Idiots at the CTCT

[ChrisF]

I would say that falls under my "You can criticize some of the methodology" disclaimer... There is definitely room for improvement.

 

But what I like about the system is that I can fairly easily figure out how well I need to do in certain races to qualify for the group I would like to ride in. Once you know your seeding index the rest is not a mystery. Can't say that for any other seeding system in the country.

 

so how about adding one extra filter to the existing system .....

 

for the first batch you need to have 10 road rides in the last ten months - frankly for the top riders this will be easy.

 

for the second batch you need 8 road rides in the last ten years, etc ...

 

 

Thus the "one ride wonder" dont end up in the front .... many have pointed to "dangerous riding" by some riders.  One can only hope that adding a ride count to the seeding would add some level of experience per group ....

 

 

 

PS - my approach would aim to improve safety in the faster bunches.

[The Ouzo]

With regards the seeding. My cycling mate and I have for years started together and finished together. Yet they would always seed him a group or 2 ahead of me, the only thing I could possibly think of is the 1 year age difference between us.

 

 

Other points.

The dropping the worst races from your seeding is to not let one or 2 unfortunate events affect your seeding. Things like mechanicals, crashes or simply riding one race with a slower buddy/ family member.

 

I don’t think you’ll ever get a perfect seeding system to make everyone happy

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Skubarra]

so how about adding one extra filter to the existing system .....

 

for the first batch you need to have 10 road rides in the last ten months - frankly for the top riders this will be easy.

 

for the second batch you need 8 road rides in the last ten years, etc ...

 

 

Thus the "one ride wonder" dont end up in the front .... many have pointed to "dangerous riding" by some riders.  One can only hope that adding a ride count to the seeding would add some level of experience per group ....

 

 

 

PS - my approach would aim to improve safety in the faster bunches.

 

I'm also not a fan of the "1 good result get you in A bunch" idea,  I thought the weighted average approach they used a few years ago where you needed 3 good results for a seeding worked well. They dropped that approach when the number of road races dwindled.

 

10 or 8 races is probably a bit too much

[Jase619]

so how about adding one extra filter to the existing system .....

 

for the first batch you need to have 10 road rides in the last ten months - frankly for the top riders this will be easy.

 

for the second batch you need 8 road rides in the last ten years, etc ...

 

 

Thus the "one ride wonder" dont end up in the front .... many have pointed to "dangerous riding" by some riders.  One can only hope that adding a ride count to the seeding would add some level of experience per group ....

 

 

 

PS - my approach would aim to improve safety in the faster bunches.

 

That's a bit rough, not only would it be not economically viable, but really time consuming as well. If you aren't around an area that has a lot of road races in that 10 month period, ie. Gauteng or Cape Town, you will find yourself hard pressed to achieve that.

[FootballingCyclist]

So this is something I saw happening at the 99er and then also at the Tour De PPA.

 

I have seen a rider riding with more than just 1 Racetec chip. So at the 99er I saw a guy riding with a chip on his fork then could clearly see the other chip on a strap around his ankle under his sock. I saw him in the bunch and said to myself there is no way I'll forget his number, and then, like a dream, I got to the finish and had forgotten it just like when u wake up.

 

This is unfortunately more common than I realised as I went to the race info desk and informed them and said they must please check the results where 2 "different riders" have the exact same splits over the mats. They said they will look into it.

 

It's this kind of thing that causes the issues on "big" race days with big bunches because if some oke, for whatever reason hasn't raced all year or trained and his mate has, and now all of a sudden wants a lekker seeding for the CTCT then he just gives his mate his chip and his mate hides it and BOOM, seeding sorted, yes he will be dropped, But still shouldn't be starting there in the 1st place!!

 

Unfortunately other than checking the splits over the matts (Which can't be that hard to do as I'm sure it's almost impossible for 2 riders to have the exact same time over the start and finish mats, but could take some time to do), there is nothing that can be done prior to the race to stop this kind of thing, or is there?

 

Just wish more people could be honest with themselves and everyone else, theoretcially that's easy, Unfortunately we do not live in a theoretical world though.

[SoloCyclist]

So this is something I saw happening at the 99er and then also at the Tour De PPA.

 

I have seen a rider riding with more than just 1 Racetec chip. So at the 99er I saw a guy riding with a chip on his fork then could clearly see the other chip on a strap around his ankle under his sock. I saw him in the bunch and said to myself there is no way I'll forget his number, and then, like a dream, I got to the finish and had forgotten it just like when u wake up.

 

This is unfortunately more common than I realised as I went to the race info desk and informed them and said they must please check the results where 2 "different riders" have the exact same splits over the mats. They said they will look into it.

 

It's this kind of thing that causes the issues on "big" race days with big bunches because if some oke, for whatever reason hasn't raced all year or trained and his mate has, and now all of a sudden wants a lekker seeding for the CTCT then he just gives his mate his chip and his mate hides it and BOOM, seeding sorted, yes he will be dropped, But still shouldn't be starting there in the 1st place!!

 

Unfortunately other than checking the splits over the matts (Which can't be that hard to do as I'm sure it's almost impossible for 2 riders to have the exact same time over the start and finish mats, but could take some time to do), there is nothing that can be done prior to the race to stop this kind of thing, or is there?

