go. I wouldn't ride a national champs race for a participation medal. Racing can be fun though, even when it's super hard. I recently did a mtb race on a gravel bike and I've done a Swartberg 100 on a gravel bike. There's a risk element to this and having done a pelvis and a shoulder, maybe my appetite for a big off is not as big as those a bit less long in the tooth. 

 

 

 

Have you seen and been to a gravel race in Europe? If you upset over Karkloof then don’t come to some of the Euro gravel races. Even some of the local races in and around Girona are nmore technical. 
 

Barring some, South African’s are all “harder longer tougher or we want more” until there is a rock garden or in this case a segment that basically everyone rode. Then there tears. 

Rule is do your homework before going to a race, especially a gravel race or event, know what to run, what you should expect etc and not take info after a race from a few road riders who battle over a cattle grid at hour 2. 
 

Im not having a go at you; it’s just the view and mentality of SA and racing mostly. Race what is in front of you, if you don’t like it, don’t race 

[DieselnDust]

55 minutes ago, J Wakefield said:

Have you seen and been to a gravel race in Europe? If you upset over Karkloof then don’t come to some of the Euro gravel races. Even some of the local races in and around Girona are nmore technical. 
 

Barring some, South African’s are all “harder longer tougher or we want more” until there is a rock garden or in this case a segment that basically everyone rode. Then there tears. 

Rule is do your homework before going to a race, especially a gravel race or event, know what to run, what you should expect etc and not take info after a race from a few road riders who battle over a cattle grid at hour 2. 
 

Im not having a go at you; it’s just the view and mentality of SA and racing mostly. Race what is in front of you, if you don’t like it, don’t race 

its like the participants of that other big challenge event that takes place over 8 days.

Everybody want it to be harder so they can brag to their mates about how much harder its was than last year but when we get to day 4 or 5 then the pitch forks are out baying for cut off to be extended 🤣

[buckstopper]

👍

[Shwetty]

As a silly thought experiment, I'd like to know how many entrants would choose to do that race again if they could go back in time and were, for example, offered their entry fee back if they chose to withdraw. No bike/gear changes allowed - you either race it again with the same setup, or pull out and get your money back...

What I'm getting at is; if the sport as a whole is to grow and be successful, we need people to *want* to race their bikes. For the pros, maybe this *want* fire isn't fueled by having a somewhat positive experience on race day. For the rest of us plebs, though, enjoyment (with maybe a smattering of masochistic suffering) is an important aspect to be considered by the powers that be. What I gathered from over-hearing many people during the race and afterwards around the country club, was that most of them thought that it was actually kind of a *** experience. Yes, they raced hard. Yes, they finished, and maybe got some sense of accomplishment from overcoming the day's challenges. But was it worth travelling from all over SA for this event? My guess is, probably not. And that's a pity. Especially given the fact that despite the almost infinite number of amazing gravel routes in the Karkloof/upper midlands, the race got taken on some of the worst roads in the region. 

And regarding that whole "know what to run" story, the route was released only a couple of days before the event. Not allowing much time at all to chop/change/test/buy the perfect setup. And besides, the marginal difference that a 45 mm tyre at 1,7 bar makes over a 40 mm at 2 bar (or whatever), is kinda detached from the big-picture point being made here. 

But then again, maybe all you hardcore okes are right, and I'm too much of a sissy for this gravel scene that is reserved exclusively for the real toughies among us. If you're not willing to risk life and limb, 'tsek. Right? 

[babse]

And they said the gravel scene is for chilled out lifestyle okes... 

 

😆

[Spinnekop]

12 hours ago, Shwetty said:

As a silly thought experiment, I'd like to know how many entrants would choose to do that race again if they could go back in time and were, for example, offered their entry fee back if they chose to withdraw. No bike/gear changes allowed - you either race it again with the same setup, or pull out and get your money back...

What I'm getting at is; if the sport as a whole is to grow and be successful, we need people to *want* to race their bikes. For the pros, maybe this *want* fire isn't fueled by having a somewhat positive experience on race day. For the rest of us plebs, though, enjoyment (with maybe a smattering of masochistic suffering) is an important aspect to be considered by the powers that be. What I gathered from over-hearing many people during the race and afterwards around the country club, was that most of them thought that it was actually kind of a *** experience. Yes, they raced hard. Yes, they finished, and maybe got some sense of accomplishment from overcoming the day's challenges. But was it worth travelling from all over SA for this event? My guess is, probably not. And that's a pity. Especially given the fact that despite the almost infinite number of amazing gravel routes in the Karkloof/upper midlands, the race got taken on some of the worst roads in the region. 

And regarding that whole "know what to run" story, the route was released only a couple of days before the event. Not allowing much time at all to chop/change/test/buy the perfect setup. And besides, the marginal difference that a 45 mm tyre at 1,7 bar makes over a 40 mm at 2 bar (or whatever), is kinda detached from the big-picture point being made here. 

But then again, maybe all you hardcore okes are right, and I'm too much of a sissy for this gravel scene that is reserved exclusively for the real toughies among us. If you're not willing to risk life and limb, 'tsek. Right? 

Maybe look at it this way:
SA's should be for racers.  Professionals.  They don't (almost never) WANT to race or need to have a WANT.  They just race. For the jersey.
You don't make rugby easier because the Springboks are loosing all the time..........

Any other race organiser I would imagine would/should make it easier on the participants if they want to attract the masses.  Participation is key and non technical smooth roads would accomplish more participants.
SA champs should NEVER be this race.

