Around the pot: participants of the cancelled 2023 only get 20% discount for 2024

[Skubarra]

9 minutes ago, olmec said:

That the organisers had an accurate forecast of the inbound weather, ahead of the weekend, but decided to delay their decisioning such that they would incur additional costs—not a decision participants got to contribute to either.

Respect your decision to boycott the event but this is harsh. A forecast is just that, a prediction, the organisers & you will only know the actual weather on the day of the event. And even then you don't know exactly how it will unfold on the day. What would happen if the organiser cancel few days before the event and weather turns out fine? Also costs are not incurred just on the day of the event, whether the organiser cancels a week before or on the day will make very little difference re costs.

As @Danger Dassie pointed out the reality is that we as participants take on some of the risk that events can get cancelled, that is true for all events not just RTP. Only way to completely avoid it is to stop entering events.

[WaldoZ]

13 minutes ago, olmec said:

 

As for folks who raise "being entitled" (and the various versions of this): please do remember that I forked out the full set of costs ahead of the 2023 event, including accommodation and travel. That the organisers had an accurate forecast of the inbound weather, ahead of the weekend, but decided to delay their decisioning such that they would incur additional costs—not a decision participants got to contribute to either.

 

Same as me... I don't feel they owe me a cent. They did everything they could to even host it the next day to accommodate already incurred event costs, sponsors and their participants. 

Honestly I was watching the weather all week and it was a very tough call to make and there was no wrong choice there. If they cancelled early I would have lost my accomodation deposit anyway and just think if it turned out to be a beautiful day how many keyboard warriors would be on here.

How much discount are you expecting here? If it is the same as entering early then you now at least have the option to look at the weather closer to the time and still pay the "early bird" prise. 

Again, any discount given is more than they have to I feel.

[Jbr]

11 minutes ago, WaldoZ said:

Same as me... I don't feel they owe me a cent. They did everything they could to even host it the next day to accommodate already incurred event costs, sponsors and their participants. 

Honestly I was watching the weather all week and it was a very tough call to make and there was no wrong choice there. If they cancelled early I would have lost my accomodation deposit anyway and just think if it turned out to be a beautiful day how many keyboard warriors would be on here.

How much discount are you expecting here? If it is the same as entering early then you now at least have the option to look at the weather closer to the time and still pay the "early bird" prise. 

Again, any discount given is more than they have to I feel.

Agree, sometimes when weather is really *** I actually hope for cancellation rather than "having to" race in the mud and mess my whole bike 😅

[Bub Marley]

40 minutes ago, olmec said:

Thanks for all the input okes.

I agree that this means voting with my feet.  I had really hoped I wouldn't have had to—that folks would have stuck to their word and done a little more than the bare minimum.  The way I saw it is that they had the opportunity to get a fan for life, but instead they decided with their pockets!

As it stands, its not about the absolute value or cost of anything, but rather the entrants-as-an-exploitable-resource that I have a gripe with. This kind of decision making, and exploitation, seems to follow this particular organiser around too.

As for folks who raise "being entitled" (and the various versions of this): please do remember that I forked out the full set of costs ahead of the 2023 event, including accommodation and travel. That the organisers had an accurate forecast of the inbound weather, ahead of the weekend, but decided to delay their decisioning such that they would incur additional costs—not a decision participants got to contribute to either.

Reading the terms in more detail, they're offering 20% of the 2023 fee… no doubt this means 2024 fees have gone up, so the real discount will be even less.  At this point, probably just signing up for the early-bird discount will be more valuable than this rubbish.

Its such a shame that the real value of these events has been lost on the folk who milk the fun out it.

Thanks for the heads up on RvR.  Race to the Sun is another well organised and fun event.

 

Just like you had to fork out the full costs, so did the organisers. There’s nothing we can do about the weather unfortunately. They actually do not need to refund you anything so honestly I would take the small discount. Until we get to add some insurance for event cancellations, there is nothing we can do about it unfortunately. 

[LazyTrailRider]

OP, you’re wrong.

The end.

[Bub Marley]

1 hour ago, Kom said:

Entries arent even open yet (2-Feb), are you sure you've seen the actual result of the offer? 20% is nothing to scoff at. https://www.aroundthepot.co.za/enter

In terms of precedent - i entered for the Ronde van Riebeck 50 miler last year which was quite delayed from starting. Not only did Adriaan pay for everyones cappuccinos that morning, but made good on 100% discount for this years entry (and i actually stayed to start late and finish that event too). 

I feel very bad for organisers - they have sunk costs, whether the event runs or not. Most of my experience of the events that are cancelled very rarely offer any refund or discounts for future dates, its really the risk we take when we enter.

Also worth mentioning that RvR is an excellent event - its a cheaper 100miler gravel event to do, you dont need to sleep over or travel far to get gravel kicks. RTP is a great event, but feels its got a tad pricey FWIW.

I attended the RvR race as well and also suffered that same delay.

 

I think the big difference with that event is that was negligence on the organisers part wrt not having enough ambulances. So they needed to do more than just a discount and fair play to them they have done that.

[olmec]

2 minutes ago, Bub Marley said:

Just like you had to fork out the full costs, so did the organisers

Except thats not true: this is run as a profit making exercise, with better margins than 20%.

Why do they get to make a profit off a cancelled event?

[Bub Marley]

1 minute ago, olmec said:

Except thats not true: this is run as a profit making exercise, with better margins than 20%.

