Another cyclist killed...

[Mook]

Guys,

This is bad for everybody involved. Please forgive me if I am stepping on sensitive pink feet and/or toes here, BUT we as cyclists could perhaps do more to be safe.

Without generalizing, we have to think on behalf of the drunken or distracted sod behind the wheel of an approaching missile in most cases.

I ride the Bottelary road 4 times a week - mornings or afternoons and see perhaps 50-60 riders in groups or solo in a week. What I have noticed way too often are groups riding 3 abreast with number 3 on the right side of the yellow line and the entire group chirping like finches - totally oblivious to the hazard they are creating. This while taxi's and trucks are passing riders without as much as fresh air between vehicle and bicycle.

 

My heart bleeds for everybody whose lives have been ripped to shreds by this and other similar incidents, but please remember that, on a bicycle, you will never win a battle with a motor vehicle. I knew dr Koos Roux who was killed on the Bottelary road a few years ago, where a drunken $*@$* took both him and his son out from behind between the Soneike intersection and Othello retirement village. There is no ways that authorities can stop this phenomenon where people regard themselves fit to drive a vehicle after killing off 99% of their brain matter in one night.

Authorities and public transport providers in SA have very little regard or compassion for anybody on a self-driven "two-wheel contraption." We do not pay license fees or road taxes as non-cyclists would fondly argue.

 

Look after yourselves!

[Pure Savage]

Guys,

This is bad for everybody involved. Please forgive me if I am stepping on sensitive pink feet and/or toes here, BUT we as cyclists could perhaps do more to be safe.

Without generalizing, we have to think on behalf of the drunken or distracted sod behind the wheel of an approaching missile in most cases.

I ride the Bottelary road 4 times a week - mornings or afternoons and see perhaps 50-60 riders in groups or solo in a week. What I have noticed way too often are groups riding 3 abreast with number 3 on the right side of the yellow line and the entire group chirping like finches - totally oblivious to the hazard they are creating. This while taxi's and trucks are passing riders without as much as fresh air between vehicle and bicycle.

 

My heart bleeds for everybody whose lives have been ripped to shreds by this and other similar incidents, but please remember that, on a bicycle, you will never win a battle with a motor vehicle. I knew dr Koos Roux who was killed on the Bottelary road a few years ago, where a drunken $*@$* took both him and his son out from behind between the Soneike intersection and Othello retirement village. There is no ways that authorities can stop this phenomenon where people regard themselves fit to drive a vehicle after killing off 99% of their brain matter in one night.

Authorities and public transport providers in SA have very little regard or compassion for anybody on a self-driven "two-wheel contraption." We do not pay license fees or road taxes as non-cyclists would fondly argue.

 

Look after yourselves!

This incident has nothing to do with this and if you could send me any incidents of riders chatting in the yellow lane that has caused an accident? Making up facts helps nobody. 

 

Cyclists could ride single file, stop at every red robot and be perfect. Still drivers would drink, text and drive and make poor choices on when to overtake. 

 

Sorry but I disagree with your point.

[DieselnDust]

This incident has nothing to do with this and if you could send me any incidents of riders chatting in the yellow lane that has caused an accident? Making up facts helps nobody. 

 

Cyclists could ride single file, stop at every red robot and be perfect. Still drivers would drink, text and drive and make poor choices on when to overtake. 

 

Sorry but I disagree with your point.

 

 

indeed, we need to start emphasizing the rationale that vehicles that can inflict great harm must carry great responsibility and consequences. As motorists we get away with far too much in RSA. Too much emphasis on photography and too little on curbing moving violations

[Pure Savage]

indeed, we need to start emphasizing the rationale that vehicles that can inflict great harm must carry great responsibility and consequences. As motorists we get away with far too much in RSA. Too much emphasis on photography and too little on curbing moving violations

We should have laws like the UK making it mandatory for insurance even if only 3rd party. We have just given up as a society, we even have a road accident fund instead of curbing road accidents. 

 

We are a selfish car focused society.

[Pure Savage]

We should have laws like the UK making it mandatory for insurance even if only 3rd party. We have just given up as a society, we even have a road accident fund instead of curbing road accidents. 

