Tour de Pologne

[Jewbacca]

Look, I get the rules etc, but can you defend this? 

 

If someone is forced off the road by a car, all hell breaks loose and the baying for heads is called by all in sundry. Suddenly another cyclist forces someone off the road and it's a grey area.

 

Nah.... This is unforgivable.

[Eldron]

Look, I get the rules etc, but can you defend this?

 

If someone is forced off the road by a car, all hell breaks loose and the baying for heads is called by all in sundry. Suddenly another cyclist forces someone off the road and it's a grey area.

 

Nah.... This is unforgivable.

I haven't seen anyone defending it...

[Gen]

Look, I get the rules etc, but can you defend this?

 

If someone is forced off the road by a car, all hell breaks loose and the baying for heads is called by all in sundry. Suddenly another cyclist forces someone off the road and it's a grey area.

 

Nah.... This is unforgivable.

No-one is defending it.. HIS actions lead to the devastating consequences.. doesn't mean there shouldn't be a call for safety measures put into place to minimise these devastating consequences.

[Eldron]

No-one is defending it.. HIS actions lead to the devastating consequences.. doesn't mean there shouldn't be a call for safety measures put into place to minimise these devastating consequences.

Exactly this - UCI condemning in the strongest possible terms but the name Groenewagen could have been swapped for Jakobsen if he had moved another 10cm right and Sarreau hadn't been so alert.

 

That said - do we really want sterile sprints where they draw lines on the road and there is safe distance between each rider?

 

I'm pretty pleased I'm not the one charged with sorting this out!

[Shebeen]

I haven't seen anyone defending it...

I'll play Devil's advocate.

 

We're looking at a catastrophic crash, and then what caused it.

There is probably milliseconds and millimeters between this just being a shoulder to shoulder bump and we all move on and no one says anything, but Greenwagon is topstep with hotchicks and flowers.

 

This is what they do. They all get away with it 99% of the time, it's part of the battle. none of them want to crash, and none of them want to force a crash - but they do defend their position and space.

 

I don't think this is a massive sudden deviation of line.

I wouldn't be surprised if a bunch of sprinters come out to defend DG if he gets a crazy ban from this.

 

and for some perspective, how about a Tashkent terror highlights reel?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Nt4x3nuzfQ

[Robrider]

Sounds like quite a few are saying that the barriers are not up to UCI standard.

 

This shows a direct comparison with the Cav/Sagan crash:

 

 

https://twitter.com/alexfalkeman/status/1291128716727324672

Edited August 6, 2020 by Robrider

[Vetplant]

Sounds like quite a few are saying that the barriers are not up to UCI standard.

 

This shows a direct comparison with the Cav/Sagan crash:

 

 

https://twitter.com/alexfalkeman/status/1291128716727324672

Thanks, that was exactly how I remembered it. Cavendish was able to slide along the barriers instead of piling into them.

[Eldron]

I'll play Devil's advocate.

 

We're looking at a catastrophic crash, and then what caused it.

There is probably milliseconds and millimeters between this just being a shoulder to shoulder bump and we all move on and no one says anything, but Greenwagon is topstep with hotchicks and flowers.

 

This is what they do. They all get away with it 99% of the time, it's part of the battle. none of them want to crash, and none of them want to force a crash - but they do defend their position and space.

 

I don't think this is a massive sudden deviation of line.

I wouldn't be surprised if a bunch of sprinters come out to defend DG if he gets a crazy ban from this.

 

and for some perspective, how about a Tashkent terror highlights reel?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Nt4x3nuzfQ

All we have is opinions of course but I don't think he will be defended by anyone.

 

1) It is not politically friendly at the moment to defend violence of ANY kind.

2) Squeezing someone out in a sprint is a legit but quasi legal tactic....when they're behind you. When they're along side you it's too late and you are a proper tool for putting them in a barrier.

 

We'll never know intent of course. Only Groenewagen knows if he saw Jakobsen and continued to squeeze him. Given Groenewagens past conduct I'd guess he didn't crash him on purpose. Plus he did also crash himself.

[JA-Q001]

Exactly this - UCI condemning in the strongest possible terms but the name Groenewagen could have been swapped for Jakobsen if he had moved another 10cm right and Sarreau hadn't been so alert.

 

That said - do we really want sterile sprints where they draw lines on the road and there is safe distance between each rider?

 

I'm pretty pleased I'm not the one charged with sorting this out!

 

It depends on whos name you put where. When Sagans name was where Groenewagens was and Cavs name was where Jakobsen, Cav was made to be a dumb ass.

[Gen]

It depends on whos name you put where. When Sagans name was where Groenewagens was and Cavs name was where Jakobsen, Cav was made to be a dumb ass.

[Eldron]

Sounds like quite a few are saying that the barriers are not up to UCI standard.

 

This shows a direct comparison with the Cav/Sagan crash:

 

https://twitter.com/alexfalkeman/status/1291128716727324672

 

https://twitter.com/alexfalkeman/status/1291128716727324672

Great post!

[The Ghost]

Exactly this - UCI condemning in the strongest possible terms but the name Groenewagen could have been swapped for Jakobsen if he had moved another 10cm right and Sarreau hadn't been so alert.

 

That said - do we really want sterile sprints where they draw lines on the road and there is safe distance between each rider?

 

I'm pretty pleased I'm not the one charged with sorting this out!

I’m used to seeing the odd bump and nudge etc and I understand that deviations happen whether it’s accidental or edging out a competitor, but when it happens in the middle of the road I’m a little more comfortable with it because other riders have potentially more room to move.

When it comes to a shoulder into a barrier I think it’s completely unacceptable and obvious that the other rider has nowhere to go.

[Eldron]

Poor Sarreau - nearly taken out by Jakobsen then taken out by Groenewagen taking out Jakobsen: https://www.cyclingnews.com/news/sarreau-out-of-tour-de-pologne-following-finish-line-crash/

 

Sprinting is not for the faint of heart!

[Shebeen]

I’m used to seeing the odd bump and nudge etc and I understand that deviations happen whether it’s accidental or edging out a competitor, but when it happens in the middle of the road I’m a little more comfortable with it because other riders have potentially more room to move.

When it comes to a shoulder into a barrier I think it’s completely unacceptable and obvious that the other rider has nowhere to go.

 

I dunno how much of this is intentional.

i'm not sure if the riders do either, we're watching slowmos and they are going on instinct tired and pumping with adrenalin. Jakobsen could always have passed on the left too, but i guess he could see the gap on the right before it closed.

 

Sometimes contact bewteen 2 riders helps them both stay upright

[Ispeed_V]

Update from QS.

 

He had facial surgery during the night. He is still stable and later in the day, doctors will look to bring him out of the induced coma.

[DieselnDust]

I finally found and overhead video:https://m.facebook.com/watch/?v=1517589085069285&_rdr

 

Interesting that Jakobsen did exactly the same thing to an FdJ rider around 100m before Groenie did it to him.

 

Should Jakobsen also be sanctioned?

 

Yes of course that was a rhetorical question and Groenie deviated more but it highlights the question of what exactly "deviation" is. Is it the actual deviation or the consequence of the deviation?

 

 

The difference is that Jakobsen drifts right feels the rider to his right and then straightens and moves slightly left giving the rider space. Groenie slammed Jakobsen straight into the barrier with no quarter given.

In many  of these cases the severity of the sanction is determined by the outcome.

in this case it is very very bad