Cape Town danger areas

[Headshot]

17 hours ago, Simply Cotic said:

IMO moving violations need to be top of the agenda.

Give metro cops a monthly target / incentive to stop motorists who blatantly break the rules. Get stopped going through a red robot / crossing a solid line / dangerous overtake; and the motorist gets a huge spot fine. As in payable on the spot. If he/she can’t; vehicle gets impounded. 
(In Western Europe a while back, traffic cops got 10% of the fine, if you were caught drunk driving. Not sure if still in effect) 

But we need change, as the same playbook isn’t getting results. 

I regularly see ghost squad cars pulling people off in rush hour traffic on the N1/M5  - the yellow lane drivers trying to pass everyone being a number one offender. That said, these are easy targets and it does little to enhance safety - just appeases the ire of law abiding drivers. 

Certain taxi and sightseer routes clearly need an almost constant police presence and cameras to monitor at all times. Maybe the City will take better action when the bad press starts making it overseas and affects tourism? On second thoughts probably not...

[Solly Moeng]

Thank you; for the sake and safety of cyclists, a national social contract must be agreed to. Cycling bodies have the reach to organise this and to call those in power - starting with the minister of sports - into a room.

[Mamil]

22 minutes ago, Solly Moeng said:

Thank you; for the sake and safety of cyclists, a national social contract must be agreed to. Cycling bodies have the reach to organise this and to call those in power - starting with the minister of sports - into a room.

Ja. When you get and renew your license you should be made to swear an oath. Might be fun to write the text for that promise.

Its a great piece that you wrote @Solly Moeng

[SoloCyclist]

19 hours ago, Headshot said:

I regularly see ghost squad cars pulling people off in rush hour traffic on the N1/M5  - the yellow lane drivers trying to pass everyone being a number one offender. That said, these are easy targets and it does little to enhance safety - just appeases the ire of law abiding drivers. 

Certain taxi and sightseer routes clearly need an almost constant police presence and cameras to monitor at all times. Maybe the City will take better action when the bad press starts making it overseas and affects tourism? On second thoughts probably not...

If the city figures out a way to slap us with another levy then it will happen overnight

[Mook]

23 minutes ago, Solly Moeng said:

Thank you; for the sake and safety of cyclists, a national social contract must be agreed to. Cycling bodies have the reach to organise this and to call those in power - starting with the minister of sports - into a room.

Thx @Solly Moeng for articulating the SA road user conundrum. Please ignore my cynicism, but your suggestion will lead to yet another task team or commission of inquiry - with zero impact or results. 

We have more than enough traffic laws, bylaws, regulations, etc. We also have a criminal/legal system hamstrung by inept administrators. The laws and legal frameworks are in place, BUT it appears toothless to the core if not enforced or managed properly.

In recent years, quite a number of cyclists were killed or permanently maimed by drunken/reckless drivers. I am yet to see any decisive sanction to be handed down in a court of law.  Surely our problems are 1) Law enforcement(visibility), and 2) Proper consequence management(Legal).

My 2 cents' worth

[cadenceblur]

100% correct sadly

law enforcement focusses on the soft targets

and there will be yet another memorial ride planned . 
 

[splat]

45 minutes ago, cadenceblur said:

100% correct sadly

law enforcement focusses on the soft targets

and there will be yet another memorial ride planned . 
 

And another ghost bike...

[tubed]

I find the whole thing quite depressing - its just effed up.

I've tried to be an active citizen, make practical suggestions, don't just complain, don't just let things slide. 

I f*cking pleaded with the City for months to take action, took the photos, sent them the practical and financially viable immediate suggested solutions. Warned them that someone might die. Their responses fall into, 'don't care, not my job, wrong department, not my ward, cover my arse, professionally incompetent, negligent' or all of the aforementioned.

As of this morning, the taxis are back at it doing the same, the City mowed some inconsequential  bush and afterwards put back the flowers placed for Landon, they appear clueless.

Add to this, the fact that I can't effectively ride my bike out of Cape Town to get beyond the City anymore without a better than even chance of being attacked is just effed up. 

Our City is failing us. 

[Paul Ruinaard]

So some things that I saw straight after this happened still blows my mind. On the way in to Paarl at 6 pm down the R 301 in peak traffic on Tuesday evening a kid and his mate are riding inside the narrowing yellow lines on MTB. He is riding hands free sitting up and texting as he pedals alongside the traffic. After all this debate and discussion on how to fix things you need to start with that. I would suggest that if he had to avoid a motorist in an emergency he would be toast and then its all the motorists fault.

Sorry I think that the cyclists are a lot to blame. Riding in wide bunches across the yellow line as there is safety in numbers. There is even more safety in always staying in single file and giving space in the yellow line emergency lane for its actual use  - emergencies.

Large bumches on narrow roads that are heavily trafficked are just stupid. Like we hear - cars, bikes, motorbiles, busess, delivery vehicles, taxis and dog walkers, pedestrians and all other manner of obstacles are in the same space. Why not just avoid it all together. 

Eventually in Jhb i just put my bike on the rack and drove to the venue be it the cradle or N Farm etc. 

I have grown tired of all the people who insist on enforcing their rights to be in dangerous sitautaions. You also have the right to be in war zones and enforce your human rights there, but you will likely be at a very much large risk of becoming another idealist who is now a statistic.

Darwin's laws of natural selection are as immutable as gravity. If you are stupid you will be more likely to remove your genes from the pool thereby improving the chances of the clever folks to succeed and breed.

Everyone suffres from survivor bias.