 

We are a selfish car focused society.

No insurance, no driving. This gets more and more people registered on other databases etc so when accidents happen there is more support etc for victims.

[Jbr]

You guys seem more angry at that drunk kid than at the scums that purposely drove into one of us to steal his broken bike and phone.

 

It is a tragedy, many lives broken, unfortunately these will always happen, no matter how arsh the law is. Incidents and accidents will always happen, weather caused by alcohol, texting, or just sometimes being absolute idiots. It is very very sad but that's how it is. When I go out on the roads I always hope my luck won't put me in a position like this, sometimes I'm even the idiot putting myself in a bad position and I get out lucky, sometimes I end up in hospital for crashing on my own.

 

Anyways, my point is, yes that kid made a mistake, a big one, leading to an aweful tragedy, but he probably never got in his car thinking he was going to kill someone, he's probably devastated right now, learning the hard way that this doesn't only happen to others. He destroyed his life, the one of the people he hurt, his parents, etc... I don't see the point of debating wether he must be hanged or burnt alive or if we must change the law or whatever.

 

May the victim RIP

Edited November 16, 2020 by Jbr

[Chris_]

You guys seem more angry at that drunk kid than at the scums that purposely drove into one of us to steal his broken bike and phone.

 

It is a tragedy, many lives broken, unfortunately these will always happen, no matter how arsh the law is. Incidents and accidents will always happen, weather caused by alcohol, texting, or just sometimes being absolute idiots. It is very very sad but that's how it is. When I go out on the roads I always hope my luck won't put me in a position like this, sometimes I'm even the idiot putting myself in a bad position and I get out lucky, sometimes I end up in hospital for crashing on my own.

 

Anyways, my point is, yes that kid made a mistake, a big one, leading to an aweful tragedy, but he probably never got in his car thinking he was going to kill someone, he's probably devastated right now, learning the hard way that this doesn't only happen to others. He destroyed his life, the one of the people he hurt, his parents, etc... I don't see the point of debating wether he must be hanged or burnt alive or if we must change the law or whatever.

 

May the victim RIP

If like me, I think people are angry at the system (not necessarily the kid, but the enabling environment) for allowing it. You're right the kid has now learned a lesson, but why could they have not learned a lesson by getting arrested for 'simply' driving drunk? There are too many examples (in SA) where people end up learning a lesson at the very last step - which involves death, there should be steps before that.

 

The problem is exactly that they got into their car not thinking about killing someone. Rule of law is not a deterrent because it's not enforced. The only deterrent we have left is human life, after the fact.

[AdamA]

This is so sad, Condolences to his Family. RIP

[Shebeen]

Guys, this thread is about this incident. his family and friends could well come here.

 

There are plenty of other cycling safety threads already for the broader questions arising from this.

[DR ◣◢]

125266265_10224356779048360_6203701687212535153_o.jpg

 

Well, there are the murder's parents asking for legal advice.

 

Dont even know where to start with this.

Source?

 

Would be interesting to see the comments.

[Pure Savage]

Source?

 

Would be interesting to see the comments.

Its from legal aid on Facebook. Comments have been closed and original post deleted. 

 

Apparently there was some discussion around cyclists on roads etc that was off topic

[DR ◣◢]

Its from legal aid on Facebook. Comments have been closed and original post deleted.

 

Apparently there was some discussion around cyclists on roads etc that was off topic

Naturally the “they deserve to get run over” comments would have popped up.

 

If you can comment that another human being should suffer like that then you too are a murderer.

[EddieV]

Condolences to the family. This is tragic.

 

Although it wouldn’t help in this instance, as it is a drunk driver, I think the authorities should limit the speed on the R27 to 80km/h from 120km/h, even if only up to Atlantis. There is simply too many cyclists and pedestrians using that road to allow freeway speeds (120km/h). There is no time to react at that speed, for either the driver or the cyclist/pedestrian.

 

I’ve seen cars give way to each other, just to swerve violently back into the road as there was a pedestrian waiting for a lift on the side of that road. 120km/h is just too high for that portion of the road?

[Yyyy]

You guys seem more angry at that drunk kid than at the scums that purposely drove into one of us to steal his broken bike and phone.

