Future of SA road cycling

[ChrisF]

41 minutes ago, Skubarra said:

...... - but its obvious there are more efficient ways for the school to use their time & resources to raise funds. I don't see how new road funrides will be added to the WC calender given current conditions 

 

The WC schools cycling WA group has been BUSY the last few weeks !!!

 

SCSA (schools division of CSA) "contributed" to FOUR events for the year .....

 

Why is the WA group so busy ?  More and more schools are arranging cycling events, and inviting other schools to join.  This weekend there is an event at Jan van Riebeeck Highschool, as well as another event at the Montagu high school.  But wait, there's more ... Montagu even has a third "open class" where the parents also get to ride.

 

Over the last 2 to 3 years there has been a significant uptick in the number of school cycling events, at least in the Western Cape.

 

 

In terms of THIS THREAD though .... ALL of these school events are MTB events.

[Schnavel]

I used to do a lot of road racing pre-covid, but subsequently, have only done a handful (2x 94.7 races included).

Since Covid, a lot of people have had to cut back financially, and the first thing to go is recreational costs such as races. The same people are still riding their bikes on the weekend, but not going to races as the cost is just excessive. By the time you add up the entry costs, the fuel to drive to number collection, and to the race, it's much easier and a lot cheaper to go for a ride with your mates on the weekend and go for coffee afterwards. The other factor for me is the racing on platforms such as Zwift - I can have a hard race session in the comfort of my own home, without having to spend any of the excessive fees listed above.

I still enjoy a good road race, and I'm happy to keep paying the higher fees for races such as CTCT and 94.7 as they offer full road closure. However, I am now much more selective in my choice. To pay an almost similar fee to race on open roads, in such poor conditions, with angry drivers racing past, just isn't appealing anymore. I believe that is why more and more people are moving away from road cycling and more into gravel and mountain biking - they are deemed to be considerably safer (whether they are or not is a different question for a different day)

In addition to this, a lot of the "younger" generation (think late 20's, early 30's), have emigrated - this would be the group with more disposable income available and it is now gone.

As many have already mentioned, I'm not certain that road racing, in it's current format (as it has been for the past 3 decades), is sustainable. A lap type race / crit would definitely be more sustainable in that the organisation costs are a lot lower and any sponsor would get more "bang for their buck" as it where. The roads are often away from traffic (crit racing) and would make for a better option. 

In our current economic situation that we find ourselves post-covid, and with the state of the roads (and I dare say, the country), road events in the current form simply aren't sustainable. But, I would definitely be happy to be wrong...

[Frosty]

54 minutes ago, Shebeen said:

Have hugely reduced entry fees for people riding on a bike worth less than…

Any official development club registered with CyclingSA qualify for 50% discount at our event. We have helped about 30-40 riders every year for a number of years now. 

[Dazshell]

41 minutes ago, Schnavel said:

I used to do a lot of road racing pre-covid, but subsequently, have only done a handful (2x 94.7 races included).

Since Covid, a lot of people have had to cut back financially, and the first thing to go is recreational costs such as races. The same people are still riding their bikes on the weekend, but not going to races as the cost is just excessive. By the time you add up the entry costs, the fuel to drive to number collection, and to the race, it's much easier and a lot cheaper to go for a ride with your mates on the weekend and go for coffee afterwards. The other factor for me is the racing on platforms such as Zwift - I can have a hard race session in the comfort of my own home, without having to spend any of the excessive fees listed above.

I still enjoy a good road race, and I'm happy to keep paying the higher fees for races such as CTCT and 94.7 as they offer full road closure. However, I am now much more selective in my choice. To pay an almost similar fee to race on open roads, in such poor conditions, with angry drivers racing past, just isn't appealing anymore. I believe that is why more and more people are moving away from road cycling and more into gravel and mountain biking - they are deemed to be considerably safer (whether they are or not is a different question for a different day)

In addition to this, a lot of the "younger" generation (think late 20's, early 30's), have emigrated - this would be the group with more disposable income available and it is now gone.

As many have already mentioned, I'm not certain that road racing, in it's current format (as it has been for the past 3 decades), is sustainable. A lap type race / crit would definitely be more sustainable in that the organisation costs are a lot lower and any sponsor would get more "bang for their buck" as it where. The roads are often away from traffic (crit racing) and would make for a better option. 

In our current economic situation that we find ourselves post-covid, and with the state of the roads (and I dare say, the country), road events in the current form simply aren't sustainable. But, I would definitely be happy to be wrong...

As a trustee of the Club Cappuccino Foundation that owns the Tour Durban, we made the decision to change the route for this year's TD to do 2 and a half laps of the M4 from Durban to Umdloti and back to cut costs (a lot) and make the race safer by not including roads that were in a shocking state or risk protest action from those not wanting the city's roads closed.  The race was still 110kms long with nearly 1000m of climbing so it retained its "classic" and CTCT seeding status. 

Initially there was a huge outcry, but on race-day, we received only praise from the overwhelming majority of entrants.  Starting and finishing in the same place, lots of vantage points for spectators who got to see the riders come past 3 times in each direction and the chance to see many of those doing the shorter distances on the same route.  Definitely a win-win for the organisers, the charity beneficiaries, the participants and the spectators.  I have no doubt that many races will go this route in the future.

[Paul Ruinaard]

Hmm - like everything it works in cycles. Who remembers lockdown when there was an explosion of cycling. Everything has to work according to the demand and the market. Having personally semigrated the cycling scene in W Cape is very healthy especially gravel and MTB in winelands area.

But the cradle is always busy in Jhb. However why do you want to race when a.) the price of races is ridiculous b.) they dont include road closure and c.) the cost of bikes has become stupid. d.) Training is impossible - dangerous and on the fine line of ludicrous to ride around on a bike in JHB traffic post load shedding. 

