DieselnDust Posted October 9, 2018 Share Having his blood bag there, not just a chat. We know that? the identity of the riders whose bags were captured has not been revealed to date.If this is incorrect please direct me to the correct information Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pure Savage Posted October 9, 2018 Share We know that? the identity of the riders whose bags were captured has not been revealed to date.If this is incorrect please direct me to the correct informationValverde and Ullrich were linked to the blood evidence through DNA testing. They tested his DNA from passport to the bags in the freezer. Which also had signs of EPO in it as well. Basso bags did not have epo intern and DieselnDust 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spinnekop Posted October 9, 2018 Share semantics I know but lets just rewind to the Valverde being caught script... "Cas said its panel of three arbitrators decided by a 2-1 majority that Valverde broke anti-doping rules four years ago.The court refused a UCI and Wada request to annul Valverde's results from recent seasons but he has been disqualified from all events this season and asked to reimburse his prize money."The Cas considered there was no evidence that any of the results obtained by Valverde prior to 1 January, 2010 was through doping infraction," the court said.Valverde never tested positive for a banned drug but was linked to the doping ring by DNA evidence seized by police in raids on the Madrid clinic of doctor Eufemiano Fuentes.Yesterday's verdict came hours after Valverde retained his top spot in the UCI's world rankings. The UCI said it would immediately modify the rankings, placing Australia's Cadel Evans at No1.Valverde becomes the first top Spanish rider to be punished using Operación Puerto evidence, which drove the 1997 Tour de France winner and Olympic gold medallist Jan Ullrich into retirement and led to a two-year ban for the Italian rider, Ivan Basso." Basically he got nailed for being in Fuentes office at some point..Hardly Armstrong levels of doping activities here. Until they release the operation Puerto files I'm just going to say "Chapeau! great race and enjoy that lekker jersey!"I get the idea you just post **** on here to provoke comment and reply. WTF dude? Or are you just THAT gullible? Edited October 9, 2018 by Spinnekop FootballingCyclist, Patchelicious, Andrew Steer and 3 others 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DieselnDust Posted October 9, 2018 Share I get the idea you just post **** on here to provoke comment and reply. WTF dude? Or are you just THAT gullible? Are we playing by the rules or just witch hunting when it suits us? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew Steer Posted October 9, 2018 Share There's definitely different levels of dopers... You get the denialist/bully/unrepentant types - Lance/Valverde/Vino And then you get the guys who say sorry, try amend, do their time in quiet etc - Ullrich/Millar/Basso Whole lot easier to welcome the latter back, and especially when they don't improve despite no longer doping...Everyone's entitled to their own view, but for me, I don't like that Valverde won, or that Vino won while we're at it. Feel free to support people who are rightfully scrutinized - Me I will find someone else among the many athletes worthy of my praise. DieselnDust, eddy, GaryvdM and 1 other 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
geomark Posted October 9, 2018 Share There's definitely different levels of dopers... You get the denialist/bully/unrepentant types - Lance/Valverde/Vino And then you get the guys who say sorry, try amend, do their time in quiet etc - Ullrich/Millar/Basso Whole lot easier to welcome the latter back, and especially when they don't improve despite no longer doping... Everyone's entitled to their own view, but for me, I don't like that Valverde won, or that Vino won while we're at it. Feel free to support people who are rightfully scrutinized - Me I will find someone else among the many athletes worthy of my praise.Bespoke has done a good podcast looking at the different angles/opinions/feelings over Valverde's win and how some ex dopers are given public acceptance and others aren't, the different prejudices/reactions it engenders in different cultures (think Spanish authorities trying to have Valverde's back for years vs British and German reactions to their nationals being caught). https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/p02pcb42/episodes/downloads DieselnDust and Andrew Steer 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DieselnDust Posted October 9, 2018 Share There's definitely different levels of dopers... You get the denialist/bully/unrepentant types - Lance/Valverde/Vino And then you get the guys who say sorry, try amend, do their time in quiet etc - Ullrich/Millar/Basso Whole lot easier to welcome the latter back, and especially when they don't improve despite no longer doping... Everyone's entitled to their own view, but for me, I don't like that Valverde won, or that Vino won while we're at it. Feel free to support people who are rightfully scrutinized - Me I will find someone else among the many athletes worthy of my praise. agreed, At no point did I state I support Valverde, or am a fan of his. I'm not. I was rooting for Dumoullin.However, Valverde served his ban from 2010-2012 and rode a great race to win the rainbow stripes. Love him or hate him it was a great race and that no one can deny.At the end of the day the sport of cycling is bigger than a doper who will eventually be forgotten. I'm not going to deny myself the enjoyment of a great race because the guys a convicted doper.He doesn't have that much power Knersboy 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NotSoBigBen Posted October 9, 2018 Share I get the idea you just post **** on here to provoke comment and reply. WTF dude? Or are you just THAT gullible?I would guess for both of those reasons ..