Year model is important folks!!

[justinafrika]

1 hour ago, Me rida my bicycle said:

I have seen so many bikes with the wrong year model and even some with no year model.

The age does make a difference in the value, some people might think or have been told wrong but alot know it's worth more if it's newer and just ly 🤥 

How’s my luck, had the contrary happen.  Bought a much better specced 2021 bike on here that was advertised as a 2020 version.  Even after I pointed it out, seller still agreed to some off his price.  Booooonus!

!

[440MTB]

On 8/25/2023 at 6:06 PM, Dicky DQ said:

Strange, I think this is a bit of a strange way to look at a bike. What the hell does the year matter? I did the 361 this year and got 830km out of a brand new drive train, What good is the year model now?

You are talking about the frame year model. Erm this is the thing that gets the least wear and tear. I would be more interested in the state of the drive train and the fork and shock. To be honest a bike is the sum of its parts. The age of the frame is of no consequence at all.

Donder the mind boggels....

Go look at a 2016 Stumpjumper and a 2023 Stumpy, tell me again the frame makes no difference... geometry and design is completely different... most bikes go through geometry changes to keep with trends, as bikes become slacker, and longer (referring to trail/enduro bikes here).

Another expample, some older bikes would come with 2x or 3x, and have some dedicated tab welded to the frame for the front derailleur, where the newer models wich are 1x won't have said dedicated mount (older silverbacks as an example).

Also, like people mentioned... frame fatigue is a thing... maybe if you just ride melow trails/gravel roads or are a roadie, not as much of a concern, but if you ride mostly black and red trails with a trail/enduro bike, that frame takes a beating on stuff like Jonkershoek, etc, and may have issues if really abused. Pyga even offer a respray and frame reconditioning (baking at specific temp) to combat said issue.

Also, if wheels haven't been replaced/upgraded, you may sit with issues with bikes running cup & cone bearings where the races are worn, and you'll need to replace the hubs, and rebuild the wheels, etc. vs newer models possibly coming with better wheels running sealed cartridge bearings, etc.

Lots of factors which could be affected by year model in my opinion...

The topic also isn't about price or specs, it's about the year model, none of my bikes I've had over the last 2 years had the stock/original parts, but it was still important to know the overall year model.

Cheers!

 

[Scary Rider]

On 8/25/2023 at 5:36 PM, Hairy said:

The biggest advantage with the user comments on adds, was also the biggest flaw with users comments on adds.

But, jokes aside, it was actually one of the threads where I learnt the most about technical and mechanical detail, even if things were a bit, uhm,hectic, at times. 

[Barry]

28 minutes ago, 440MTB said:

Go look at a 2016 Stumpjumper and a 2023 Stumpy, tell me again the frame makes no difference... geometry and design is completely different... most bikes go through geometry changes to keep with trends, as bikes become slacker, and longer (referring to trail/enduro bikes here).

Another expample, some older bikes would come with 2x or 3x, and have some dedicated tab welded to the frame for the front derailleur, where the newer models wich are 1x won't have said dedicated mount (older silverbacks as an example).

Also, like people mentioned... frame fatigue is a thing... maybe if you just ride melow trails/gravel roads or are a roadie, not as much of a concern, but if you ride mostly black and red trails with a trail/enduro bike, that frame takes a beating on stuff like Jonkershoek, etc, and may have issues if really abused. Pyga even offer a respray and frame reconditioning (baking at specific temp) to combat said issue.

Also, if wheels haven't been replaced/upgraded, you may sit with issues with bikes running cup & cone bearings where the races are worn, and you'll need to replace the hubs, and rebuild the wheels, etc. vs newer models possibly coming with better wheels running sealed cartridge bearings, etc.

Lots of factors which could be affected by year model in my opinion...

The topic also isn't about price or specs, it's about the year model, none of my bikes I've had over the last 2 years had the stock/original parts, but it was still important to know the overall year model.

Cheers!

 

Cup and cone are still used in high-end wheels. The new Campagnolo Bora disc have cup and cone.