[Jbr]

21 minutes ago, Spinnekop said:

Maybe look at it this way:
SA's should be for racers.  Professionals.  They don't (almost never) WANT to race or need to have a WANT.  They just race. For the jersey.
You don't make rugby easier because the Springboks are loosing all the time..........

Any other race organiser I would imagine would/should make it easier on the participants if they want to attract the masses.  Participation is key and non technical smooth roads would accomplish more participants.
SA champs should NEVER be this race.

yes, but also just like XCM, some races are faster, some races are more technical, that's the beauty of it. Same on the road, some are flat, some are hilly. You've got to do your homework and either race what's in front of you or stay home if you find the course won't suit you, and stop ranting on the internet every time a course doesn't match your standards

(obviously when I say you I don't mean you @Spinnekop

[J Wakefield]

12 hours ago, Shwetty said:

As a silly thought experiment, I'd like to know how many entrants would choose to do that race again if they could go back in time and were, for example, offered their entry fee back if they chose to withdraw. No bike/gear changes allowed - you either race it again with the same setup, or pull out and get your money back...

What I'm getting at is; if the sport as a whole is to grow and be successful, we need people to *want* to race their bikes. For the pros, maybe this *want* fire isn't fueled by having a somewhat positive experience on race day. For the rest of us plebs, though, enjoyment (with maybe a smattering of masochistic suffering) is an important aspect to be considered by the powers that be. What I gathered from over-hearing many people during the race and afterwards around the country club, was that most of them thought that it was actually kind of a *** experience. Yes, they raced hard. Yes, they finished, and maybe got some sense of accomplishment from overcoming the day's challenges. But was it worth travelling from all over SA for this event? My guess is, probably not. And that's a pity. Especially given the fact that despite the almost infinite number of amazing gravel routes in the Karkloof/upper midlands, the race got taken on some of the worst roads in the region. 

And regarding that whole "know what to run" story, the route was released only a couple of days before the event. Not allowing much time at all to chop/change/test/buy the perfect setup. And besides, the marginal difference that a 45 mm tyre at 1,7 bar makes over a 40 mm at 2 bar (or whatever), is kinda detached from the big-picture point being made here. 

But then again, maybe all you hardcore okes are right, and I'm too much of a sissy for this gravel scene that is reserved exclusively for the real toughies among us. If you're not willing to risk life and limb, 'tsek. Right? 

It’s Karkloof you can do 90% of the homework before any route is out so yes you can be well prepared as the guys hunting the SA titles were. 

it’s SA champs lay off the drama in the post 

 

[J Wakefield]

14 hours ago, DieselnDust said:

its like the participants of that other big challenge event that takes place over 8 days.

Everybody want it to be harder so they can brag to their mates about how much harder its was than last year but when we get to day 4 or 5 then the pitch forks are out baying for cut off to be extended 🤣

US lawyers phoning organisers the one year comes to mind so their clients can start the next day 

[tubed]

14 hours ago, DieselnDust said:

its like the participants of that other big challenge event that takes place over 8 days.

Everybody want it to be harder so they can brag to their mates about how much harder its was than last year but when we get to day 4 or 5 then the pitch forks are out baying for cut off to be extended 🤣

this is so true

[buckstopper]

7 minutes ago, J Wakefield said:

It’s Karkloof you can do 90% of the homework before any route is out so yes you can be well prepared as the guys hunting the SA titles were. 

it’s SA champs lay off the drama in the post 

 

John I will always question decisions I find questionable. I'm not changing that because you know it all. I'm looking for an intelligent answer to my questions and I'm not going to go away because you and your chommas think we can't ask questions. Obviously no intelligence here.Beam me up Scotty

[DieselnDust]

35 minutes ago, J Wakefield said:

US lawyers phoning organisers the one year comes to mind so their clients can start the next day 

This year too apparently.

[J Wakefield]

22 minutes ago, buckstopper said:

John I will always question decisions I find questionable. I'm not changing that because you know it all. I'm looking for an intelligent answer to my questions and I'm not going to go away because you and your chommas think we can't ask questions. Obviously no intelligence here.Beam me up Scotty

Let’s not make up things please. 

[Danger Dassie]

23 minutes ago, buckstopper said:

John I will always question decisions I find questionable. I'm not changing that because you know it all. I'm looking for an intelligent answer to my questions and I'm not going to go away because you and your chommas think we can't ask questions. Obviously no intelligence here.Beam me up Scotty

Fair enough, but then form an intelligent question. It seems you ignored the objective points made and then only took on some of the negative remarks. 
By and large, the course was accepted as such to a standard worthy of national level, as indicated by the winner. 

[Comrade J]

1 hour ago, Spinnekop said:

Maybe look at it this way:
SA's should be for racers.  Professionals.  They don't (almost never) WANT to race or need to have a WANT.  They just race. For the jersey.
You don't make rugby easier because the Springboks are loosing all the time..........

Any other race organiser I would imagine would/should make it easier on the participants if they want to attract the masses.  Participation is key and non technical smooth roads would accomplish more participants.
SA champs should NEVER be this race.

I agree with Spinnekop, SA's are SA's, It should be harder than normal races, (just look at the Elite Men's race at Worlds as to what the attrition rate is, if you want the stripes you need to earn them (even Tadji said it was the hardest race he has ever ridden...)

My plan was hopefully to be in the top 10 this year, (grand Masters) training was not sufficient ( Work is still a priority) and I was undercooked for the weekend, so I just stayed at home (I still had FOMO), we try again next year.