Why do they get to make a profit off a cancelled event?

Please provide evidence that their profit is more than 20% or is just an assumption?

 

[olmec]

Fair point.

Based on the assumption from having once been on the organising committee of another event.  In that event, sponsors covered organisational costs, entry fees were profit.

[SSCC]

3 hours ago, olmec said:

Fair point.

Based on the assumption from having once been on the organising committee of another event.  In that event, sponsors covered organisational costs, entry fees were profit.

Were you on an MTB race committee? There were a few MTB events that had big title sponsors that could pocket entry fees but not many. Is there a single gravel event that has a major title sponsor that covers all costs? Doubt it. It’s not the glory days of MTB stage racing. 

[The itch]

3 hours ago, olmec said:

Except thats not true: this is run as a profit making exercise, with better margins than 20%.

Why do they get to make a profit off a cancelled event?

couldn't agree with you more - organisers aren't a volunteer organisation raising funds for a charity etc. they organise for their pocket. i'll bet my bottom dollar most of their vendors or support structures are locals from the area. 

[Jewbacca]

Pretty sure the organisers hated cancelling, knowing it would cause them to have to make some tough calls and be unpopular with some of the choices they were forced to make, regardless of what they decided.

I'm also pretty sure their bottom lines and business forecasts dictate what sort of discount they can give without going bust and keeping the event and business afloat and profitable.

'using the entrants to line their pockets' and 'exploited' are quite wild.... We can remember that if the business runs at a loss or even breaks even, they will likely stop putting on events, so there is that.

This is so weirdly coming across as though the organisers cancelled last year and cackled at the fire clapping their hands with glee! The you picture them bent over laughing 'and now we only give them a 20% discount! hahahahaha! Look at how many of them will pay... AGAIN!' as though they enjoyed having their event rained out while their local infrastructure and road systems washed away.

I assure you, this isn't personal. This is 'staying afloat' if we want to keep the flood metaphor going

[MORNE]

57 minutes ago, Jewbacca said:

Pretty sure the organisers hated cancelling, knowing it would cause them to have to make some tough calls and be unpopular with some of the choices they were forced to make, regardless of what they decided.

I'm also pretty sure their bottom lines and business forecasts dictate what sort of discount they can give without going bust and keeping the event and business afloat and profitable.

'using the entrants to line their pockets' and 'exploited' are quite wild.... We can remember that if the business runs at a loss or even breaks even, they will likely stop putting on events, so there is that.

This is so weirdly coming across as though the organisers cancelled last year and cackled at the fire clapping their hands with glee! The you picture them bent over laughing 'and now we only give them a 20% discount! hahahahaha! Look at how many of them will pay... AGAIN!' as though they enjoyed having their event rained out while their local infrastructure and road systems washed away.

I assure you, this isn't personal. This is 'staying afloat' if we want to keep the flood metaphor going

No skin in THIS game…and don't care.

I’m just here to tell you that you will ride the 2024 Munga whether it gets cancelled or not. WILL.

😋

Edited January 30 by MORNE

[Rowl]

Forgive me for saying this, but I thought this was discussed ad nauseam with the actual cancellation.

Trust me when I say they were ready to stage the event and did what they could to have it go on. Yes the weather wasn't actually so bad on the Sunday morning, but given the warning and floods across the province, this was the right choice. The roosterkoek was made and ready to be served at the waterpoint (and was ultimately donated), the medics were on stand-by, etc. It's like saying that you want the roosterkoek to be unmade or the medics to give back the money.

I assume the organisers take their cut, but do you not want to pay them for all the prep and time spent on actually getting ready for staging the event and/or ensure that a next event is staged. What is a sufficient discount for predicting the weather 6 months ahead of time, wrong, and having the provincial disaster management call the race off?

An entry costs just about R1k, the Prince George double that, go figure. I understand you incurred a lot of cost, at what point should they have cancelled / how much discount do you want?

[Shebeen]

7 hours ago, olmec said:

Thanks for all the input okes.

As for folks who raise "being entitled" (and the various versions of this): please do remember that I forked out the full set of costs ahead of the 2023 event, including accommodation and travel. That the organisers had an accurate forecast of the inbound weather, ahead of the weekend, but decided to delay their decisioning such that they would incur additional costs—not a decision participants got to contribute to either.

 

I get the feeling you would have moaned if they put the race on. You have clearly forgotten what actually happened in the run up to it being postponed for 24 hours and then cancelled out right. It makes you now look both ENTITLED and WRONG. This is a lekker event, in a lekker part of the country run by lekker people. It's a free country, so ENTITLED people can enter, but the less that do, the better it is for the rest of us. So this whole thread is win win in my books.

 

Did you actually travel to swellendam? by plane, or by car? I rode my bike twice that weekend, got more than 200km in. The postponement was unfortunately out of their hands.

Anyway, you would have got this email below. I replied that we had actually used the tents so no refund required. They actually gave us who were still there watching the rugby on the saturday night free burgers.

Quote

Dear ATP entrant,

 

You booked tented accommodation with us.

 

We pitched all the tents in anticipation of the event.

We will however be able to give you a 70% refund on your tent booking. 

 

Please send your banking details and allow us a week or two to process all the refunds.

 

Thanks for understanding.

 

Kind regards

 

 

 

 

 

[WaldoZ]

This thread does have a silver lining though. I now know I can get 20% off 🤣👌