[michaelbiker]

I find shops do this a lot too and sometimes sellers here can be forgiven because a store didn’t make it clear when they sold the bike that it’s older stock. People end up listing it according to the year they bought it, not the year it was released.
 

This happened to me a few years back where I didn’t do enough research - I was blinded by the new bike mist. It didn’t make a big difference to me since the model was still current but it would have been nice to know at the time. 

[PhilipV]

13 hours ago, 440MTB said:

Go look at a 2016 Stumpjumper and a 2023 Stumpy, tell me again the frame makes no difference... geometry and design is completely different... most bikes go through geometry changes to keep with trends, as bikes become slacker, and longer (referring to trail/enduro bikes here).

Another expample, some older bikes would come with 2x or 3x, and have some dedicated tab welded to the frame for the front derailleur, where the newer models wich are 1x won't have said dedicated mount (older silverbacks as an example).

Also, like people mentioned... frame fatigue is a thing... maybe if you just ride melow trails/gravel roads or are a roadie, not as much of a concern, but if you ride mostly black and red trails with a trail/enduro bike, that frame takes a beating on stuff like Jonkershoek, etc, and may have issues if really abused. Pyga even offer a respray and frame reconditioning (baking at specific temp) to combat said issue.

Also, if wheels haven't been replaced/upgraded, you may sit with issues with bikes running cup & cone bearings where the races are worn, and you'll need to replace the hubs, and rebuild the wheels, etc. vs newer models possibly coming with better wheels running sealed cartridge bearings, etc.

Lots of factors which could be affected by year model in my opinion...

The topic also isn't about price or specs, it's about the year model, none of my bikes I've had over the last 2 years had the stock/original parts, but it was still important to know the overall year model.

Cheers!

 

Caveat Emptor. Those are all things that a buyer will pick up if he does his due diligence properly when checking out a new bike. 

If you are throwing down a couple of thousand on a second hand bike , at least google the spec to see what it shipped with to see where it has been upgraded/ fixed. Then you’ll see if the guy is selling a 2017 instead of a 2019. A design change a la stumpjumper is glaringly obvious, but a color change on the same generation bike will require some digging in the bike archives.

If the bike was rallied around Jonkers weekly, then it will bear the chip marks, and crash marks, where a gravel grinder’s bike won’t. If it was looked after properly, you’ll see it. If it has cups and come bearings, you’ll see it in the spec sheets, and adjust offer accordingly. 

[Hairy]

13 minutes ago, PhilipV said:

Caveat Emptor. Those are all things that a buyer will pick up if he does his due diligence properly when checking out a new bike. 

If you are throwing down a couple of thousand on a second hand bike , at least google the spec to see what it shipped with to see where it has been upgraded/ fixed. Then you’ll see if the guy is selling a 2017 instead of a 2019. A design change a la stumpjumper is glaringly obvious, but a color change on the same generation bike will require some digging in the bike archives.

If the bike was rallied around Jonkers weekly, then it will bear the chip marks, and crash marks, where a gravel grinder’s bike won’t. If it was looked after properly, you’ll see it. If it has cups and come bearings, you’ll see it in the spec sheets, and adjust offer accordingly. 

Let's just take a moment to appreciate that many riders out there on rather decent spec bikes, clearly know their bikes brand name, then often know the model, not often know the range in the model naming and too few know the overall specs of the drivetrain, wheels and components on the bike they are currently riding.

Edited August 27, 2023 by Hairy

[Titan Racing Bikes]

Not sure if it's been said, but most people are more familiar with car model years and how that gets used. In the auto industry, a car is the MY (model year) that it first gets registered, and when there is a mid-life update, we talk about pre- or post-facelift. Using the VW T-Cross as an example; in 2024 you will be able to buy a NEW MY24 VW T-Cross that is both "new" and "old" versions thanks to a mid-life facelift. It seems the general public somehow gets a bit confused here. Some, conveniently so! 😎

At Titan Racing, we have gone to a two-year model cycle, which means the MY22 and MY23 Cypher range is exactly the same. (Even though some shops use the model year it was first introduced, we're working to fix that. )

Santa Cruz only updated their frames every 3-5 years depending on the model, even the colors stay largely the same year-on-year the last time we checked. The same with Ibis. So there the MY model does not apply, what is more relevant is the year it was first bought as new. Unless of course the MY22 gets replaced with a new model (new molds) then a Ripley is not a Ripley anymore. Confusing, see?!
 