The only way road racing in JHB will survive is larger rides in remote areas with full road closure, or closed events on loops.  As a guy who loves road riding and has raced plenty i would not be seen on a road race any time soon. I also only ride on a wide shoulder with tons of lights on or on a gravel bike with tons of lights on - so i can get off the road.

Whatever happened to getting back on to Kyalami and the like - thats still the best training venue Jhb had. 

[Zebra]

5 hours ago, bleedToWin said:

How many entries could you generate for a well organised event with a great route like Tour de Worcester if you spent the R60k on social media placements? I'd be surprised if you don't easily hit the required 150, but not my field...

If my Math is correct, that is R400 per rider (spend on 1 channel - effective channel, admittedly) spent on marketing before ANY other costs, and costs need to be recouped.

R60k Seems like quite a bit of money for 150 riders, no?

Cheers

Chris

[Frosty]

30 minutes ago, Zebra said:

If my Math is correct, that is R400 per rider (spend on 1 channel - effective channel, admittedly) spent on marketing before ANY other costs, and costs need to be recouped.

R60k Seems like quite a bit of money for 150 riders, no?

Cheers

Chris

R400 entry fee * 150 entries to cover the marketing costs of R60k. Your math is 👍 

The marketing spend would be to get >1000 entries in, optimistically 2000 entries.

Our 2022 event had resulted 500 entries. Disappointed is saying it nicely. The problem is not knowing how many entries you’re going to get when launching entries, when certain costs have to be paid out. Then, when numbers aren’t where one hopes they would be, do you advertise more, or leave as is.

Some other costs can be adjusted as the number of entries become clearer.

Some costs are fixed and some variable, so cutting here and there   is required.

Edited August 22, 2023 by Frosty

[Frosty]

double post

Edited August 22, 2023 by Frosty

[babse]

8 hours ago, Skubarra said:

Helping out on an established event hosted by a school - as mentioned earlier the costs and the hoops one have to jump through to meet SASREA requirements are insane. Then add negotiating the Education laws (good luck trying to add a beer tent to the event 🤣) that sometimes contradict the SASREA requirements 🤦‍♂️

The event is still profitable - mostly because of dedicated parents giving their time for free and sponsors loyal to the school - but its obvious there are more efficient ways for the school to use their time & resources to raise funds. I don't see how new road funrides will be added to the WC calender given current conditions 

What numbers were you planning for?Plan event for 1900 max attendees and you good without SASREA, anything more and those safety measures are for your own good. 

People can be idiots and when you have multiple thousands together, those "drastic" SASREA requirements are a must. Having just been through the process of getting a number of CoCT facilities compliant, you soon realise it's basic OHS that should be in place to host events of such magnitude (in this case, interschool and provincial athletic meetings). 

[Furbz]

Yes roads are worse. 
but CSA is just as pathetic a organisation as the ruling party and a large reason why cycling in South Africa is in the state it is in today.

they once fined my father R1500 for riding in an tiny unsanctioned charity event trying to raise funds for a cancer patient.

They add costs to events and add little to no extra value at all. 
 

 

[NotSoBigBen]

On 8/19/2023 at 3:11 PM, W@nted said:

Gravel racing is the future. (At least outside of WC province). Public roads are getting worse by the day. 

In our 'hood, Alberhoughton, one needs a bloody gravel bike to ride ON the roads lately😞

[Danger Dassie]

On 8/22/2023 at 9:58 AM, Frosty said:

Central Gauteng have a WhatsApp group for clubs, with 56 participants on the group. Some are from the same club, so the number of clubs represented is diluted. When clubs are asked to attend a session to discuss this very matter, the attendance is poor. Why?

Do clubs actually care about matters like this, or do the representatives actually represent their club?

Then there are cyclists that don’t want to belong to a club, even though CyclingSA are now forcing the matter with membership and licensing. Who hears their voice? Does their voice even matter?

In the last (CGC club) meeting, a lot was said but very little was achieved on the way forward. No disrespect to those that attended, as they were there to hear, or be heard. As a club that has organised road and MTB events, as well as cyclists ourselves, we can offer more than one perspective, but it’s not the only perspective.

CGC need to clean up the social channels and website so that people can see there’s something happening in public.

Currently for MTB there is a closed telegram group for members to see updates on events. 
 

[ChrisF]

On 8/22/2023 at 8:34 AM, madmarc said:

Nowadays they still trying to fill entries up to the day before the race....

 

Just had a look at the entry portal for a gravel event this weekend ... their adds were boldly stating "entries close 14 August" .... entries still open on 23 August ....

 

 

Blame the weather, the economy, the font used on the add .... entries simply are way down !!  Even for gravel events.

 

 

 

It must be a nightmare for @Frosty to roll the dice trying to put an event together.

[pedal menace]

Quick question on old thread. Trying to enter 94.7 Ride Joburg. 

Do I need to have annual CSA license? Or can a day license be purchased? I used to have an annual CSA license but that has expired. I checked now on CSA website and it is R325 annually for normal license and you MUST belong to a club (which I do not - why should I be forced?) Do I really need an CSA license for the few events I may do a year (mostly ofroad MTB events). I also noticed that on Ride Joburg FAQ it states:
The entry fee of R675.00 includes VAT and a CSA rider levy.
What is rider levy?

Edited September 6, 2023 by pedal menace

[Danger Dassie]

CSA Rider levy is day licence. 

[pedal menace]

Coo

3 minutes ago, Danger Dassie said:

CSA Rider levy is day licence. 

Cool stuff. Then not going to renew my CSA Annual license as I think that is a waste of money. Thank you!