Will you repair this?

[Mopkop]

repairing that would be your insurer willing placing your life at risk. Let me guess.....Cyclesure?

Santam via PSG

 

moral of the story, if your frame cracks, make sure to snap it in 2 before phoning the insurance.

This has crossed my mind now.

 

Its been radio silence since Friday, Ill be giving them a call tomorrow morning 

[splat]

#norrafok

 

 

 

It wasn't necessary for the thread to go further than this post

[Capricorn]

what is the insurance covering: a cosmetic repair or a structural repair? Similarly, what is the repair shop vouching for?  The damages incurred are in places considered vital to structural integrity.  The repairs must be done accordingly, and at least adhere to a verifiable standard to achieve that objective.

Edited November 26, 2019 by Capricorn

[Carbon Ninja]

The thing is, and I say this most respectfully, is that what I've read here amounts mostly to unqualified and inexpert opinion.

I submit, again respectfully, that in order to make a determination on the suitability of a frame for structural repair you should be adequately qualified in the field of composite repairs.

As laymen we deal unquestioningly with doctors diagnosing and treating our health, because they're specialists.

If a qualified composite repair specialist says something can be repaired safely, then surely they deserve that same courtesy?

 

Obviously I say all of this without considering the context of what-you-pay-for versus what-you-get in terms of insurance. That's a completely different topic. I, as a carbon repair specialist am approached by insurance to provide quotations on repair costs and this I do honestly and fairly. My company has however been victimised by irate insured cyclists a few times, as they pursue their goal of having their bike replaced instead of repaired. I can tell you, it's not fun...

[Prince Albert Cycles]

The thing is, and I say this most respectfully, is that what I've read here amounts mostly to unqualified and inexpert opinion.

I submit, again respectfully, that in order to make a determination on the suitability of a frame for structural repair you should be adequately qualified in the field of composite repairs.

As laymen we deal unquestioningly with doctors diagnosing and treating our health, because they're specialists.

If a qualified composite repair specialist says something can be repaired safely, then surely they deserve that same courtesy?

Obviously I say all of this without considering the context of what-you-pay-for versus what-you-get in terms of insurance. That's a completely different topic. I, as a carbon repair specialist am approached by insurance to provide quotations on repair costs and this I do honestly and fairly. My company has however been victimised by irate insured cyclists a few times, as they pursue their goal of having their bike replaced instead of repaired. I can tell you, it's not fun...

Don't you have the possibility of a conflict of interests when giving an opinion and quote on a repair ?

Remember , the test is not whether you have a conflict or not , but if there is a possibility of a conflict .

Edited November 27, 2019 by Prince Albert Cycles

[Carbon Ninja]

Don't you have the possibility of a conflict of interests when giving an opinion and quote on a repair ?

 

Remember , the test is not whether you have a conflict or not , but if there is a possibility of a conflict .

I'll be honest, I don't fully understand your question. The way I see it is that Carbon Craft is a service provider and my job is to repair carbon fibre. It doesn't matter who the client is, provided that I treat every job in the same manner.

That insurance utilises my services too is incidental. (Out of interest I looked at my books now, insurance makes up less than 2% of my turnover). If I have not answered your question adequately please clarify for me? Thank you!

[Mudsimus]

I'll be honest, I don't fully understand your question. The way I see it is that Carbon Craft is a service provider and my job is to repair carbon fibre. It doesn't matter who the client is, provided that I treat every job in the same manner.

That insurance utilises my services too is incidental. (Out of interest I looked at my books now, insurance makes up less than 2% of my turnover). If I have not answered your question adequately please clarify for me? Thank you!

Simple question, in this specific case will the insured rider be in the same position as before his crash? Will the frame weigh the same, look the same etc etc?

[Pure Savage]

I fought my insurer on this as I was not happy as once frame repaired the original warranty would fall away leaving me in a worse position if another part of bike was to fall. 

 

Snot and drivel by insurance, 3 weeks later, full payment and they waived the excess.

[Pure Savage]

The thing is, and I say this most respectfully, is that what I've read here amounts mostly to unqualified and inexpert opinion.

I submit, again respectfully, that in order to make a determination on the suitability of a frame for structural repair you should be adequately qualified in the field of composite repairs.

As laymen we deal unquestioningly with doctors diagnosing and treating our health, because they're specialists.

If a qualified composite repair specialist says something can be repaired safely, then surely they deserve that same courtesy?

 

Obviously I say all of this without considering the context of what-you-pay-for versus what-you-get in terms of insurance. That's a completely different topic. I, as a carbon repair specialist am approached by insurance to provide quotations on repair costs and this I do honestly and fairly. My company has however been victimised by irate insured cyclists a few times, as they pursue their goal of having their bike replaced instead of repaired. I can tell you, it's not fun...