Basically what we need is MY_XX and the year of first registration to have an idea of how old a bike really is. 

[Hilton.]

Cycle-lab are selling both the MY23 and MY22 Orbea Oiz dual-sus MTBs. They look sooo similar, it's really hard to tell them apart. You gotta look closely at the swing link for the rear shock. Almost all customers wouldn't be able to tell the difference.

On the website, they have the Model Year clearly displayed, but on their ongoing Sale brochure, they definitely don't show the year. And on the showroom floor, I bet it's up to the savvy customer to ask.

Geometry for the new FY23 is significantly different (read Better) than the previous year, with travel now defaulting to 120mm and head- and seat-tube angles much slacker. Which will help all MTBers handle rougher trails with more confidence.

2022:

2023:

 

[Jono]

On 8/27/2023 at 8:49 AM, PhilipV said:

Caveat Emptor. Those are all things that a buyer will pick up if he does his due diligence properly when checking out a new bike. 

If you are throwing down a couple of thousand on a second hand bike , at least google the spec to see what it shipped with to see where it has been upgraded/ fixed. Then you’ll see if the guy is selling a 2017 instead of a 2019. A design change a la stumpjumper is glaringly obvious, but a color change on the same generation bike will require some digging in the bike archives.

If the bike was rallied around Jonkers weekly, then it will bear the chip marks, and crash marks, where a gravel grinder’s bike won’t. If it was looked after properly, you’ll see it. If it has cups and come bearings, you’ll see it in the spec sheets, and adjust offer accordingly. 

Pretty much this ☝️

If you're buying a bike do your homework. Even if its from a shop. The sales guy might not know better, or worse, know but lie to make the sale. Surely this happens? 

It can legit be confusing, the new Tarmac is a 2024 model, that you can buy in 2023, 2024 and probably still in 2025. 

In an ideal world seller should say something like 2024 model purchased in 2023 or whichever way it happened. 

If it matters to you and you want to be absolutely sure what you're buying, ask for a pic of the serial number and contact manufacturer.

[Hairy]

1 hour ago, Jono said:

Pretty much this ☝️

If you're buying a bike do your homework. Even if its from a shop. The sales guy might not know better, or worse, know but lie to make the sale. Surely this happens? 

It can legit be confusing, the new Tarmac is a 2024 model, that you can buy in 2023, 2024 and probably still in 2025. 

In an ideal world seller should say something like 2024 model purchased in 2023 or whichever way it happened. 

If it matters to you and you want to be absolutely sure what you're buying, ask for a pic of the serial number and contact manufacturer.

Interesting point RE serial numbers .... should it possibly become compulsory to post the serial no. on all bike ads? 

[Ozzie NL]

On 8/25/2023 at 3:34 PM, Rudii said:

To add to the discussion: How do you date a bike that has been upgraded? I have a 2017 Spark 910 but drivetrain is 2022 XT 12spd. Is the frame date the overriding factor?

Simple: you specify the correct year for the frame and drive train separately .... see the different line items in Hub ads

[Jewbacca]

14 minutes ago, Ozzie NL said:

Simple: you specify the correct year for the frame and drive train separately .... see the different line items in Hub ads

SCRAM XX01 Force 2 x 10 on a Merido?

'Most' of you guys commenting here are bike nerds. You spend way too much time looking at geo updates, bike model upgrades, spec etc.

If someone is willing to spend money on a bike without knowing or checking it's geometry and spec, the reality is that said Geometry and Spec is not likely to influence that person or their riding.