 

It is a tragedy, many lives broken, unfortunately these will always happen, no matter how arsh the law is. Incidents and accidents will always happen, weather caused by alcohol, texting, or just sometimes being absolute idiots. It is very very sad but that's how it is. When I go out on the roads I always hope my luck won't put me in a position like this, sometimes I'm even the idiot putting myself in a bad position and I get out lucky, sometimes I end up in hospital for crashing on my own.

 

Anyways, my point is, yes that kid made a mistake, a big one, leading to an aweful tragedy, but he probably never got in his car thinking he was going to kill someone, he's probably devastated right now, learning the hard way that this doesn't only happen to others. He destroyed his life, the one of the people he hurt, his parents, etc... I don't see the point of debating wether he must be hanged or burnt alive or if we must change the law or whatever.

 

May the victim RIP

 

 

i don't agree with the sentiment that it was an "accident and he never intended to kill anyone".

 

Countless campaigns over the years about arrive alive and driving safety specifically focusing on speeding and drunk driving and how it has taken many lives and destroyed families over the years.

 

Yes he is young but at 22 or 28 he should be mature enough to make responsible decisions.

 

If you at the age where you allowed to drink and drive then you are no longer a kid.

     

anyone at that age should understand the potential risk and consequences of deciding to take the risk of driving under the influence especially given all the campaigns against this action.

 

If i start swinging a gun in public and it goes off and shoot someone can I claim it was an accident? 

 

arguably though, the one coming at you with the intent to kill should be dealt with more severly... 

 

However i wont be joining the lynch mob as I dont believe anyone is beyond redemption. Justice needs to take its cause and ultimately he needs to pay for his crimes. 

My best hope is that he at some point in the future can make an equal positive difference in peoples lives. 

 

for the victim. May God forgive and have mercy on him grant patience to the ones he left behind 

Edited November 16, 2020 by YaseenEnos

[ChrisF]

For sure the red flashing rear light makes a difference, especially to the true accidents caused by bad visibility early morning. What it does not really help for is the blind drunk, stoned idiot texting while doing 100 in a 60 zone.

 

 

My hart goes out to these riders, their friends and family. 

 

 

 

Well said DJR

 

When I am in a car it is VERY obvious how much flashing lights on cycles helps for visibility.... for those drivers actually looking at the road ....

 

As a cyclist I use multiple flashing lights while commuting or when I cycle on tar to the trails.  Very often I notice how drivers slow down and wave me past, I would like to think the flashing lights helped these drivers to notice me.  BUT, I have had so many close encounters with absent minded drivers !!  We have all have the weaving cell phone operating drivers ... I have had a lady looking BACK fighting with her kids pull away at a stop siign right in front of me !!  I was drifting the bike and litterally stopped against the car !  "Sorry, my kids distracted me.."   

 

I know at least two Hubbers that wrote off their bikes due to absent minded drivers.  The one was back riding a week later, the other had multiple operations over a period of a year, and still is not at full strength.

 

 

 

 

And yet, there is a difference between an "absent minded driver" and a drunken driver ....  Drink driving is NOT a "mistake" !!  Same as the gent that deliberately knocked PS off his bike a few weeks ago.  These SHOULD be pursued with the full force of the law !!

 

 

 

As for parents "helping" their kids after these drink drive incidents .... saw this with an aquantance a few years ago .... early morning, driving back DRUNK, skipped a stop, wiped out a car ... Mom passed away, dad and two toddlers survived ..... the driver's family "helped" with a good lawyer .... some technicality BS, and the sod was free four days later !!      NO, he did NOT learn a thing, well nothing other than the system does not work, and he just carried on ....    

 

I know another gent .... he was caught driving under the influence, no accident, but a record.  Next he was involved in an accident while under the influence (thankfully nobody got hurt) ..... court case took almost a year.  He LEARNT his lesson !!!

 

 

If you are big enough to drink and drive, face the music !! 

[Pure Savage]

Darion Faro appeared in Atlantis Magistrates Court was charged with culpable homicide, alternative reckless negligent driving and two counts of attempted murder and driving under the influence after killing Nathier Roberts and injuring Shafiek Alexander, bail was fixed at R 5000