Are Hardtails dead?

[Me rida my bicycle]

Only did one section of Armageddon. Would love to go back and try the rest. Stuck in Gauteng though. Could be the 100mm fork that was pumped 10psi too hard? When I was in CT earlier this year I couldn’t get enough of Jonkers. Went there 3 days in a row. Awesome awesome place.

yes fork and tyre pressure is so important to be on point. My tyres need to be soft for max grip and extra suspension but just hard enough not to smash the rim. So my 2.35's I run at 20/18psi. Fork about the same psi as I weigh.

[daveno7]

DO IT!!!

the bank account says no at the moment.....sadly

[Rigardt@Scott]

OK maybe some thing wrong with me as I find Armageddon fun and easy on my HT, love Zululand and Firehut they are all fun and fast but the last 2 parts of never ending sucks on a HT to me.

Can't say I find it hard, just not fun. But I think it's because I am comparing it to the dual suspension bike which I can ride quite a bit faster down there. Strava actually says the hardtail is about 50% slower. But that comes down to riding style. You get so used to being able to just steamroll everything on a 160mm enduro bike, that when you get on the hardtail you have to adjust the riding style a bit.

 

Anyway, I'm derailing this thread now.

 

Trail hardtails are awesome. And when you are on the right trail, so much more fun than a dual suspension bike.

[TeamBaja]

Hi, Actually since we are a specialized dealer among other we have only big brands. Once or so per month we get to build some ridiculous bike mtb bike for a guy, build several with the whole axs group but still mainstream bikes. Costing 12k or more, we do some obscene tri and road bikes north of 20k. 

The exotic bike market is somewhat of a niche market here, they are all usually in the same shop. 

 

Do you guys sell any exotic, or less commonly seen brands, or any recent beauties that you have built?

[TeamBaja]

Most are factory spec, the reason is because mtb is secondary in our shop. The employees are all mtb guys, haha. But we sell a lot of stans, fox forks. The whole hardtail breakdown is like this, cheap 2k < or for newbies or first upgrade, then 4k> for racers. The full (trail) goes to the rest guys that want to learn or have fun on a bike.

 

Most riding trails are "safe" because all are on government land, so you know what that means. Every trail has to be approved and ilegal trails are destroyed you can be charged with a crime for building them. Mountain bikers aren't loved at all in some areas, San Diego is ok I guess. Most race course are fairly easy even for a noob, as far as the technical part is concerned. Climbing and speed is what gets you.

 

Some go to race down in Baja, Mex because of the trails are more technical. The enduro is building up here but we don't see a demand at least not here.

Stay safe

Are you selling more trail or XC hardtails, what sort of spec (decent forks and wheels) are the most sold bikes coming with, and out of interest what are your local trails like?

 

I imagine in the USA you have a better range of decent hardtails vs us in SA where most bikes are duallies, and very XC and marathon focused .... though saying that, trail and enduro has certainly taken traction over here the last year or two, but still nothing compared to our XC and marathon bikes.

[Jewbacca]

Can't agree with you on the HTA, especially on a HT. Mine is 65 unloaded. Sit on the bike and it loses a degree or two because its a HT. A decent hardcore HT should have a 63 degree HTA. As for the steering on a climb, what about  "balance and upskill" for that too? 

Aren't HA measured in sag?

 

So your 65' bwcomes 66.3 with 25% sag............... 

[Iron]

I have had my fair share of bikes, when it comes to XCO or any stage race up to 3 days  i have always done them on a hard tail, i find them far more responsive and they climb like mountain goats .

oh and they are easy to service .

 

i suppose its simply a personal thing  

 

my current ht

[Super Sywurm]

Admin can close and delete this thread.  Hardtails will never be dead.  End of discussion. 

 

Well, maybe they will be dead if there is flying bicycles, but they will still be hardtails.

[Red Bird]

I just loved how Anne Terpstra and Barbara Benko were going to race Tankwa on their hardtails to prove a point. Even the Epic has been done on hardtails. With enough conditioning, it can be done. It’s just perception and marketing (maybe one influences the other).

[Danger Dassie]

I have had my fair share of bikes, when it comes to XCO or any stage race up to 3 days  i have always done them on a hard tail, i find them far more responsive and they climb like mountain goats .

oh and they are easy to service .

 

i suppose its simply a personal thing  

 

my current ht

That's a sweet machine! Merida really is an under rated and under represented product.

[vanniri]

So here is a question. What is considered to be a good head angle (okay I know a bike is the sum of it’s parts but it’s a good start) for a HT.

 

There are a lot of longer / slacker HTs about but if you look at the Momsen steel it’s ‘longer slacker’ is about 69 degrees, the big wig is 68 and quite a few new frames sit in that 67 / 69 range.

 

I think that a 66 / 67 is a good start for a trail bike an 67 is almost a magic point for ‘fun’ bikes. You have to work hard as a frame designer to be good around 64 degrees.

 

My numbers are 66.5 H/a and 73 S/a (numbers are unloaded). 120mm fork, with 1 spacer added to the factory installed 2, i.e. 3. The additional spacer let me ride higher in the travel on rough sections when you need a slacker geometry, as such I would even consider adding a 4th whilst decreasing the air with circa 5-7psi. 

 

A lesser than 66 H/a could potentially compromise reach length. I suppose it depends on the designer's skill to enable bringing the seat over the BB. 

[T_Boss]

Wow.... never expected this thread to become such a big one.... after starting the thread a few months ago, circumstances have seen me ending up with only one bike, and it’s a dual susser. But this thread gives me loads of hard tail envy. As soon as finances allow, and stock actually reached out shores.... I’m defiantly getting another bike, and it will be a hardtail.

[BuffsVintageBikes]

I just loved how Anne Terpstra and Barbara Benko were going to race Tankwa on their hardtails to prove a point. Even the Epic has been done on hardtails. With enough conditioning, it can be done. It’s just perception and marketing (maybe one influences the other).

 

Lots of things can be done on a variety of bikes but just because you can do it doesn't mean its the best tool for the job. Multi day events wear you down 1 day at a time, the fresher you can keep yourself, the better you will be on day 7. At the sharp end of the field, those margains are so slender that a slightly less fatigued body can be the difference between a podium and a 4th place.

Hardtails remain awesome... just chose your terrain.

[Hairy]

[soslow]

my trusty giant fathom.

[DR ◣◢]

I really miss my Jamis Komodo. Perfect little all day on the trails and rip down the other side kinda bike.

 

Built up 1x9 with a dropper post. So much fun.