 

 

[Headshot]

5 minutes ago, Paul Ruinaard said:

So some things that I saw straight after this happened still blows my mind. On the way in to Paarl at 6 pm down the R 301 in peak traffic on Tuesday evening a kid and his mate are riding inside the narrowing yellow lines on MTB. He is riding hands free sitting up and texting as he pedals alongside the traffic. After all this debate and discussion on how to fix things you need to start with that. I would suggest that if he had to avoid a motorist in an emergency he would be toast and then its all the motorists fault.

Sorry I think that the cyclists are a lot to blame. Riding in wide bunches across the yellow line as there is safety in numbers. There is even more safety in always staying in single file and giving space in the yellow line emergency lane for its actual use  - emergencies.

Large bumches on narrow roads that are heavily trafficked are just stupid. Like we hear - cars, bikes, motorbiles, busess, delivery vehicles, taxis and dog walkers, pedestrians and all other manner of obstacles are in the same space. Why not just avoid it all together. 

Eventually in Jhb i just put my bike on the rack and drove to the venue be it the cradle or N Farm etc. 

I have grown tired of all the people who insist on enforcing their rights to be in dangerous sitautaions. You also have the right to be in war zones and enforce your human rights there, but you will likely be at a very much large risk of becoming another idealist who is now a statistic.

Darwin's laws of natural selection are as immutable as gravity. If you are stupid you will be more likely to remove your genes from the pool thereby improving the chances of the clever folks to succeed and breed.

Everyone suffres from survivor bias.

 

 

Except that no road is actually safe because of the shockingly bad motorist behaviour. We are back at Tubed's point...can you actually ride out of or around the city safely? You've got a good chance of being mugged or hit  by a car no matter where you ride in CT. Might as well pack up your bike and stick to the mtb.

In 99% of cases it's not the rider at fault but the motorist. 

[Paul Ruinaard]

10 minutes ago, Headshot said:

Except that no road is actually safe because of the shockingly bad motorist behaviour. We are back at Tubed's point...can you actually ride out of or around the city safely? You've got a good chance of being mugged or hit  by a car no matter where you ride in CT. Might as well pack up your bike and stick to the mtb.

In 99% of cases it's not the rider at fault but the motorist. 

I would disagree vehemently with your last statement.

Cyclists are very large contributors to the issue.

Further, unfortunately you cannot behave like you live in a utopian world, when you clearly dont, and if you do you will impact your and others safety. 

I agree that the roads in the city arent safe so do you then inisst on further using them or agree to make a different plan. I have been riding MTBs and gravel on moat road routes for that exact reason.

I am still out there cycling and enjoying myself and the ride is as much fun. in fact sometimes more.

[Headshot]

1 minute ago, Paul Ruinaard said:

I would disagree vehemently with your last statement.

Cyclists are very large contributors to the issue.

Further, unfortunately you cannot behave like you live in a utopian world, when you clearly dont, and if you do you will impact your and others safety. 

I agree that the roads in the city arent safe so do you then inisst on further using them or agree to make a different plan. I have been riding MTBs and gravel on moat road routes for that exact reason.

I am still out there cycling and enjoying myself and the ride is as much fun. in fact sometimes more.

You can disagree all you like but in 99% of cases the motorist will be found to be at fault and liable to conviction for culpable homicide or reckless and negligent driving. Be it cutting off Burry Stander or driving into the oncoming lane or generally without any regard for cyclists/other road users and side swiping or passing too close... the list goes on. 

The fact that you see cyclists riding two abreast or in bunches for 'safety" may contribute to already bad motorist behaviour but doesn't somehow excuse the reckless and negligent driving perpetrated by them. 

[The Ouzo]

24 minutes ago, Paul Ruinaard said:

I would disagree vehemently with your last statement.

Cyclists are very large contributors to the issue.

Further, unfortunately you cannot behave like you live in a utopian world, when you clearly dont, and if you do you will impact your and others safety. 

I agree that the roads in the city arent safe so do you then inisst on further using them or agree to make a different plan. I have been riding MTBs and gravel on moat road routes for that exact reason.

I am still out there cycling and enjoying myself and the ride is as much fun. in fact sometimes more.

you are victim blaming

 

 

[Paul Ruinaard]

18 minutes ago, The Ouzo said:

you are victim blaming

 

 

Okay that quite a big statement you are making there without any substantiation.

Which victims am I blaming and in which context do you make your allegations? I didnt blame any victims, rather I have asserted that cyclists can do a lot to clean up their shop and ensure they limit their exposure to harm which would mitigate risks.

Are you alledging all cyclists and accidents related to them are victims? 

Always remember that those that ignore the past and history are destined to repeat it.

[Mamil]

45 minutes ago, Paul Ruinaard said:

I would disagree vehemently with your last statement.

Cyclists are very large contributors to the issue.

Further, unfortunately you cannot behave like you live in a utopian world, when you clearly dont, and if you do you will impact your and others safety. 

I agree that the roads in the city arent safe so do you then inisst on further using them or agree to make a different plan. I have been riding MTBs and gravel on moat road routes for that exact reason.

I am still out there cycling and enjoying myself and the ride is as much fun. in fact sometimes more.

An absurd position to adopt - at the risk of reductio ad absurdum in my own argument, "It is dangerous to walk to the corner cafe, don't do it", "Public space offers little to no options for disabled people, they should not go out in public spaces". 

 

[El Duderino]

4 minutes ago, Paul Ruinaard said:

Okay that quite a big statement you are making there without any substantiation.

Which victims am I blaming and in which context do you make your allegations? I didnt blame any victims, rather I have asserted that cyclists can do a lot to clean up their shop and ensure they limit their exposure to harm which would mitigate risks.

Are you alledging all cyclists and accidents related to them are victims? 

Always remember that those that ignore the past and history are destined to repeat it.

You sound like someone who would comment on a rape victim's attire.