If the bike works, it will likely work for those buying with no knowledge.

A 2016 Spez still rode trails sufficiently. It didn't suddenly become impossible to ride because the model got revamped.

These things are important to you guys, the smallest segment of bike users. To most? Yeah nah....

Let it go. The classifieds runs more than fine without having to make things compulsory or making it more confusing for people who simply don't care. Buyers and sellers.

To understand that most people using the Forums on this site are NOT the majority of bike riders or buyers/sellers is the first step in realising that really, of the 500000000 ads, very few are a complete shambles. Making more rules, more restraints etc to place adverts to appease a minority is not the way to make anything 'better'

Anyway, that's how I see it. I am not anti establishment, but having to tick 55 boxes just to post my old bike for sale would piss me off

[Ozzie NL]

13 minutes ago, Jewbacca said:

SCRAM XX01 Force 2 x 10 on a Merido?

'Most' of you guys commenting here are bike nerds. You spend way too much time looking at geo updates, bike model upgrades, spec etc.

If someone is willing to spend money on a bike without knowing or checking it's geometry and spec, the reality is that said Geometry and Spec is not likely to influence that person or their riding.

If the bike works, it will likely work for those buying with no knowledge.

A 2016 Spez still rode trails sufficiently. It didn't suddenly become impossible to ride because the model got revamped.

These things are important to you guys, the smallest segment of bike users. To most? Yeah nah....

Let it go. The classifieds runs more than fine without having to make things compulsory or making it more confusing for people who simply don't care. Buyers and sellers.

To understand that most people using the Forums on this site are NOT the majority of bike riders or buyers/sellers is the first step in realising that really, of the 500000000 ads, very few are a complete shambles. Making more rules, more restraints etc to place adverts to appease a minority is not the way to make anything 'better'

Anyway, that's how I see it. I am not anti establishment, but having to tick 55 boxes just to post my old bike for sale would piss me off

I was answering a question, not trying to piss over your battery

[hansolo]

On 8/25/2023 at 6:07 PM, Nick said:

Please report them. With some info on the correct year model to help us out.

Couldn't agree more!

I once engaged with someone just assuming a bike without any stickers was a Rocky Mountain. What do I get for my "help", this... 

"In the future when you share your opinion on a bike, please make sure you have some facts."

Coming from the guy that had no idea what bike he was selling this was bold. In future I'll just report ads as fraudulent and be on my merry way. Another lesson learnt, don't comment on pricing, what you are willing to pay is not always "market value" as seen by the seller or some clueless insurance broker...

 

Edited August 30, 2023 by hansolo

[jd3]

On 8/25/2023 at 3:26 PM, 440MTB said:

Bit late on a Friday... but thought I'd start up a typical "get your panties in a bunch Friday thread", so here goes... 😁🙃

I'm not sure how you guys feel... but I personally get EXTREMELY annoyed when sellers put bikes up as a year model which it definitely isn't...

I personally experienced this with a Scott Spark 910 that was sold to me as a 2019 (granted, I was ignorant/over eager, and didn't do enough research, so can't blame anyone other than myself for buying it...), and later when I tried selling it again, I realized it's actually a 2017 model, which bit me in the rear-end, and Iost a fair bit more than I thought I would've, because I had to now try sell a bike that was 2 years older than I initially thought... 😖🫣

I recently noticed a few bikes being sold as newer models than what they actually are... to you sirs, and or madams doing this... BE LEKKER please, don't be crooks, it's really not too difficult doing a bit of googling to make sure you've got the year model listed. 💩🫵

So with that said... have at thee! ☠️💋

...and have a GREAT weekend! 🤙😎

Cheers! 

I am not sure how it works with other brands of bikes, with specialized if you can get the serial number of the bike, (WSBC#########) you can contact any specialized dealer and they would be able to look the serial number up and give you the year model and exact spec the bike was originally produced with, they may even be able to give you the SKU/Part number of the bike and you might even be able to look the bike up in the archives on specialized.com. Im sure the other bike brands would be able to help in a similar manner.