Future of non-cycling discussion on Bike Hub

[eddy]

8 minutes ago, Jewbacca said:

This is probably in the top 26 posts I've ever seen on bikehub.

chapeau 

I can't remember all of the other 25, but there was one about some dude who did the Argust on a BMX last time..

[Jakkals.]

The no.1 post is still how to clean your chain by Johan.

[TNT1]

2 hours ago, Karooryder said:

Probably too late and flocking a horse  
     

Why would you cover a horse in some kind of felt?

[Patchelicious]

2 minutes ago, TNT1 said:

Why would you cover a horse in some kind of felt?

They prefer the veld. 

[eala]

2 hours ago, Jewbacca said:

This is probably in the top 26 posts I've ever seen on bikehub.

chapeau 

amen!

[Plentipotential]

52 minutes ago, TNT1 said:

Why would you cover a horse in some kind of felt?

Easier to gather in flocks.

[Shebeen]

2 hours ago, Karooryder said:

How the heck did I miss this thread and this discussion. And here I thought the gradual slenderizing of the Off-Topic section was a natural progression of the BikeHub makeover.

Probably too late and flocking a horse which has become part of the archaeological record here. I have been part of the Hub community since 2012. I'm not a (very) regular contributor but I scan over the goings on of the Forum almost daily and over the past 10 years I have noticed a few things:

1. Some users are on this forum ALL THE TIME. I mean, ALL THE TIME. I'm not sure if they are paid by / employed by communications / pr agencies specializing in engaging with online public forums or if they are retired or bored or whatnot. I am amazed (if not puzzled) at the rate at which some users post, comment and reply from early morning to late night, every day, every week.
2. Some users, and very often those mentioned in 1, will only (or largely) engage in off-topic discussions. 
3. Very often these same users are also to be found causing, fueling and perpetuating online brawls and trolling in off-topic discussions. 
4. These same users - through their chronic engagement - accumulate thousands of post counts which, to the uninformed eye, might look like BikeHub street cred and giving these individuals a measure of entitlement on this forum, its management and engagements. They will often have a go at mods and instances where they gang-up on contributors with differing views with a "we as BikeHub" vs you as "noob poster" occur throughout the Off-Topic threads.

5. The above points have caused many Hubbers to stand back and even remove themselves entirely from this Forum. Over the past years we have seen valuable contributors disappear from the forum and with that, insightful contributions diminish.

Having observed the above, I would be in full support of the gradual restructuring (and if necessary unwinding) of the Off-Topic forums. Matt and the mods offer us the opportunity to be part of an online community of individuals who love all things cycling. Let it be. They are not here to oversee online kuier-sessions with general debates, discourses and brainstorms (and I absolutely agree that these are often the best!). And they are definitely not here to mitigate problematic discussions on problematic topics by problematic people.

Maybe it is time to return the Hub to what it was a few years back. And for the rest, perhaps rather power-off PC and head down to the local pub / park / bike shop for some (socially distanced) interaction with real humans.   
     

Your first sentence should end with a question mark, but maybe if you were at 1000 posts you'd know that.

ok just kidding, that would have had comic sans before. Your point 5 is the most pertinent, but it isn't that simple.  I'm cool with off topic moving round the back - the thing is this is an actual community. Yes we're all here for bike talk first, but there's other things that we want to chat about too. I could go to myBB, 4x4forum or elsewhere but it works here. Also, practically speaking, if you just shut down all off-topic NCR threads/forums, then that discussion will just permeate into the other areas and hijack threads there -  which is exactly what you don't want.

finally, I'll admit to spending way more time here than i should, but I'm not on twitter and insta and I learn things on both cycling and NCR topics, havene't been involved in a hub barnie for a while either. Pretty sure the off-topic threads generate plenty of clicks. clicks = adverts = revenue, and probably much more than the little yellow border on my avatar pic [that just sent me an sms yesterday, btw).

[Rocket-Boy]

5 minutes ago, Shebeen said:

Your first sentence should end with a question mark, but maybe if you were at 1000 posts you'd know that.

ok just kidding, that would have had comic sans before. Your point 5 is the most pertinent, but it isn't that simple.  I'm cool with off topic moving round the back - the thing is this is an actual community. Yes we're all here for bike talk first, but there's other things that we want to chat about too. I could go to myBB, 4x4forum or elsewhere but it works here. Also, practically speaking, if you just shut down all off-topic NCR threads/forums, then that discussion will just permeate into the other areas and hijack threads there -  which is exactly what you don't want.

finally, I'll admit to spending way more time here than i should, but I'm not on twitter and insta and I learn things on both cycling and NCR topics, havene't been involved in a hub barnie for a while either. Pretty sure the off-topic threads generate plenty of clicks. clicks = adverts = revenue, and probably much more than the little yellow border on my avatar pic [that just sent me an sms yesterday, btw).

3 hours ago, Karooryder said:

How the heck did I miss this thread and this discussion. And here I thought the gradual slenderizing of the Off-Topic section was a natural progression of the BikeHub makeover.

Probably too late and flocking a horse which has become part of the archaeological record here. I have been part of the Hub community since 2012. I'm not a (very) regular contributor but I scan over the goings on of the Forum almost daily and over the past 10 years I have noticed a few things:

1. Some users are on this forum ALL THE TIME. I mean, ALL THE TIME. I'm not sure if they are paid by / employed by communications / pr agencies specializing in engaging with online public forums or if they are retired or bored or whatnot. I am amazed (if not puzzled) at the rate at which some users post, comment and reply from early morning to late night, every day, every week.
2. Some users, and very often those mentioned in 1, will only (or largely) engage in off-topic discussions. 
3. Very often these same users are also to be found causing, fueling and perpetuating online brawls and trolling in off-topic discussions. 
4. These same users - through their chronic engagement - accumulate thousands of post counts which, to the uninformed eye, might look like BikeHub street cred and giving these individuals a measure of entitlement on this forum, its management and engagements. They will often have a go at mods and instances where they gang-up on contributors with differing views with a "we as BikeHub" vs you as "noob poster" occur throughout the Off-Topic threads.