 

Just wish more people could be honest with themselves and everyone else, theoretcially that's easy, Unfortunately we do not live in a theoretical world though.

I rode the ctct with my wife and we stuck together the entire way crossed all the mats together so we have the exact same times

 

We each have our own chips with your plan we would be flagged as cheaters

 

Sent from my SM-A605F using Tapatalk

[Shebeen]

No true,.....but how is it possible to seed a rider off one event better than a rider who has ridden 10x as many over the same  period and use only the best result?

In the end the result was a 19min deficit of the rider seeded off the one event to the rider who has a years history.

the system may not be perfect but surely the people managing it shouldn't be stupid...

They used to combine multiple events for your seeding.

They changed it to just your best result, and I'm sure it was justified.

the penalty for historical events is now 6 months too.

 

the seeding process is a work in progress, with about 30 years of thought gone into it.

if there was a better way to do it, I'm sure they could do it.

[Shebeen]

I rode the ctct with my wife and we stuck together the entire way crossed all the mats together so we have the exact same times

 

We each have our own chips with your plan we would be flagged as cheaters

 

Sent from my SM-A605F using Tapatalk

I think he meant exactly the same time.

Can also be confirmed by race photos which are up on actionphotos for years.

 

 

the best way to do this would be regressively

you look at the guys in a high group who get dropped

then you look at the race that got them the high seeding.

 

 

 

but hey, they won't even punish people who get reported for littering so I doubt they really care if people are gaming the seeding. What's happened in marathons in the states worldwide is that with the access to data and timesplits concerned citizens are busting people and reporting it to the authorities

https://www.marathoninvestigation.com/

 

[Chris_]

So this is something I saw happening at the 99er and then also at the Tour De PPA.

 

I have seen a rider riding with more than just 1 Racetec chip. So at the 99er I saw a guy riding with a chip on his fork then could clearly see the other chip on a strap around his ankle under his sock. I saw him in the bunch and said to myself there is no way I'll forget his number, and then, like a dream, I got to the finish and had forgotten it just like when u wake up.

 

This is unfortunately more common than I realised as I went to the race info desk and informed them and said they must please check the results where 2 "different riders" have the exact same splits over the mats. They said they will look into it.

 

It's this kind of thing that causes the issues on "big" race days with big bunches because if some oke, for whatever reason hasn't raced all year or trained and his mate has, and now all of a sudden wants a lekker seeding for the CTCT then he just gives his mate his chip and his mate hides it and BOOM, seeding sorted, yes he will be dropped, But still shouldn't be starting there in the 1st place!!

 

Unfortunately other than checking the splits over the matts (Which can't be that hard to do as I'm sure it's almost impossible for 2 riders to have the exact same time over the start and finish mats, but could take some time to do), there is nothing that can be done prior to the race to stop this kind of thing, or is there?

 

Just wish more people could be honest with themselves and everyone else, theoretcially that's easy, Unfortunately we do not live in a theoretical world though.

 

Each year at Comrades its the same. I often see a pic of someone who looks very very nonathletic .... whos qualified in the B group or so.  

[Shebeen]

there are some real chops out there...

 

like duplicating race numbers

 

 

 

check how the second one doesn't have the pre punched holes for the safety pin

 

https://www.marathoninvestigation.com/2019/02/more-evidence-uncovered-on-serial-bib-forger-and-her-accomplice.html

[DieselnDust]

there are some real chops out there...

 

like duplicating race numbers

 

 

 

check how the second one doesn't have the pre punched holes for the safety pin

 

https://www.marathoninvestigation.com/2019/02/more-evidence-uncovered-on-serial-bib-forger-and-her-accomplice.html

 

 

 

Whats up with Superman and the bent wrist?

[FootballingCyclist]

I rode the ctct with my wife and we stuck together the entire way crossed all the mats together so we have the exact same times

We each have our own chips with your plan we would be flagged as cheaters

Sent from my SM-A605F using Tapatalk

Did you cross every matt from start to finish with the exact same time/split??

[DieselnDust]

I rode the ctct with my wife and we stuck together the entire way crossed all the mats together so we have the exact same times

 

We each have our own chips with your plan we would be flagged as cheaters

 

Sent from my SM-A605F using Tapatalk

 

 

I highly doubt that.....

[SoloCyclist]

Seeding etc and all these things are new to us so forgive me if I'm wrong but here are the times off the racetec app

 

 

Sent from my SM-A605F using Tapatalk

[FootballingCyclist]

Seeding etc and all these things are new to us so forgive me if I'm wrong but here are the times off the racetec app

Sent from my SM-A605F using Tapatalk

No probs, But if you check the splits they aren't all exactly the same so you would be fine.. The problem is that alot of the seeding races don't have mats on the route to check the splits.. But I'm pretty sure you got my point now.

[SoloCyclist]

No probs, But if you check the splits they aren't all exactly the same so you would be fine.. The problem is that alot of the seeding races don't have mats on the route to check the splits.. But I'm pretty sure you got my point now.

Why would people trick the system

 

You just cheating yourself

 

Sent from my SM-A605F using Tapatalk