 

The thing is, and I say this most respectfully, is that what I've read here amounts mostly to unqualified and inexpert opinion.

I submit, again respectfully, that in order to make a determination on the suitability of a frame for structural repair you should be adequately qualified in the field of composite repairs.

As laymen we deal unquestioningly with doctors diagnosing and treating our health, because they're specialists.

If a qualified composite repair specialist says something can be repaired safely, then surely they deserve that same courtesy?

 

Obviously I say all of this without considering the context of what-you-pay-for versus what-you-get in terms of insurance. That's a completely different topic. I, as a carbon repair specialist am approached by insurance to provide quotations on repair costs and this I do honestly and fairly. My company has however been victimised by irate insured cyclists a few times, as they pursue their goal of having their bike replaced instead of repaired. I can tell you, it's not fun...

 

The only issue arises when the original 5 year warranty on the bike is no longer valid as its been repaired, so if you damage a fork and repaired, then the chain stay snaps - cant claim warranty. 

 

Nothing to do with the carbon repair company, I think its unfair the insurance company even includes you in that convo with client.

[Capricorn]

The thing is, and I say this most respectfully, is that what I've read here amounts mostly to unqualified and inexpert opinion.

I submit, again respectfully, that in order to make a determination on the suitability of a frame for structural repair you should be adequately qualified in the field of composite repairs.

As laymen we deal unquestioningly with doctors diagnosing and treating our health, because they're specialists.

If a qualified composite repair specialist says something can be repaired safely, then surely they deserve that same courtesy?

 

Obviously I say all of this without considering the context of what-you-pay-for versus what-you-get in terms of insurance. That's a completely different topic. I, as a carbon repair specialist am approached by insurance to provide quotations on repair costs and this I do honestly and fairly. My company has however been victimised by irate insured cyclists a few times, as they pursue their goal of having their bike replaced instead of repaired. I can tell you, it's not fun...

I dont know, hence i'm asking: what qualification do carbon repairers hold and how is it obtained? You used specialists and doctors as an analogy, so i'm expecting at least a 6 years of comparably serious study.

[LongDonkey]

Recently had a frame crack and insurer paid out. It is a MTB on the seat post between rocker and BB. I used to bomb it on downhills and loved the bike. I still have frame and as its alu, and i can prob repair it. But I will never ride it the same again, there will always be the niggling thought in my mind, "when will it break again?". If i did repair, i would only ride like a granny on the Spruit, which is a hijack risk now so i would be kinda poked.....

[DJR]

I dont know, hence i'm asking: what qualification do carbon repairers hold and how is it obtained? You used specialists and doctors as an analogy, so i'm expecting at least a 6 years of comparably serious study.

And even then, MANY a time their professional opinions get questioned. Sometimes with good reason. A second or a third opinion is often not a bad thing at all. I can't see that doing it for a seriously ill carbon frame should be any different.

Edited November 27, 2019 by DJR

[Carbon Ninja]

Simple question, in this specific case will the insured rider be in the same position as before his crash? Will the frame weigh the same, look the same etc etc?

In this specific case, the way that I would repair it would result in stiffness and strength being the same as or slightly more than the original, aesthetics would be restored to original quality and the mass of the frame would increase by 50g or so.

So by that metric, no, the owner is no longer in the same position by 1 of four factors.

[Carbon Ninja]

The only issue arises when the original 5 year warranty on the bike is no longer valid as its been repaired, so if you damage a fork and repaired, then the chain stay snaps - cant claim warranty.

 

Nothing to do with the carbon repair company, I think its unfair the insurance company even includes you in that convo with client.

Insurers don't involve me with the client, in fact I often don't ever know who the client is. On the odd occasion that the insurer does involve me directly in client discussions, you're exactly right, it's not fair and always unpleasant. The owner often thinks that I'm working with insurance against him, which is patently not the case.

[leeubok]

Don't you have the possibility of a conflict of interests when giving an opinion and quote on a repair ?

Remember , the test is not whether you have a conflict or not , but if there is a possibility of a conflict .

 

Just a question. Does a LBS not also have a possible conflict of interest here, as they are selling a new frame which the insurance is paying for? Surely a LBS would rather replace a frame than send the business to a repairer?

[Carbon Ninja]

I dont know, hence i'm asking: what qualification do carbon repairers hold and how is it obtained? You used specialists and doctors as an analogy, so i'm expecting at least a 6 years of comparably serious study.

I can only speak for myself. I hold a Bachelors degree in mechanical engineering and five years of post graduate specialisation in composite processing, prototyping, process development and repair.

 

There is some really poor work going on that is proudly posted on social media (locally and internationally). Some of you may know that I got into some legal hot water recently calling out some poor workmanship on a public platform. (OK, shouldn't have done it like that but I feel I have a responsibility).

 

I fully agree with the suggestion that we be accredited and graded and quality checked by an external auditing body.