5. The above points have caused many Hubbers to stand back and even remove themselves entirely from this Forum. Over the past years we have seen valuable contributors disappear from the forum and with that, insightful contributions diminish.

Having observed the above, I would be in full support of the gradual restructuring (and if necessary unwinding) of the Off-Topic forums. Matt and the mods offer us the opportunity to be part of an online community of individuals who love all things cycling. Let it be. They are not here to oversee online kuier-sessions with general debates, discourses and brainstorms (and I absolutely agree that these are often the best!). And they are definitely not here to mitigate problematic discussions on problematic topics by problematic people.

Maybe it is time to return the Hub to what it was a few years back. And for the rest, perhaps rather power-off PC and head down to the local pub / park / bike shop for some (socially distanced) interaction with real humans.   
     

I seldom even cycle anymore, but I still want to keep up with cycling news and developments, this is the perfect place for that.

The other side is the people, there are many like me who are regulars on these forums and dont cycle much. The regulars are always what keep forums going, if it was just newer members or the "I have been around for 10 years but have a post count of 200" people, well there would be nothing to read.

If this forum was just about cycling and all off topic discussions were removed then many of us would lose interest and move on.

Those of us with higher post counts are invested in these forums, we keep the activity going.

As an example, Im part of a South African home brewing forum. There are quite a few members but they dont post often. This means you can check that forum once a week for 5 mins and be fully caught up. If that was your business and you needed to sell statistics on the number of users passing through each day and user interaction, well you would have nothing to sell right? What advertiser would want to pay you for marketing when you dont have the traffic to justify it?

 

So really, what Im trying to say, is that any forum is a complex ecosystem that requires all kinds of users. The suggestion of alienating some of those users will break that ecosystem and things will eventually collapse.

 

[Stretch]

16 minutes ago, Shebeen said:

I could go to myBB, 4x4forum

and if you think the bikehub offtopic threads are toxic.......theyre pale in comparison to those.

My usage has actually declined on the offtopic threads. Not only because of the UI change, but also just because. I'm mainly in and around running, downhill and XC.

Still think diminishing off topic is a bad idea

[Sampaj]

Think members should take the forum as a group of like minded individuals and not an exclusive club. You don’t have to read, comment on everything on the site that you may or may not agree on. 
theres a lot going on around us. Keep it light. And move on to topics that interest you. 

[LongDonkey]

I also feel there is a bit of an authoritarian closing of topics that rub management up the wrong way, e.g. if you mention "comments in the classifieds section" anywhere other than its dedicated thread, they seems to go bye bye. The hub is about like minded members, with more than just an obsession about bikes only. Off topic Threads make me come back and keep a smile on my face. I find that is important these days.

 

Hate speech etc must take a long walk on a short plank which is a very different issue.

[Patchelicious]

Moderate bad members, not interesting topics.

[DJuice]

2 hours ago, Jakkals. said:

The no.1 post is still how to clean your chain by Johan.

Was here not a love story on Bikehub before the big crash.

Fond memories from that thread.

[Shebeen]

31 minutes ago, Stretch said:

and if you think the bikehub offtopic threads are toxic.......theyre pale in comparison to those.

My usage has actually declined on the offtopic threads. Not only because of the UI change, but also just because. I'm mainly in and around running, downhill and XC.

Still think diminishing off topic is a bad idea

I hang out on another forum from time to time in another sport I do. it is US based and it is WILD, but i learn a helluva lot inbetween the bullcrap. There is no moderation at all, and it sort of works. I must just not pick up any bad habits from there! the "abbreviated" rules

 

Quote

1. Don't insinuate Pedo.  Warning and or timeout for a first offense.  PermaFlick for any subsequent offenses
2. Don't out members.  See above for penalties.  Caveat:  if you have ever used your own real name or personal information here on the forums since, like, ever - it doesn't count and you are fair game.
3. If you see spam posts, report it to the mods.  We do not hang out in every thread 24/7

If you see any of the above, report it to the mods by hitting the Report button in the offending post.  

We do not take action for foul language, off-subject content, or abusive behavior unless it escalates to persistent stalking.  There may be times that we might warn someone or flick someone for something particularly egregious.  There is no standard, we will know it when we see it.  If you continually report things that do not fall into rules #1 or 2 above, you may very well get a timeout yourself for annoying the Mods with repeated whining.  Use your best judgement.

Warnings, timeouts, suspensions and flicks are arbitrary and capricious.  Deal with it.  Welcome to anarchy.  

If you are a newbie, there are unwritten rules to adhere to.  They will be explained to you soon enough.

 

 

[The Ouzo]

4 minutes ago, Shebeen said:

I hang out on another forum from time to time in another sport I do. it is US based and it is WILD, but i learn a helluva lot inbetween the bullcrap. There is no moderation at all, and it sort of works. I must just not pick up any bad habits from there! the "abbreviated" rules

 

 

a nice balance of moderated but self moderated.

Having been part of an completely non moderated forum, it worked for a while and then went sour. I like the idea above.

 

edit to add:

I've also been part of a heavily moderated forum because they had to keep the sponsors/advertisers happy, it went south VERY quickly and we promptly all left at the same time leaving the forum a ghost town with zero new posts for months at a time.

Edited June 2, 2021 by ouzo

[Chris_]

Please may we have Hot off the Press back