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MJ the Expat Posted October 9, 2018 Share Wasn’t Nene caught doping at Saxonwold? Ramrod and peetwindhoek 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DieselnDust Posted October 9, 2018 Share And he’s out to be replaced by Tito Popit 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jakkals. Posted October 9, 2018 Share There's definitely different levels of dopers... You get the denialist/bully/unrepentant types - Lance/Valverde/Vino And then you get the guys who say sorry, try amend, do their time in quiet etc - Ullrich/Millar/Basso Whole lot easier to welcome the latter back, and especially when they don't improve despite no longer doping... Everyone's entitled to their own view, but for me, I don't like that Valverde won, or that Vino won while we're at it. Feel free to support people who are rightfully scrutinized - Me I will find someone else among the many athletes worthy of my praise. Sorry did you say Millar? Millar? nee f bra, daai ou is n ....In your mind there might be different levels of dopers, but actually there arent...they are all the same. dopers, just like Impey, Schoeman & Froome. Almal is dieselfde. Edited October 9, 2018 by Jakkals. Velouria 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shebeen Posted October 9, 2018 Share What gets me is that a huge proportion of SA elite mtbers have been pinged.Way way more than the global average. So let's look at the Epic, our big evenet for the year that attracts the world's best to our backgarden. the list of south african finishers in top 5 at cape epic since 2006 (no results on epic site for first 2 events, must have been hand timed then!) place kevin evans '08 3 david george 3 kevin evans '09 4 david george 4 burry stander '10 2 kevin evans 3 burry stander '11 1 burry stander '12 1 kevin evans 2 david george 2 phllip buys '14 5 phllip buys '15 5 mathys beukes 5 max knox '17 4 burry was a freak.take out the convicted dopers{max knox has been mentioned on this thread as rider #3, so let's just put an asterisk there} and then our highest finish for our own race in the last 13 years is 5th.Are our guys really that bad?are the overseas pros just better? The only other elite guy who I can remember to have been pinged is Roel Paullisen the list of south african finishers in top 5 at cape epic since 2006 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skubarra Posted October 9, 2018 Share What gets me is that a huge proportion of SA elite mtbers have been pinged.Way way more than the global average.Huh? That huge proportion you are highlighting are 2 riders? From the same team... You can't read anything into that with such a small sample size. DieselnDust, Danger Dassie and Popit 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SwissVan Posted October 9, 2018 Share Not in my book. A dopers shadow should follow them around forever. Especially generation EPO.That’s your choice, which I understand. If I had my way there would only be life bans for convicted dopers. In reality that hardly happens, so I choose to enjoy the spectacle instead of getting bitter and twisted about stuff I have no control over. Valverde and Co put on a great race (spectacle), who knows in 5 years we might be saying the same stuff about Bardet, Woods or whoever Gen and DieselnDust 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eldron Posted October 9, 2018 Share That’s your choice, which I understand. If I had my way there would only be life bans for convicted dopers. In reality that hardly happens, so I choose to enjoy the spectacle instead of getting bitter and twisted about stuff I have no control over. Valverde and Co put on a great race (spectacle), who knows in 5 years we might be saying the same stuff about Bardet, Woods or whoeverBitter and twisted? That's a little extreme. I just like to add context to doping winners :-) Yeah - we don't know what we don't know so I cheer clean winners until they get busted then I tag doper to their name. Valverde and Floyd seem to be my only two triggers - although Floyd has paid some redemption by using his squealer money to fund a team. SwissVan and Patchelicious 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eldron Posted October 9, 2018 Share There's definitely different levels of dopers... You get the denialist/bully/unrepentant types - Lance/Valverde/Vino And then you get the guys who say sorry, try amend, do their time in quiet etc - Ullrich/Millar/Basso Whole lot easier to welcome the latter back, and especially when they don't improve despite no longer doping... Everyone's entitled to their own view, but for me, I don't like that Valverde won, or that Vino won while we're at it. Feel free to support people who are rightfully scrutinized - Me I will find someone else among the many athletes worthy of my praise.Agreed. An EPO positive and a Salbutamol houdini act are not in the same league. Support the clean - spurn the dirty is my current method.... Patchelicious 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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